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Old 08-04-2010, 11:10 AM
 
Location: Somewhere out there
9,616 posts, read 12,919,537 times
Reputation: 3767

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We Earth Stewards face some unprecedented challenges. This planet has, obviously, finite resources, some of which have already reached the veritable ends of their tethers. Oceanic fish stocks, fresh, clean, unpolluted water sources, soil reserves and places to hide our masses of garbage and plastics. As well, we continue to charge on, driven by the greed of big biz, big religion and big politics, with no end in sight.

I suggest that we're simply not ecologically or spiritually evolved sufficiently to see our own upcoming demise. We prefer to blindly believe in the eventual End Times salvation by some mystical god figure(s), or in technology, or in the dismissive claims of politicians and big biz/big oil that it will all take care of itself.

Of course, the individual claimants (CEOs, PR managers, news anchors) for such strategies, you'll notice, are quite high on the financial food chain, and they intend to wring every drop of profit out of the system for themselves. At your's and my expense of course; keep the little ones endlessly toiling (to buy that new combination window fan / food processor / hot tub heater down at WalMart. "But....Awe! It's only on sale for this weekend, honey!, And Fred next door just LOVES his!")

Since no, we can't spend our way to ecological or financial stability, nor can we "recover" back to what we had and cherished 4 - 5 years, what chance do we have? God sure as heck ain't comin', which means we've got to grab ourselves by the scruff of the neck, give ourselves a well-deserved shake, and promptly get on with some sort of logical, rational, science-driven programs.

We clearly need designs of restraint, of common sense, and of the full realization of our limits and those of this planet. We also need to learn to deal effectively with those primal types who would drag us back into the Very Dark Ages. (In order, of course, that a select few of them get to sit in the Big Chair and order us peon goatherds around...) But just who are those threats?

In order of threat level, I'd place Islam at the top, then big globalized business concerns, mostly topped by Big Oil, then the more rabidly insistent Southern Baptist-type fundamentalist Churches with their moronic "educational" objectives, and finally those brain-dead rote-chanting sheeple with Rush Limbaugh-like mentalities, who feel that Mother Nature can and will absorb all the damage we can possibly inflict. (You should have heard ol' Rushbo recently about the Gulf eco-disaster! According to him, there's literally no problem; it'll all just heal itself, and soon. Just like with the Exxon Valdez!)

So, what do you think? We be OK? Or We be Doomed? Or will God/Moses come riding in on a big white horse, just in time (why not now?)? Shall we all just pray, or start thinking and acting for ourselves?

It's in our hands, after all.
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Old 08-04-2010, 12:11 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn
40,050 posts, read 34,607,468 times
Reputation: 10616
Well...it might be in our hands, but we can't do anything about it just at the moment because someone just posted the most outrageous thing on Facebook...
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Old 08-04-2010, 12:36 PM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,138 posts, read 22,818,947 times
Reputation: 14116
I don't think we have enough time to evolve into a responsible, intelligent enough species that is capable of planning ahead on a global level and being a good steward of the planet. God isn't comming to save us either, so our best chance for continuing our civilization is to keep spreading, meaning we get our butts off the planet and spread into outer space.

Of course that seems increasingly unlikely as time goes on, so more than likely we're headed straight for Ragnarok. Humanity may survive the experience, but we haven't left much in the way of resources to power a second industrial revolution, so a second dark age may prove to be more permanent as well.

Strangely enough, our leaders are also acting like Vikings when it comes to planning for the future (Grab all you can, while you can, drink too much mead, do too much wenching and generally live like there is no tomorrow... becasuse there won't be a tomorrow.) It is evil and all too predictable human nature, but I see method in their madness. Our esteemed elite know where this is all going, though they will never tell it to our faces.

In other words... we're doomed.

Last edited by Chango; 08-04-2010 at 12:48 PM..
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Old 08-04-2010, 12:40 PM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
10,607 posts, read 11,659,782 times
Reputation: 7012
Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman View Post
We Earth Stewards face some unprecedented challenges. This planet has, obviously, finite resources, some of which have already reached the veritable ends of their tethers. Oceanic fish stocks, fresh, clean, unpolluted water sources, soil reserves and places to hide our masses of garbage and plastics. As well, we continue to charge on, driven by the greed of big biz, big religion and big politics, with no end in sight.

I suggest that we're simply not ecologically or spiritually evolved sufficiently to see our own upcoming demise. We prefer to blindly believe in the eventual End Times salvation by some mystical god figure(s), or in technology, or in the dismissive claims of politicians and big biz/big oil that it will all take care of itself.

Of course, the individual claimants (CEOs, PR managers, news anchors) for such strategies, you'll notice, are quite high on the financial food chain, and they intend to wring every drop of profit out of the system for themselves. At your's and my expense of course; keep the little ones endlessly toiling (to buy that new combination window fan / food processor / hot tub heater down at WalMart. "But....Awe! It's only on sale for this weekend, honey!, And Fred next door just LOVES his!")

