(from a guy who is currently working)What's so bad about unemployed guys for dating? (wife, movies)
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I myself am currently in a relationship and earning money so I am doing well. Out of the various male friends I know, they vary from broke unemployed to someone who was one of the dotcom success stories. Out of the various assortment of people I know, a few are unemployed. Others are earning money right now, but were unemployed in the past. Of everyone I know male and female, young and old, unemployment was experienced at some time in their lives. (With the exception of people who started working for the government right after graduation and doing nothing else.) When I sat at some time,it ranges from being a chronically unemployed loser to a Millionaire uncle who 30 years ago was unemployed for a year when he had to change industries. He is now 60 and very very wealthy (glad he found the right industry). My blue collar father worked hard to provide for us but was out of work several times due too union strikes.
I am glad that I am not unemployed and that I am in a relationship, because from what I hear from my male buddies ( whether primary stories or secondary stories) women run like the plague in America when they hear that a guy is not working.
My question is, why is it so awful if a guy is not currently working when a woman meets him. What is the big deal about whether or not someone is currently working.
Does it matter:
1. Whether they are broke like many unemployed people or happen to be somone who already paid off their house and has a mid-high six figure pot of money like some laid off executives. (Some high level executives and professionals get very good buyout packages)?
2. Does it matter if they have an awful work history with no chance of every getting a decent job or whether they have a great track record, were laid off due to some big picture company situation (like an executive changing of the guard) and will get a new job in several months?
3. Does it matter if they are living hand to mouth or if they like a friend of a friend are someone who made 500,000 when the startup they worked for was bought out by Google and are now exploring Africa for a few months?
4. Does it matter if they just were lazy bums at work or if like a teacher or social worker, they might have truly changed many lives and made a contribution to society before they got laid off?
5. Does it matter if they are long term bums or if they are using savings to take time off to travel, study, volunteer, or start a new business? My future wife comes from Australia where after college and every decade or two many many people take a few months off to travel or volunteer.
6. Does it matter if they were fired for being lazy at work or if they left like someone I know did for ethical reasons? I have a friend who is a campaign media person and did not like the direction a political campaign was taking for ethical reasons.
Of course there are many levels in between. For instance in between a seven figure severance buyout executive and a totally broke unemployed person their are middle class unemployed people that have a home and maybe 20,000 to 70,000 in savings.
I just think that it is ironic for many people who have great qualities and even have money put away might be unemployed voluntarily or involuntarily for vey legimate reasons to have zero dating market value regardless of their indvidual circumstances.
From what I have heard women will run like the plague from a guy not working and be so impressed if a guy has a prestigous title like lawyer.
Why should the deadbeat never had a job unemployed person, the normal middle class unemployed person that with much effort will get a job eventually and has a decent work ethic, the person who is unemployed but happens to have money from a buyout and has their home paid off ( probaly also has the great track record to start working again real soon), and the person taking time off to travel or volunteer overseas be all lumped together?
Why should the small practice lawyer with 250,000 in debt from an expensive but second tier law school who is struggling for clients, the average lawyer working for the govenrment with a normal middle class income, the lawyer earning an upper middle class income in a respected corporate law firm and a wealthy but sleazy independent personal injury lawyer all be lumped together.
I would truly be interested in your thoughts on this matter.
I believe the job situation has everything to do with the age you are and how your perspective is... At my age, a job, a pension and health care plan is way TOO important... when you're young jobs are not too hard to get... as you age you have less and less offers... yes there is age discrimination ... imagine that ..... I'm at the stage of my life where I am planning for retirement. I've worked hard, put away in 401ks, have a state pension and will have a pension from where I work now... why would I want to take on someone without a hope of ever getting a full time job, that doesn't have a 401k, no pension?? I do not have enough set aside for two... financial issues are the number 1 reason that most couples fight... going into a relationship that financial issues already exist is just plain crazy... they say love is blind.... I say past 50... TAKE THOSE BLINDERS OFF!!
