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Every now and then I read a post that makes me want to start a new thread. The Like this one from the thread Christianity is a Sham:
The problem with you theists is that you do not want the truth, and consider any truth contrary to your beliefs scorn or mockery.
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In my observation “the problem” lies with the misunderstanding of the theist mindset. It is not that we don’t want the truth. We already have it. We have experienced God. We continue to experience God. Why should we turn from the Truth we know to be so?
And nearly every Christian I know has at one time or another questioned whether their belief system is correct or whether there is God. Personally, I have been challenged by many a concept and idea presented on religious boards by atheists and yet here I am. (I do find it interesting that so many atheists frequent religious boards). I have said OK and looked into and considered this or that claim. Over and over different claims that the Bible is bunk or God doesn’t exist and etc. I will admit that if I was unsure about the reality of God or if my faith was based on what “the preacher said, I could be swayed”.
One thing I have noticed is how so many skeptics react to things that point to the supernatural or God. It seems that every-thing presented is summarily dismissed. Once in a while I read a response saying in effect, “well that’s interesting-could you elaborate”. But that sort or response is rare.
Who is it really that does not wish to “consider any truth contrary to one’s belief”? I think the skepic just as much as anyone else.
One thing I have noticed is how so many skeptics react to things that point to the supernatural or God.
Well, that’s interesting. Could you elaborate? I'm all ears (or eyes ). I've seen plenty of things that we can't explain or answer. I've yet to see anything that points to the supernatural or a god. Without proof that there is a supernatural or god, they don't qualify as viable explanations for anything.
Every now and then I read a post that makes me want to start a new thread. The Like this one from the thread Christianity is a Sham:
The problem with you theists is that you do not want the truth, and consider any truth contrary to your beliefs scorn or mockery.
************************************************** *****
In my observation “the problem” lies with the misunderstanding of the theist mindset. It is not that we don’t want the truth. We already have it. We have experienced God. We continue to experience God. Why should we turn from the Truth we know to be so?
And nearly every Christian I know has at one time or another questioned whether their belief system is correct or whether there is God. Personally, I have been challenged by many a concept and idea presented on religious boards by atheists and yet here I am. (I do find it interesting that so many atheists frequent religious boards). I have said OK and looked into and considered this or that claim. Over and over different claims that the Bible is bunk or God doesn’t exist and etc. I will admit that if I was unsure about the reality of God or if my faith was based on what “the preacher said, I could be swayed”.
One thing I have noticed is how so many skeptics react to things that point to the supernatural or God. It seems that every-thing presented is summarily dismissed. Once in a while I read a response saying in effect, “well that’s interesting-could you elaborate”. But that sort or response is rare.
Who is it really that does not wish to “consider any truth contrary to one’s belief”? I think the skepic just as much as anyone else.
Quote:
The problem with you theists is that you do not want the truth, and consider any truth contrary to your beliefs scorn or mockery.
Since I am the one who wrote the above..What I meant by that statement is that if a theist tells me for instance that the Noah's ark story is true and a world flood actually happened and I say that it is impossible the believer often takes it personally...Call it scorn if you want, but it is directed at the belief not the believer.
I will ask you once more...You say you have experienced and continue to experience god, I have asked you to explain exactly how, but I cannot recall ever getting an answer.
You do realize, I hope that beliefs are not necessarily truths.
I will ask you once more...You say you have experienced and continue to experience god, I have asked you to explain exactly how, but I cannot recall ever getting an answer.
You do realize, I hope that beliefs are not necessarily truths.
The main "problem" with theists as I see it is that the core idea that most of the religions are based on.... the existence of god.... is evidence free.... entirely baseless.... not even remotely substantiated with anything resembling evidence, argument, data and/or reasons.... and for all intents and purposes the entity acts as if it is entirely not there and does not exist.
No small "problem" really is it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150
[color=black]Once in a while I read a response saying in effect, “well that’s interesting-could you elaborate”
A little unfair here. I have been asking theists to elaborate for over 18 years now. Elaborate on what god actually IS. Elaborate on the evidence, argument, data and/or reasons that lend even a modicum of credence to the idea the entity exists.
