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I'd just like the guy I'm with to be able to share in expenses with me, not only day to day things, but also vacations and fun events. It's unfair for either one of us to have to pay for the other. I'm not a princess; I'm a grown woman with my own income.
Women like guys who are successful, it's just the nature of the beast.
Like I said in the thread I made, if women liked rich men not for the sake of money itself but because they perceive rich guys as "successful" and "ambitious", then women would also like a guy who gets 1st place in the Putnam Mathematical Competition or National Spelling Bee. And they wouldn't like a millionaire who inherited his money, because he didn't earn it himself. Right?
I really wish this thread were about both men and women. I know the OP is interested in what women think, but the unintended result is that this thread makes it sound like only women have "financial requirements" and I am sure men do as well. If they don't, they are very short sighted... just as short sighted as I was when I married.
Are the men answering here willing to marry any women despite how much money she makes?
What if he makes $200k a year and she makes $10K?
Or what if she makes $200k too, but is up to her eyes in debt and digging deeper?
And what sacrifices to men expect women to make once married? Do they expect their wives to quit their jobs to raise the children... what if daycare is cost prohibitive? Is he willing to support a family? Or what if the woman makes more, is he willing to sacrifice his career if it comes to a choice that means choosing one spouse career over another? Would he be a house husband?
These are all financial considerations as well. I'd say both sexes need to think about it and look at them. Not just women.
I think the difference is that for women, their career can stall, or not really take off, and it will be OK. I actually know a number of women who have had bad luck during the recession and not had a job for years, but they are married to men who are pretty well off.
I don't really think a man can do that. In addition, men would many times prefer not to marry women who make a lot more than them. So, making a lot is sometimes a detriment.
I would prefer a woman to make the same as me, but I would take one who made less, $15/hr, I don't really care. None would be fine too, I suppose, but it'd be questionable how we would finance things, since I don't make a lot.
OTOH, if I were making $15/hr as a social worker or something, I imagine it would be very hard to find someone.
While financial expectations admixed to romantic interest are the very definition of crassness, there are many useful points if we scrub away the dirt. There's the huge subject of assortative mating… like marrying like. I won't gainsay cross-cultural affection, but there is good evidence that people of shared background, class and wherewithal tend to seek each other out. Annual salary is a coarse and superficial proxy for these things, but it's a starting point.
What causes me to chuckle is that so much emphasis is placed on the annual dollar figure, and so little on savings/investments, accumulated property, pensions, stability of employment and so forth. A military officer might only earn $60K-$80K/year (before benefits), but he has a lavish pension that vests after only 20 years of service… not to mention the finest health insurance anywhere. His financial wherewithal is very large, if the future is discounted to the present. But that annual dollar figure isn't very impressive, so he gets passed over in favor of the small business owner who netted $250K last year, but might go bankrupt next year. And what about the guy who took early-retirement, living on a pension of $40K/year, plus dividends and interest? He has $4M invested in stocks, bonds and index funds; but technically he's unemployed.
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Originally Posted by jillabean
But you know what, what's more important than raw income, is how he spends it. A man can make $200k and if he spends it left and right and has a bunch of debt, he's not the kind of man I want. He would stress me out. I rather have a man who makes $50k, but lives in his means and knows how to save and budget. Those are qualities I value highly because those are values I have as well.
And this is another excellent example of how (1) money matters, and (2) it's not necessarily shallow to regard money as a criterion in forming relationships.
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Originally Posted by zentropa
Why would a woman with her own money go out less often once she started dating someone who was making a lower salary than her?
Because the main purpose of "going out" is to find a potential romantic partner. Once married, it's just more convenient to spend one's evenings at home, in the company of one's partner.
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Originally Posted by Atlguy39
This thread proves my point. The most votes are for a man making $150k. I hate how materialistic this country is.