I dated a man recently who was not employed. He is on disability, and has been for about 3 years. Plus, he has a felony record for Real Estate Scam he was involved in. So, both those things hold him back from work. plus, he is dead set on trying to do Real Estate again, when the chances of that are slim because of the scam he was involved in.
It started slowly, but I ended up paying for everything. I bought him stuff when he neeeded it, such as a printer/fax for computer, hard drive, camera, Mp3 player, clothes, sneakers, groceries, picked up (and paid for) some of his medication. If we went out to dinner, i paid. If we went ANYWHERE that had a fee for entrance (movies, festivals, etc.) i paid. I even paid for tailoring to some of his clothes that he got from thirft stores because they were too big.
He had no car, so i drove everywhere in my not so great 1999 Hyundai. The worst part is this man appreciated NOTHING. Money was, and is, very tight for me right now. But, i helped him out the best i could, and the more i did, the more he wanted to take. We have now broken up. I will NEVER, EVER, date a man who is not working.
If you are not employed, money has to be hard to come by. So, how can you contribute to the relationship? Just doing the simplest things together cost money sometimes. My opinion is, and this would be based on a case by case scenario..but i feel if you are not employed, you should focus on getting yourself straight in that department before you start dating again. I do not think it is fair to ask someone you just met to have to pay for EVERYTHING. I am a woman, and I NEVER expect a man to have to pay for everything when we date. I will most definitely do my share of paying, or contributing. Im far from a gold digger, as must be evident by all the stuff i did for this man.
But, it really made me feel used, which i probably was being used to a point. And after doing all this, do you know one of the last things he said to me? He said I was, and i quote "****ing selfish" because we were going on a weekend trip that i paid for, ( he wasnt gonna have to pay for a thing..food..nothing) and he wanted to sit up in the hotel room and study some real estate book that he had been putting off doing. Of all times, NOW he wanted to study. I told him this was supposed to be a vacation in the mountains with some friends of mine, a hiking vacation. No one was gonna be in their hotel rooms. So, i was called "****ing selfish". After all i did for this man. Plus the fact he has no job, and has all the time in the world to study..but didnt. But, NOW he wanted to start..on my vacation.
And I'M the selfish one.
No, im totally gun shy right now about dating a man that has no job. Never again, unless we are ALREADY together and he loses his job. Thats a bit of a different circumstance.
I dated a man recently who was not employed. He is on disability, and has been for about 3 years. Plus, he has a felony record for Real Estate Scam he was involved in. So, both those things hold him back from work. plus, he is dead set on trying to do Real Estate again, when the chances of that are slim because of the scam he was involved in.
It started slowly, but I ended up paying for everything. I bought him stuff when he neeeded it, such as a printer/fax for computer, hard drive, camera, Mp3 player, clothes, sneakers, groceries, picked up (and paid for) some of his medication. If we went out to dinner, i paid. If we went ANYWHERE that had a fee for entrance (movies, festivals, etc.) i paid. I even paid for tailoring to some of his clothes that he got from thirft stores because they were too big.
He had no car, so i drove everywhere in my not so great 1999 Hyundai. The worst part is this man appreciated NOTHING. Money was, and is, very tight for me right now. But, i helped him out the best i could, and the more i did, the more he wanted to take. We have now broken up. I will NEVER, EVER, date a man who is not working.
If you are not employed, money has to be hard to come by. So, how can you contribute to the relationship? Just doing the simplest things together cost money sometimes. My opinion is, and this would be based on a case by case scenario..but i feel if you are not employed, you should focus on getting yourself straight in that department before you start dating again. I do not think it is fair to ask someone you just met to have to pay for EVERYTHING. I am a woman, and I NEVER expect a man to have to pay for everything when we date. I will most definitely do my share of paying, or contributing. Im far from a gold digger, as must be evident by all the stuff i did for this man.
