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Yup, and I find it ironic that the people screaming TORTURE THEM! are the ones who were hundreds or thousands of miles away when it happened.
Giuilani was never a popular person in NY, and the fact that he constantly drops 9/11 for his personal gain has made him even less liked.
Exactly.
Basically they (and Bushco) used (and are still using) the tragedy that befell New York as an excuse to trample of human rights, invade sovereign nations that had nothing to do with 9/11, and to grind the Constitution under they jackbooted heels.
Many US Army personnel, as part of their training go through waterboading. However, none will partake in having their fingernails removed, castrations, cattle prodded, hung from hooks etc. Water boarding is not torture. It amazes me how just over a couple of years the word torture has been turned upside down to mean anything uncomfortable. Bad people do need persuasion and after witnessing the events of 9-11 personally those thugs deserved much worse for murdering our wives, husbands, children, and above all-innocent American citizens!
Many US Army personnel, as part of their training go through waterboading. However, none will partake in having their fingernails removed, castrations, cattle prodded, hung from hooks etc. Water boarding is not torture. It amazes me how just over a couple of years the word torture has been turned upside down to mean anything uncomfortable.
Can you please explain why we've prosecuted and convicted people for waterboarding detainees since 1901? Is that "just a couple of years"?
Funnily enough, most of the people I have talked to who lost loved ones on 9/11 aren't out for revenge. In fact, in thinking about it for a moment, not one has expressed a desire for revenge to me. Many of them can't stand Giuliani, by the way. My career takes me to NYC and Long Island often (actually, my significant other is from Port Jefferson, on the island), and most of them wrinkle their nose at Giuliani's name being mentioned. some display outright contempt for the man. I won't even get into what they think of Bush and his handling of events post-9/11.
Quote:
Originally Posted by newtoli
Yup, and I find it ironic that the people screaming TORTURE THEM! are the ones who were hundreds or thousands of miles away when it happened.
Giuilani was never a popular person in NY, and the fact that he constantly drops 9/11 for his personal gain has made him even less liked.
Exactly true. Those efeected by it are most disgusted on how it's been handled. Remember that they will even attack the family members that lost loved ones if they speak out. Ann Coultier comes to mind.
"How many times do I have to waterboard you to get the information? 1... 2... 3... 4... -(skip over a few)- 180... 181... 182... 183- One hundred and eighty-three!"
Waterboarding is really a method of annoying someone to the point that they give up. It isn't friendy and nice, it isn't considerate of the subject's feelings, but it isn't mutilation, it isn't electrocution, it isn't murder and it isn't rape. It is saying, "we can subject you to extreme discomfort indefinitely without killing or injuring you and your voluntary debriefing is an eventuality, not a possibility."
This is a humane interrogation technique and Khalid Sheik Mohammed perceived justice very acutely 183 times in one month.
You're freakin' nuts, plus you'll eventually induce something like a herniated esophagus or maybe a heart attack in the victim.
Many US Army personnel, as part of their training go through waterboading. However, none will partake in having their fingernails removed, castrations, cattle prodded, hung from hooks etc. Water boarding is not torture. It amazes me how just over a couple of years the word torture has been turned upside down to mean anything uncomfortable. Bad people do need persuasion and after witnessing the events of 9-11 personally those thugs deserved much worse for murdering our wives, husbands, children, and above all-innocent American citizens!
Of course waterboarding is torture, whether you think so or not. The fact that so many have been tortured while under detention by the US military has dramatically increased the likelihood that scores, 100s, or thousands of Americans under detention in the future by other powers will also be tortured.
Many US Army personnel, as part of their training go through waterboading. However, none will partake in having their fingernails removed, castrations, cattle prodded, hung from hooks etc. Water boarding is not torture. It amazes me how just over a couple of years the word torture has been turned upside down to mean anything uncomfortable. Bad people do need persuasion and after witnessing the events of 9-11 personally those thugs deserved much worse for murdering our wives, husbands, children, and above all-innocent American citizens!
"Water boarding was designated as illegal by U.S. generals in Vietnam 40 years ago. A photograph that appeared in The Washington Post of a U.S. soldier involved in water boarding a North Vietnamese prisoner in 1968 led to that soldier's severe punishment. "The soldier who participated in water torture in January 1968 was court-martialed within one month after the photos appeared in The Washington Post, and he was drummed out of the Army," recounted Darius Rejali, a political science professor at Reed College.
Earlier in 1901, the United States had taken a similar stand against water boarding during the Spanish-American War when an Army major was sentenced to 10 years of hard labor for water boarding an insurgent in the Philippines."
"Republican presidential candidate John McCain reminded people Thursday that some Japanese were tried and hanged for torturing American prisoners during World War II with techniques that included waterboarding."
Many US Army personnel, as part of their training go through waterboading. However, none will partake in having their fingernails removed, castrations, cattle prodded, hung from hooks etc. Water boarding is not torture. It amazes me how just over a couple of years the word torture has been turned upside down to mean anything uncomfortable. Bad people do need persuasion and after witnessing the events of 9-11 personally those thugs deserved much worse for murdering our wives, husbands, children, and above all-innocent American citizens!
How, exactly, does making someone uncomfortable suddenly compel them to break with everything they believe and give up valuable information on their confederates?
If we give them lumpy mattresses, will they be lining up to share the details of the plots they were involved in?
Do you generally consider simulated drowning to be "uncomfortable"?
Exactly when does "uncomfortable" and "panic-inducing" share the same status?
I just wanted this link referenced in this thread.
It shows that waterboarding was being reported on in 2005. And that KSM was noted as being particularly resistant to the technique. To look at pictures of him, one wouldn't think he could hold out for two to two-and-a-half minutes when the average is 14 seconds.
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Exactly true. Those efeected by it are most disgusted on how it's been handled. Remember that they will even attack the family members that lost loved ones if they speak out. Ann Coultier comes to mind.