Unfortunately it's even worse than that. In a purely materialistic society, the guy making $150K would have no problem dating. A man's task would be to somehow find a lucrative career, save his nickles and elevate himself materially... and then female attention would be quickly forthcoming. Unfortunately things don't work that way. We've seen several posts on the Forum along the lines of, "Help! I'm a nerdy guy in my early 30s. I made $12M as a quantitative analyst for Goldman Sachs, but I can't get a date! What am I doing wrong?"
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Originally Posted by psichick
At this point in my life, I'd rather just have someone that is financially responsible and isn't struggling. Oh, and isn't a total tightwad either.
It's the latter point that would disqualify me.
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Originally Posted by alaskaboy
I know people who's net worth is far more then a $million and they make less then or around $15 an hour and so does everyone here. ...
$15/hour at Wal-Mart is a bit extreme, but I agree that many very affluent people (in terms of net worth) never enjoyed a huge salary. The neighboring city has a trendy and well-regarded museum endowed by a private benefactor, and is named after him. The man was a lifelong employee of the federal government, never rising beyond the GS-12 grade. In today's dollars, that's maybe $90K/year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by alaskaboy
Those boring people you knew in your twenties are all laughing at you now!
In some ways, yes. But how many of those people lived parsimonious lives, rendering themselves unappealing as dating prospects? They're laughing in the sense of laughter at rising gas prices, unemployment, health care costs and so forth. And that's great. They're laughing, sitting in comfortable houses that are paid off. But they are laughing alone. Ask me how I know...
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Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese
I know millionaires who own crappy cars, and some millionaries who live in rent controlled apartments. .....
There's a millionaire (by a substantial margin) living in a rent-controlled apartment who posts regularly in the "economics" forum. He is, to the best of my knowledge, happily married... but I wonder what his dating prospects would have been.
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Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese
One thing I have noticed with men who have money is that they also go for women who have money.
Indeed. It's called assortative mating.
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Originally Posted by Dewdrop93
So while you can't necessarily pinpoint how much someone makes to the exact dollar based on the neighborhood that they live in - you can assume that they are of a certain socioeconomic class.
This might be a reasonable measure in cities or suburbs, or amongst people who have children (and who therefore prefer better school districts). It's not a useful measure in the countryside, where widowers living in penury could be neighbors of multimillionaires. Often the countryside shares the same zip code as the local town. The countryside could have many wealthy people living on sprawling acreage, while the town is a blighted warren of meth-heads.
I make a good living, I could care less what my interest makes. so long as she's not irresponsible with money and lives within her means. I'm really not looking to pay off her student loan debt..
What you make doesn't matter, I have co-workers who make 6 figures that are broke as **** and in debt up to their eyeballs. I've actually had to loan them money at times so could get through the week. I don't get it…
Fun guys to party with though! They get women easily because they're on an image trip and they are always blowing tons of money on stupid things. It would be fun but it seems like a pretty shallow lifestyle to me.
Women like guys who are successful, it's just the nature of the beast. You need to look at the bottom of a well and be honest with your market value. Live within your means, date within your means,or you're gonna have a bad time.
This comes across as sounding like women can get a better deal than their means might suggest.
What you make doesn't matter, I have co-workers who make 6 figures that are broke as **** and in debt up to their eyeballs. I've actually had to loan them money at times so could get through the week. I don't get it…
Fun guys to party with though! They get women easily because they're on an image trip and they are always blowing tons of money on stupid things. It would be fun but it seems like a pretty shallow lifestyle to me.
Good point. We need to distinguish between material wherewithal as long-term stability and prosperity, vs. the propensity to spend freely and to have a good time. In some circles, men "buy" social status by profligate spending. And in some circles, money notice this. Most of us - men and women - would regard this as shallow and stupid, but unfortunately much of the mating-game is spreading peacock feathers. The appeal of the bird is contained in the apparent richness of the pigmentation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarshallV84
Women like guys who are successful, it's just the nature of the beast. You need to look at the bottom of a well and be honest with your market value. Live within your means, date within your means, or you're gonna have a bad time.