But, it really made me feel used, which i probably was being used to a point. And after doing all this, do you know one of the last things he said to me? He said I was, and i quote "****ing selfish" because we were going on a weekend trip that i paid for, ( he wasnt gonna have to pay for a thing..food..nothing) and he wanted to sit up in the hotel room and study some real estate book that he had been putting off doing. Of all times, NOW he wanted to study. I told him this was supposed to be a vacation in the mountains with some friends of mine, a hiking vacation. No one was gonna be in their hotel rooms. So, i was called "****ing selfish". After all i did for this man. Plus the fact he has no job, and has all the time in the world to study..but didnt. But, NOW he wanted to start..on my vacation.
And I'M the selfish one.
No, im totally gun shy right now about dating a man that has no job. Never again, unless we are ALREADY together and he loses his job. Thats a bit of a different circumstance.
yeah all of the above.
an unemployed guy (or girl) has bigger things to worry about than dating.
Also, I dont lump, ALL unemployed people together. If you have all your finances in order, car paid off, house paid off, etc., and you can pay your own way when you go places and do things because you have money in the bank, then fine.
But those types probably will NOT be the type of of unemployed people I will run into. I will just run into the average 'I dont have a job or money' kinda guy.
Why should the deadbeat never had a job unemployed person, the normal middle class unemployed person that with much effort will get a job eventually and has a decent work ethic, the person who is unemployed but happens to have money from a buyout and has their home paid off ( probaly also has the great track record to start working again real soon), and the person taking time off to travel or volunteer overseas be all lumped together?
Why should the small practice lawyer with 250,000 in debt from an expensive but second tier law school who is struggling for clients, the average lawyer working for the govenrment with a normal middle class income, the lawyer earning an upper middle class income in a respected corporate law firm and a wealthy but sleazy independent personal injury lawyer all be lumped together.
I think all of the scenarios you brought up do matter. I also don't think the people in these quoted paragraphs are necessarily viewed the same either. You have to keep in mind that *women* don't think as one body. Woman #1 may value physique, a family guy and may be unwilling to date someone of a different religion than her. Woman #2 may value being a free spirit, liking to travel and may not want a man who wants kids. You also have to remember that men have their preferences too. Is it any more fair if a man decides he won't date anyone with a size A chest, no matter their personality or other qualities? Of course not, but it's their preference. And we all have preferences.
Also, if these guys truly are your friends, don't encourage them in the art of, "Blah blah, women just won't date me because of xyz." Guys (and girls) who can't get dates seem to have a list a mile long. They say they can't get dates because of height, race, age, weight, kids or not, income, religion, an unattractive feature or whatever. But in truth, most of us fall into that imperfect category, where if we walked into a crowd, some would reject us outright for one thing or another and some would still be interested. And people with those qualities manage to find partners every day. Most often the people who are whining about being discounted because of xyz, it's pretty obvious within 5 minutes of talking to them that it's their personality or other shortcomings that they're not willing to take responsibility for and address, not whatever they're ranting about.
I think being able to support himself, (plus a partner, if/when he gets one), is one of those gender-specific 'asymmetric' attributes that makes what is attractive to a girl different than is attractive to a guy.
It's one of the most obvious ways in which women judge men that is different than how men judge women. We are NOT made equal!
___A guy wants a girl who:
isn't overweight,
dresses nice (certainly better than the guy, in the bedroom and out),
can cook,
can keep house,
can sew (fix torn clothing),
___A girl wants a guy who
has a good job,
has a sense of humor,
is tall and strong,
has a nice car (also showing financial ability?),
is handy around the house, ditto the car,
OK with killing (carefully relocating outside) all bugs and other scurrying critters,
I'm fascinated at the differences, and annoyed at those who don't recognize that what attracts guys is different than for girls.
I think being able to support himself, (plus a partner, if/when he gets one), is one of those gender-specific 'asymmetric' attributes that makes what is attractive to a girl different than is attractive to a guy.