Since no, we can't spend our way to ecological or financial stability, nor can we "recover" back to what we had and cherished 4 - 5 years, what chance do we have? God sure as heck ain't comin', which means we've got to grab ourselves by the scruff of the neck, give ourselves a well-deserved shake, and promptly get on with some sort of logical, rational, science-driven programs.

We clearly need designs of restraint, of common sense, and of the full realization of our limits and those of this planet. We also need to learn to deal effectively with those primal types who would drag us back into the Very Dark Ages. (In order, of course, that a select few of them get to sit in the Big Chair and order us peon goatherds around...) But just who are those threats?

In order of threat level, I'd place Islam at the top, then big globalized business concerns, mostly topped by Big Oil, then the more rabidly insistent Southern Baptist-type fundamentalist Churches with their moronic "educational" objectives, and finally those brain-dead rote-chanting sheeple with Rush Limbaugh-like mentalities, who feel that Mother Nature can and will absorb all the damage we can possibly inflict. (You should have heard ol' Rushbo recently about the Gulf eco-disaster! According to him, there's literally no problem; it'll all just heal itself, and soon. Just like with the Exxon Valdez!)

So, what do you think? We be OK? Or We be Doomed? Or will God/Moses come riding in on a big white horse, just in time (why not now?)? Shall we all just pray, or start thinking and acting for ourselves?

It's in our hands, after all.
you have a very interesting post here rifleman, and hopefully it will start people thinking, a few years ago I had the opportunity to make some drastic changes in my humble abode, I have an 11 room log cabin home in the foothills of the Appalachian Mountains and I have made some changes to where I have a very small carbon foot print, I have one of the newest and most advanced geothermal systems installed in my cabin, so I'm not using any kind of a fossil fuel, directly, along with that system came a very large hot water heater that is pre-heated by this system I am also in the process of installing photovoltaic cells to generate electricity in combination with a couple of small residential wind generators so that eventually I can be completely off grid and self-sustaining. I own 5 1/2 acres of land in the Appalachian mountains here and in the past two years I have planted about 25 different trees along with all the natural forest that is surrounding me, now the only dependency I have on oil is in my vehicles, my one pickup truck has a 30 gallon tank and I get between 20 to 22 miles per gallon, so a tank of gas lasts me about three weeks, when I have to go into town for one item I plan ahead to run any errands that needs to be done while I'm there. You know if people did nothing else but plant a couple of trees, it would help the environment and learn to take nothing except what is absolutely needed from the earth and give back. The problem I see is that man has gotten greedy and will use his religion to further their greed. I believe the Creator has given us the wisdom to use our resources wisely and not to use any more than what we absolutely need, I have no reason to try to keep up with the "Joneses"because I am quite satisfied with what I have.

So in answer to your question as to whether some god or Moses will come riding in on a white horse and save us.... no I don't see that happening. This is something that we have to do ourselves. We have to change the way we live and interact with the Earth.
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Old 08-04-2010, 01:30 PM
 
Location: Western NC
651 posts, read 1,417,037 times
Reputation: 498
Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman View Post

Since no, we can't spend our way to ecological or financial stability, nor can we "recover" back to what we had and cherished 4 - 5 years, what chance do we have? God sure as heck ain't comin', which means we've got to grab ourselves by the scruff of the neck, give ourselves a well-deserved shake, and promptly get on with some sort of logical, rational, science-driven programs.

We clearly need designs of restraint, of common sense, and of the full realization of our limits and those of this planet. We also need to learn to deal effectively with those primal types who would drag us back into the Very Dark Ages. (In order, of course, that a select few of them get to sit in the Big Chair and order us peon goatherds around...) But just who are those threats?
I am increasingly concerned by our energy consumption and have tried to find reliable data regarding how much of the earth's oil has been depleted. It's a difficult subject to just read about much less interpret the data. It is further complicated by opposing view points on both sides.

My understanding is that we've picked the low hanging fruits and that any remaining oil will be more difficult and more dangerous to access. (as shown by the Gulf oil spill) So, my question is, will technology be able to save us? Even if we develop better methods of drilling, we will still run out at some point. On the other hand, if alternate forms of energy become viable will we have the time to change our infrastructure to rely on these forms of energy? Our way of life relies on energy from oil and it permeates our infrastructure.

I become pessimistic when I think about the monumental problem we face.
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Old 08-04-2010, 01:47 PM
 
Location: Whittier
3,004 posts, read 6,275,645 times
Reputation: 3082
(Random thoughts ahead)

I pretty much agree with everything in the OP..but...

As much as I hate to say this but I think Rush is right when he states the gulf/earth will be all right. Maybe not soon, but in time.

This is based on the inevitable premise that the earth is going to be around a lot longer than humans are.