This, I think, is the aspect of materialism that is NOT rife with negative connotations, and which on the contrary makes perfect sense. In a more straightforward world, a man would actually prefer a woman who appreciates his success, and a woman would prefer a man who appreciates her beauty. But today such a statement is, to say the least, problematic.
No because a guy will honestly answer that he doesn't care. No rational is guy going to say they will reject a woman based on her boob size.
A woman on the other hand, will walk out on a date if a guy made a stupid homo joke.
Big difference.
I would, but then again I wouldn't approach/be interested in a woman with small breast to begin with. Not attracted to them. Is that shallow? Yes. Do most men care mostly about looks? Yes. Are women shallow because they want dudes with fat pockets errr "stability"? Yes. So it all equals out in the end.
Agreed. Many women who are looking for guys who are bringing in the dough probably won't find him.
Most millionaires don't look like they are millionaires.
I am probably the wealthiest out of all my group of friends (no e brag) but they honestly think I am flat out broke. Not because I am shrewd or anything. My car is 10+ years old. I am still renting. I mostly pack a lunch to work, except on Fridays when coworkers all go out. I definitely have no problem covering for someone's cost if they forgot their wallet or something. However I don't look the part of being even middle class or anything.
Yeah but a lot of old rich dudes date/marry young hot chicks.
Well I am sure it is not a good feeling that your woman makes 2 to 3 times more then you and if you have a kid it is hard to look at your self as a man and say life is beautiful. On top of that most woman will throw it in your face I hear it all the time from guys when there GF/wife make a significant amount more then they do. I hear you a POS you do not make enough money ? Then if the guy get a 2nd job he will get the old you are never home why are you working all the time ?
It is also called a thing called heart to want to provide for your family we are just driven to do so . If a girl made more money then me I would get another full time or part time job to put food on the table.
See I wouldn't have a problem if a woman made more than me, but if she tried to throw it in my face every time we had a argument or she thought that she was going to run things because she made more money, I would kick her to the curb. I don't care how much money she makes I'm always going to be the man in the relationship.
This, I think, is the aspect of materialism that is NOT rife with negative connotations, and which on the contrary makes perfect sense. In a more straightforward world, a man would actually prefer a woman who appreciates his success, and a woman would prefer a man who appreciates her beauty. But today such a statement is, to say the least, problematic.
I agree with this. I think this poll misses the point about what many women find attractive when it comes to success. I'll just speak for myself and say that I never thought at all about how much someone made or what their earning potential was. When I was engaged to my ex - I figured that if we decided to have children, I'd probably be the one that would have to find a higher paying job and put my performing career on hold for awhile if I wasn't where I wanted to be by the time we had children - if we decided to have children. He was a guitar player - a really good one - but I felt that I had the higher earning potential for a "day" job type job if it came down to it. And I was okay with that. This didn't have anything to do with why I broke up with him. So, personally, what I find attractive isn't the dollars and cents - it's ambition, skill, and confidence. Those attributes often lead to someone being monetarily successful - but it's not the money that is the attraction. When I started dating my husband, we were on tour with a show together - I was a performer and he was on the stage crew. During one of the shows, something broke down and had to be fixed as quickly as possible. Everyone was running around and my husband took control, told people what to do, and got things moving along. I thought it was incredibly sexy. Furthermore, my husband has been way more successful than either one of us imagined he would be. He's at the top of his field right now and I am SOOOOO proud of him - and I tell him so all the time. I'm so grateful that he's able to provide for us and that I'm able to be a stay at home mom. I didn't plan on being a stay at home mom - I didn't know if I would want to get back to work quickly after having children or not - but I love that we had the choice. We are both really happy with our life right now. Oh - and I also love that he thinks I'm hot!
But I could be wrong. Maybe most women do just lust after the almighty dollar. All I can say is that I'm not one of them.
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