It's one of the most obvious ways in which women judge men that is different than how men judge women. We are NOT made equal!
___A guy wants a girl who:
isn't overweight,
dresses nice (certainly better than the guy, in the bedroom and out),
can cook,
can keep house,
can sew (fix torn clothing),
___A girl wants a guy who
has a good job,
has a sense of humor,
is tall and strong,
has a nice car (also showing financial ability?),
is handy around the house, ditto the car,
OK with killing (carefully relocating outside) all bugs and other scurrying critters,
I'm fascinated at the differences, and annoyed at those who don't recognize that what attracts guys is different than for girls.
I love personally taking bugs that I find outside. Wouldn't give that up for any (terrible) bug-smashing guy.
I think being able to support himself, (plus a partner, if/when he gets one), is one of those gender-specific 'asymmetric' attributes that makes what is attractive to a girl different than is attractive to a guy.
It's one of the most obvious ways in which women judge men that is different than how men judge women. We are NOT made equal!
___A guy wants a girl who:
isn't overweight,
dresses nice (certainly better than the guy, in the bedroom and out),
can cook,
can keep house,
can sew (fix torn clothing),
___A girl wants a guy who
has a good job,
has a sense of humor,
is tall and strong,
has a nice car (also showing financial ability?),
is handy around the house, ditto the car,
OK with killing (carefully relocating outside) all bugs and other scurrying critters,
I'm fascinated at the differences, and annoyed at those who don't recognize that what attracts guys is different than for girls.
I am fascinated when people still claim that women do not go after looks. Maybe your generation is different, however, Brad Pitt, Michael McConaughay, and Orlando Bloom aren't box office success just because their acting skills. Here is the real list.
A guy wants a girl who:
isn't overweight and appreciates a healthy lifestyle.
Dresses like a lady.
can cook or can keep house.
or...
Have a job with equal pay as the man (not 1/3 the income and still expect 50/50 in house work and chores or the divorce!)
A girl wants a guy who
has a good job (So he can help pay for her part in being from the most materialistic culture and gender in the entire world)
has a sense of humor,
is tall and strong,
has a nice car (also showing financial ability?),
is handy around the house, ditto the car,
OK with killing (carefully relocating outside) all bugs and other scurrying critters,
I love personally taking bugs that I find outside. Wouldn't give that up for any (terrible) bug-smashing guy.
Heh, reminds me of one night over at my ex's...
I'd just cooked dinner and we're about to sit down when she shrieks and does the hand-flap thing. "OH MY GOD, A SPIDER! A HUUUUGE SPIDER!" I walk over and lean in to see a pretty large spider; big enough that I can see him moving his big mandible-things. "Oh, wow," I say.
She smacks me on the shoulder and goes, "You're the man! Kill it!"
I say, "I can't kill it, I'm a vegetarian, that's moral hypocrisy... go get me a piece of paper." She runs over, grabs a newspaper, I poke the spider onto it, open the door, and throw it outside. As soon as I close it, a huge smile spreads across her face and she gives me the biggest hug a tiny girl can give
To answer the OP's question though, for the most part, I think the main problem lies in the fact that - CEO's with gold parachutes or guys who just sold a business for a half billion dollars aside - guys who aren't working generally aren't stable, or at least, you can't bank on them being stable for too long. I understand this fully; I was stable and then I lost my job. For six months I couldn't find anything and as a result, I depleted my savings after six months of no going out and living off of ramen, and had to break my lease and move out of state. Not an entirely attractive thing to most women.
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..... I'm at the stage of my life where I am planning for retirement. I've worked hard, put away in 401ks, have a state pension and will have a pension from where I work now... why would I want to take on someone without a hope of ever getting a full time job, that doesn't have a 401k, no pension?? I do not have enough set aside for two... financial issues are the number 1 reason that most couples fight... going into a relationship that financial issues already exist is just plain crazy... they say love is blind.... I say past 50... TAKE THOSE BLINDERS OFF!! 