All calls to have them elaborate or present their evidence are met with one or more of the following in every case:
1) Silence
2) A cop out excuse and hasty retreat
3) Insults directed at me
4) Claims that by even asking them to elaborate I have insulted / disrespected them.
5) Violence
It seems to me that last thing theists in general want is for you to ask them to elaborate. They want you to accept what they are saying, pander to their nonsense, and keep your mouth firmly shut and your questions and inquiries to yourself.
Last edited by Nozzferrahhtoo; 08-23-2011 at 02:27 PM..
In my observation “the problem” lies with the misunderstanding of the theist mindset. It is not that we don’t want the truth. We already have it.
Who is it really that does not wish to “consider any truth contrary to one’s belief”? I think the skepic just as much as anyone else.
Truth: a proven or verified principle or statement.
A little unfair here. I have been asking theists to elaborate for over 18 years now. Elaborate on what god actually IS. Elaborate on the evidence, argument, data and/or reasons that lend even a modicum of credence to the idea the entity exists.
All calls to have them elaborate or present their evidence are met with one or more of the following in every case:
1) Silence
2) A cop out excuse and hasty retreat
3) Insults directed at me
4) Claims that by even asking them to elaborate I have insulted / disrespected them.
5) Violence
It seems to me that last thing theists in general want is for you to ask them to elaborate. They want you to accept what they are saying, pander to their nonsense, and keep your mouth firmly shut and your questions and inquiries to yourself.
You must be "lucky" or people in your neck of the woods are different. In my town theists would be more than happy to sit down with you for a while and chat.
My problem is that any evidence or arguement I've provided on Forums is dismissed out of hand. As if the individual doesn't want to have God proven.
That's why I prefer to repost what I said in the past rather than rewrite my story a 1000 times.
In a nutshell there is plenty of evidence. Some chose to interpret it a random chance. Others see it differently.
Explain mathematics or the fact that DNA contains specific code to produce specific types of life forms as being the result of chance, not design.
You must be "lucky" or people in your neck of the woods are different. In my town theists would be more than happy to sit down with you for a while and chat.
It is nothing to do with my "neck of the woods". I am talking about on AND off line in the real world and on the internet and in both I have been to many countries, many towns, talked to many different types of people from many different types of places.
And what I said above fits them all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150
My problem is that any evidence or arguement I've provided on Forums is dismissed out of hand.
So you say but I would point out two things:
1) That is your problem not mine as I NEVER dismiss evidence "out of hand" but if it is poor evidence I explain exactly why... and usually at length. So if you have that problem with people then I could not care less because that is not me you are talking about.
2) Given you have never GIVEN any evidence or arguments I can not have dismissed them out of hand. One can not dismiss what one is simply not given now can one????
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150
In a nutshell there is plenty of evidence.
I wish I had a dollar for every person I have heard say that. I would be quite quite rich. Problem is that not one of the 1000s of people I have heard say it have ever offered a scrap of it or said what any of this "plenty of evidence" actually is.
Inevitably they just SAY there is evidence, then find some way to get out of giving any of it. So one can be forgiven for thinking they simply do not have any and are lying blindly to my face. I have no reasons available to me to assume you any different to them.
Evidence that can be tested and lead to a fact and can be repeated by others to lead to the same fact is what I'm talking about....I believe that theists confuse personal truth (What they believe to be true with evidence)
We all know that there is no testable evidence for anything outside the realm of nature, so I wouldn't bother with stressing over it if I were you, Mr 5150.
As to the God experiences, I've posted them up a 1000 times. You may have missed it on this forum. I'll see if I can find I my postings.
Can't watch the video at work-
You do realize, of course that personal revolation is, by definition, first person in nature. Right? As such, no one is obligated to believe one person's personal revelation over that of any other. Farmer Bob may be an honest, God-fearing man, but we still need physical evidence that Mary appeared to him in his corn field.
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). I've seen plenty of things that we can't explain or answer. I've yet to see anything that points to the supernatural or a god. Without proof that there is a supernatural or god, they don't qualify as viable explanations for anything.
