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There are for sale by owners all the time, and this doesn't involve the need for a license, and there is nothing illegal. In fact, I discussed selling a home without a realtor to our real estate attorney, and he said there was no problem in doing this. Also, save paying the needless 6% commission to realtors.
It is perfectly legal to buy and sell your own property without a real estate license. It is illegal to buy and sell real estate for anyone else without a license and get compensated.
To the OP, there are just too many holes in this for me.
There is no such thing as a neighborhood where "almost all homes sell above market value." That is the very opposite of how "market value" works. The market value of homes in a neighborhood is whatever those homes are selling for. This is such a basic, fundamental concept that the thought of anyone being unaware of it terrifies me, let alone someone who wants to be trusted with hundreds of thousands of other people's dollars. That is like getting on a plane where the pilot doesn't understand the concept of gravity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by foundapeanut
Guessing you live in the midwest? Yes, what you write is true about yourself. But don't think it covers everyone. Or desirable locations. You really need to get out more. A lot of drama to get across only your opinion matters.
You obviously missed the essence of her post. The definition of "market value" doesn't vary by location. Sure, you can have an area where sale prices routinely exceed the asking prices, but those prices are market driven. If nearly all homes were to "sell above market value" (sic), that just indicates that the true market value isn't what you previously presumed.
No I didn't miss the essence of her post. (Nice try though) You might be misreading what I said. (won't be so sure that I KNOW what you are thinking. Its the internet.) StPaul thought she was the all encompassing voice of reason. In a very over dramatic way. Using a pilot not understanding gravity. Come on.
Ever since the RE fraud of the 2000's, the appraisers now (here anyway) are low balling prices people offer. They priced the house next door without the view, as if it was on the other side of the street. Buyer came to an agreement that she would pay what she offered since the view was worth it to her to pay more. The market value was not what she paid according to an appraiser. She over paid. However, the buyer paid what she thought it was worth. The neighbors without the view said she over paid, I say she got her money's worth as I share her view. Seeing this everyday, 24/7 one forgets the price.
OP- again you do have a small niche market for this tool. But this is not the crowd to be getting market info for it. See if Robb Report has a forum.
RE agent - I know they would cut into what I pay or receive. No I'd hire a real estate attorney and pay him per hour. We aren't talking the average house here.
It is a lot of work to put your home on the market. If someone comes along without it being on the market such as in the MLS listings, and has an interest in making an offer, then you don't need to go through the time and expense of getting the house ready for sale. So someone offering to cut through all that and wants to look through your house and give you a legit offer, that's a good thing.
Where I live, IMO if you don't put your house on the market you should have your head examined. It's a hot market and you can easily sell your house by just whispering in a few people's ears. However, houses that are put on the market often sell for surprisingly high amounts. Even if you have to pay an agent, spend the time cleaning up, etc. it's well worth it. We had a listing in our office this past spring that sold $221K over the asking price. That homeowner would have been happy to sell at full asking price and probably would have had they FSBO'ed. In fact, they were offered more than asking by a neighbor prior to putting their house on the market. Even though they wanted to take it, their agent advised them against it and in the end they made out like bandits.
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Originally Posted by eastcoastguyz
I know a fellow who bought a house by driving up and down the street after he lost out on a bid for a home in the area. He saw one home that wasn't on the market and decided to knock on their door. He ended up buying the house, no realtor involved at all. No signs in the yard, no open houses, no discussions and visitors from realtors. It was a good experience.
That happens. I'm sure he knocked on a lot of doors where they told him to get lost too. For every one story of success like this, I'm sure I could tell you 10 of failure.
We will vet every non binding offer and reject offers that are obviously a waste of time for the home owner. Another thing to keep in mind is that most of the neighborhoods we are targeting almost all homes sell above market value, this is because inventory is very low. There are multiple bids and when it does sell the ultimate buyer will end up paying significantly above market rate. Our platform allows them to put in their best offer and negotiate down based on inspections and appraisals and other concrete facts. This allows the owner to sell their home without the cumbersome open houses and lots of strangers going through their doors.
Quote:
Originally Posted by foundapeanut
No I didn't miss the essence of her post. (Nice try though) You might be misreading what I said. (won't be so sure that I KNOW what you are thinking. Its the internet.) StPaul thought she was the all encompassing voice of reason. In a very over dramatic way. Using a pilot not understanding gravity. Come on.
Regardless of the hyperbole, she was correct to call out a sloppily written claim. Perhaps he meant to write that all homes sell above "asking price"--as that would make sense--but to say that they all sell above market value defies the very definition of market value.
Quote:
Originally Posted by foundapeanut
Ever since the RE fraud of the 2000's, the appraisers now (here anyway) are low balling prices people offer. They priced the house next door without the view, as if it was on the other side of the street. Buyer came to an agreement that she would pay what she offered since the view was worth it to her to pay more. The market value was not what she paid according to an appraiser. She over paid. However, the buyer paid what she thought it was worth. The neighbors without the view said she over paid, I say she got her money's worth as I share her view. Seeing this everyday, 24/7 one forgets the price.
Aha! Maybe we can find some common ground here. What an appraiser does is give an estimated opinion of market value. Big difference. The more unique a property, and the more adjustments which need to be applied against comparable sales, the more variation there can be in the opinion of value. Ask three appraisers and they will likely give you three different answers. The key, however, is that they should all be within a reasonable range. That has not always been my experience. I've had appraisals done which were so wrong as to be totally worthless. I've had to pay for second appraisals on more than one occasion.
