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View Poll Results: If you see a miracle, will you believe?
yes, I believe on seeing the miracle. 7 36.84%
no, I don't believe on seeing any miracle. 12 63.16%
Voters: 19. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-27-2011, 12:19 AM
 
Location: playing in the colorful Colorado dirt
4,486 posts, read 5,224,953 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerZ View Post
Ha ha, and nope...being a Southern Californian, I can't believe that. Oh Exxon-Mobil, I believe; help thou my unbelief. (falling to knees and hoping for a sign that YES, somewhere in the world...gas can be $2.99 a gallon)
I live in Colorado though!
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Old 12-27-2011, 12:35 AM
 
Location: Ohio
13,933 posts, read 12,898,761 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr5150 View Post
This is the essence of the skeptic, Nothing will ever convince him or her that there is God. A closed mind is a powerful thing.

Thank you for your honesty. I mean that with all sincereness.
I guess skeptics and believers have something very much in common then wouldn't you agree?

On behalf of myself, let me say this:

You or any other believer have failed to convince me that there is a God, however, likewise, no nonbeliever has ever convinced me beyond any shadow of a doubt that there absolutely is no creator God.
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Old 12-27-2011, 12:37 AM
 
641 posts, read 558,376 times
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I'm not going to play rhetoric games, be excessively intellectual or kid myself here: If I saw a legitimate miracle in the course of my day-to-life, I think the experience would be so profound that, yes, I would believe a god had been behind it. Questionable miracles don't count, of course; but if you're talking about "beasts" rising up out of the ground, speaking English, then yeah, I'd stop everything I was doing and offer my life to God.

That being said, I'd like to point out that things of this sort are precisely what DON'T happen in this universe.
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Old 12-27-2011, 02:59 AM
 
Location: S. Wales.
50,088 posts, read 20,731,784 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabfest View Post
Yes this is a sound answer; however, I think the working definition for a miracle is something/incidence(s) that cannot be replicated by science. Here's a couple I've pondered over:

Witchfinder General "The Devil's Footprints" - YouTube

The Miracle of the Sun in Fatima October 13, 1917 - YouTube
I have to say 'No' because the question is really asking 'If you see something that you can't explain, will you leap to a conclusion about some particular faith - claim?' The answer is obviously 'No' and I suspect that the poster, if he or she saw a miracle of the Holy Family and Jesus with his cross marks declaring that Christianity was true, it would be dismissed as some delusion or trick of Iblis.

I on the other hand would - and did when I saw a UFO a month or so ago - not dismiss it, but classify it as unexplained by the knowledge I had at the time, but not leap to conclusions about what it actually was.

I picked this post as Fatima is a good example of a 'miracle' and one of the strongest in religion. yet posters of some venerability will recall a thread on the subject where it was shown on all evidence to be no miracle, false, and delusionary. Not that this was accepted by those who wanted to believe it.

This is why I have to say no, but deny that this implies close - mindedness on my part. In fact it is those who 'believe' as a result of an unexplained event who are more likely to have their minds closed thereby.
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Old 12-27-2011, 06:55 AM
 
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Miracles happen all the time, being alive, life it's self, is a miracle. None of us can create life, none of us can come up with this complex thing we call life. However I wonder if the presence or absence of miracles is of any meaningful and practical consequence? Lifestyles are not changed by by being amazed or shocked or astounded. People dont change that way. Not in ways that count anyway. Let me explain what I am trying to say with this illustration :

Say Jesus came up to me and started walking on water. I would be astounded, I would be amazed, but would I believe that I can or should walk on water as well? No. My perception of who I am and what I can do, my fears and insecurities will not go away now just because I saw a miracle. The miracle incident would be a memorable incident in my life, but it would not change me in any meaningful ways.
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Old 12-27-2011, 11:01 AM
 
6,222 posts, read 4,012,342 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerZ View Post
I can't believe that's the accepted definition. At one time science couldn't replicate a tenth of what it can replicate today, and tomorrow it may replicate a tenth of a tenth more than today...Does that mean that hundreds of years ago, miracles happened like crazy but tomorrow, there will be no miracles...because it's all based on what science can and can not do at a given time?

Not a good definition, IMO. Just sayin'.
I agree but it's the best we have.
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Old 12-30-2011, 01:29 PM
 
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This is to demonstrate the stubbornness of the atheist [and the idolater] who will not believe whatever miracle may be done!

In the same way, the tribe of Prophet Mohammed and all the ancient peoples denied the apostles, and when they saw the miracles with their own eyes: they said: this is the magic and sorcery.

(Yet if they see a sign [: a miracle, which they requested], they turn away, and say: "[The Quran is] a magic!" [and keep up saying that] continuously.)

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Old 12-30-2011, 01:59 PM
 
70 posts, read 88,832 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eanassir View Post
This is to demonstrate the stubbornness of the atheist [and the idolater] who will not believe whatever miracle may be done!

In the same way, the tribe of Prophet Mohammed and all the ancient peoples denied the apostles, and when they saw the miracles with their own eyes: they said: this is the magic and sorcery.

(Yet if they see a sign [: a miracle, which they requested], they turn away, and say: "[The Quran is] a magic!" [and keep up saying that] continuously.)
yes my brother
ALLAH gth said [ If you disbelieve - indeed, Allah is Free from need of you. And He does not approve for His servants disbelief. And if you are grateful, He approves it for you; and no bearer of burdens will bear the burden of another. Then to your Lord is your return, and He will inform you about what you used to do. Indeed, He is Knowing of that within the breasts.] [ And We have certainly presented for the people in this Qur'an from every [kind of] example - that they might remember.]
they can not escape from death every one will die [ Lest a soul should say, "Oh [how great is] my regret over what I neglected in regard to Allah and that I was among the mockers." Or [lest] it say, "If only Allah had guided me, I would have been among the righteous." Or [lest] it say when it sees the punishment, "If only I had another turn so I could be among the doers of good." But yes, there had come to you My verses, but you denied them and were arrogant, and you were among the disbelievers.]
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