(New age alert)

And in a Zen sort of way we live our OWN lives the best we can and not worry about the things we can't control. However I can only control so much and so I act in accordance to how I would want to be treated and act in a way that promotes values in which I partake. And without getting political I don't and wouldn't want for my values to be forced on anyone; just considered.

Though, in a more philosophical turn:

IF we do not contribute a collective ego, or broadbased assumption that WE humans are the center of the universe then I think we would all be better off. I may believe in a Cartisian view of the cogito, but, "OK so what, I am." Now, where am I and what can I do?

Look, In the grand design of the universe through time and seemingly infinite space we ARE nothing. We are just floating on a rock and (the earth) has been for billions of years.

SO practically (down on earth and our egoist selves) we need to cope somehow by limiting our desires and suffering through independent thought, meditation and understanding.

This all may sound like a backhanded agreement but I'm just trying to understand myself, "What's the point?" An altruist will disagree and say that I'm being trampled on while the earth is too, though logically I agree, there is only so much I can do. I DON'T believe in altruism; and I happen to believe in inevitability more.

That may not have made any sense, though I'm still pondering whether or not we OWE the earth anything. IS being selfish in regards to resources a bad thing? I don't know. Can we completely destroy the earth? Maybe. I think to various movies and games regarding 'wastelands' and post-apocalyptic scenes of charred earth, but even so, I don't think we would ever have that kind of power.
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Old 08-04-2010, 01:54 PM
 
Location: Whittier
3,004 posts, read 6,275,645 times
Reputation: 3082
OH and when I think about things like this I always think about:

Doomsday argument - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Usually provided in arguments as to why we haven't encountered aliens (if they exist) yet.
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Old 08-04-2010, 02:07 PM
 
Location: Western NC
651 posts, read 1,417,037 times
Reputation: 498
Quote:
Originally Posted by harhar View Post
(Random thoughts ahead)

I pretty much agree with everything in the OP..but...

As much as I hate to say this but I think Rush is right when he states the gulf/earth will be all right. Maybe not soon, but in time.

This is based on the inevitable premise that the earth is going to be around a lot longer than humans are.

(New age alert)

And in a Zen sort of way we live our OWN lives the best we can and not worry about the things we can't control. However I can only control so much and so I act in accordance to how I would want to be treated and act in a way that promotes values in which I partake. And without getting political I don't and wouldn't want for my values to be forced on anyone; just considered.

Though, in a more philosophical turn:

IF we do not contribute a collective ego, or broadbased assumption that WE humans are the center of the universe then I think we would all be better off. I may believe in a Cartisian view of the cogito, but, "OK so what, I am." Now, where am I and what can I do?

Look, In the grand design of the universe through time and seemingly infinite space we ARE nothing. We are just floating on a rock and (the earth) has been for billions of years.

SO practically (down on earth and our egoist selves) we need to cope somehow by limiting our desires and suffering through independent thought, meditation and understanding.

This all may sound like a backhanded agreement but I'm just trying to understand myself, "What's the point?" An altruist will disagree and say that I'm being trampled on while the earth is too, though logically I agree, there is only so much I can do. I DON'T believe in altruism; and I happen to believe in inevitability more.

That may not have made any sense, though I'm still pondering whether or not we OWE the earth anything. IS being selfish in regards to resources a bad thing? I don't know. Can we completely destroy the earth? Maybe. I think to various movies and games regarding 'wastelands' and post-apocalyptic scenes of charred earth, but even so, I don't think we would ever have that kind of power.
I have to agree with this point. I don't think we are capable, yet, of completely destroying the earth. The earth would be better off in the short-term if we weren't here; in the long-term, the earth should recover.

However, we are capable of destroying ourselves. My built in desire to survive as a species doesn't like this scenario so much. From this selfish perspective, 'saving' the earth doesn't seem so altruistic. It benefits me! me! me! (or at least my descendants).
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Old 08-04-2010, 02:17 PM
 
Location: Metromess
11,798 posts, read 25,189,686 times
Reputation: 5220
We may not (yet) be able to completely destroy the Earth, but we have the technology and ever-increasing numbers to make it completely uninhabitable by man and most other animals. The Gulf may eventually 'heal itself', but the wetlands may be gone for ever, and they are important to all the animals and plants which have lived in them and to the people whose living depends on them.

The last thing we should do is pooh-pooh all the problems we have and depend on a supernatural solution.
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Old 08-04-2010, 05:10 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn
40,050 posts, read 34,607,468 times
Reputation: 10616
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maia160 View Post
I am increasingly concerned by our energy consumption and have tried to find reliable data regarding how much of the earth's oil has been depleted.
Peculiarly enough, this is one thing I don't worry about. Consider: we're going to use up what's left of the oil reserves. Probably sooner rather than later. But I think that's going to have the effect of bringing out some of the better qualities in the human race. Instead of the end of civilization due to the absence of petroleum, we're going to have to develop alternatives...and this time, there won't be any other options. I do believe humans will rise to the occasion.
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