Appraisers make mistakes, or have poor judgment, just like any other professionals. Some have been known to slant their opinion in favor of the person paying for the appraisal, even though they shouldn't. Yet, it happens. And since, in your example, the client is the bank--which wants ample assurance that the collateral is sufficient to secure the loan--it is in some way understandable. Despite any protestations to the contrary, appraisers are human.
Last edited by jackmichigan; 01-27-2017 at 09:47 AM..
Guessing you live in the midwest? Yes, what you write is true about yourself. But don't think it covers everyone. Or desirable locations. You really need to get out more. A lot of drama to get across only your opinion matters.
Life is different for people who want to live in a very desirable area. If they have the cash, want the location view etc. they'll pay. VIEWS are everything. Location Location location. Years ago, we overpaid at the time for our house, cause of the view. Now there are 2 other homes in my large development that have the same view. That is it. One sold last year for $200,000 more than what we paid.
I've gotten unsolicited letters from agents and tire kickers. Big deal. Got a big life going on, I'm not interested, into the shredder. But no drama over it.
An agent my neighbors rejected told them you will never see the price you want for your house. Guess what, new agent, higher end client, bought it - full price. And they are tearing out the inside, redoing the whole house as this is now their forever home. They probably won't see what they put into it. I'm sure they don't care. They'll enjoy the home and every time they look out the window they'll forget what they paid.
There is a market for his tool. Its a small niche, yes. More the Robb Report crowd than city data.
The meaning of market value is not an opinion. According to a quick google for precise language, the most basic definition is "the amount for which something can be sold on a given market." Words and phrases have specific, set meanings and that is not just my opinion. It is definitionally impossible for "almost all homes [to] sell above market value" because the amount that those houses are selling for literally and directly defines the market value!
Houses may routinely be selling above the asking price. Houses may routinely be selling above the bank appraisal. Houses may routinely be selling above the tax appraisal. But houses will never and can never routinely be selling above the market value.
And for the record, I "get out" plenty. And guess what? We have views and hot locations and bidding wars in the Midwest, too. Our native son, the iconic Garrison Keillor, had a saying about the fictional Minnesota town of Lake Wobegon "...all the women are strong, all the men are good looking, and all the children are above average." But, you see, that last part is particularly tong-in-cheek. Because it is statistically impossible for "all the children" to be above average. All of the children can be good students. All of the children can even be straight-A students. But they cannot all be above average because an average reflects its own data set. Likewise, a neighborhood cannot exist where "almost all homes sell above market value" because what homes are selling for IS the market value.
@StPaulGal - you make a lot of great points around market value, and we need to take all of that into account.
I posted this thread with the caveat that we are working through this still, so apologize about any discrepancy. Given your feedback I think it will be much better for us to say that we can promise competitive offers. Our goal is to approve every single offer and generally not let offers that are a waste of time go through, eventually its straightforward to automate this based on data about the local market.
The one thing we dont want is for home owners, especially since they aren't necessarily looking to sell, to waste their time with terrible offers that are way below market value. In the markets we are looking to target inventory will be very low and so the point is to try to open inventory that would have otherwise never been there, to do that without the friction of open houses for the potential seller and the confidence for the buyer that this is a non binding offer just to get the conversation started.
Last edited by theolivebranch; 01-27-2017 at 03:39 PM..
In an area with a severe shortage, Sellers would be fools to not put the house on the market and see how high it will be bid up. Then they could evaluate the other criteria. Highest price is not always the best offer.
Also, open house hassles? OH's take a couple of hours on a weekend day. Go to a movie, you deserve a break.
Hello we recently built a tool that lets people put in offers on unlisted homes and would love some feedback.
Sorry, stupid idea IMO. I own my primary residence and multiple investment (rental) properties, and I already get tons of offers to buy my properties even though I have no plans to sell the properties except when I decide to sell.
My advice: Please print your offers using organic based environmentally safe ink on sanitary tissue paper, so at least I can use them for hygienic purposes.
All the world needs is another spammer.
Please use 1st class postage so I can write "delivery refused, return to sender" and cost you the price of return postage.
(The post office won't return to sender postage due on any class mail except 1st class.)
I rue the day that property tax and other owner data including phone numbers became public domain. I can't even answer my phone any more unless I recognize the CcallerID. It's always some jerk wanting to sell me something, and yes I am registered at DoNotCall.gov. The Do Not Call list is now widely ignored by telemarketers.
And no, I won't sell my house, except over my dead body. I'm happily retired and I'm not leaving my house until my spirit leaves my body.
Sorry, stupid idea IMO. I own my primary residence and multiple investment (rental) properties, and I already get tons of offers to buy my properties even though I have no plans to sell the properties except when I decide to sell.
My advice: Please print your offers using organic based environmentally safe ink on sanitary tissue paper, so at least I can use them for hygienic purposes.
All the world needs is another spammer.
Please use 1st class postage so I can write "delivery refused, return to sender" and cost you the price of return postage.
(The post office won't return to sender postage due on any class mail except 1st class.)
I rue the day that property tax and other owner data including phone numbers became public domain. I can't even answer my phone any more unless I recognize the CcallerID. It's always some jerk wanting to sell me something, and yes I am registered at DoNotCall.gov. The Do Not Call list is now widely ignored by telemarketers.
And no, I won't sell my house, except over my dead body. I'm happily retired and I'm not leaving my house until my spirit leaves my body.
Your idea suxx.
Tell us how you really feel.
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A lot of drama to get across only your opinion matters. 
Come on. 
