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Old 03-25-2014, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
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Hi Eusebius, you seem to be a Christian who takes the Old Testament very seriously.

This is the first sentence in Chapter 31 of the Book of Numbers:

The Lord said to Moses, 2 “Take vengeance on the Midianites for the Israelites.

Do you agree that your god is telling Moses to have the Israelites attack and kill the Midianites?

If so, do you think your god would, under some circumstances, give a similar order today?
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Old 03-25-2014, 12:12 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiker45 View Post
Hi Eusebius, you seem to be a Christian who takes the Old Testament very seriously.

This is the first sentence in Chapter 31 of the Book of Numbers:

The Lord said to Moses, 2 “Take vengeance on the Midianites for the Israelites.

Do you agree that your god is telling Moses to have the Israelites attack and kill the Midianites?

If so, do you think your god would, under some circumstances, give a similar order today?
No, not as long as we are under grace.
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Old 03-25-2014, 12:21 PM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,612 posts, read 4,901,232 times
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Sorry, I made the mistake of asking two questions. I will repeat the first question:

In the first sentence of Numbers 31, do you agree that your god is telling Moses to have the Israelites attack and kill the Midianites?

A Yes or No answer will be more than sufficient.
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Old 03-25-2014, 12:32 PM
 
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Yes this is what God told Moses:
31 The Lord said to Moses, 2 “Take vengeance on the Midianites for the Israelites. After that, you will be gathered to your people.”
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Old 03-25-2014, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
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Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Yes this is what God told Moses:
31 The Lord said to Moses, 2 “Take vengeance on the Midianites for the Israelites. After that, you will be gathered to your people.”
And your okay with that? It kind of reminds me of those people who kill their children because "God told them to do it". Are you okay with that!

These stories in the OT about mass killings, I'm of the opinion, that these were not sanctioned by God, but instead it was a way for them to justify their actions. "If God told them to do it then it has to be okay".
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Old 03-25-2014, 01:18 PM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,612 posts, read 4,901,232 times
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Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Yes this is what God told Moses:
31 The Lord said to Moses, 2 “Take vengeance on the Midianites for the Israelites. After that, you will be gathered to your people.”
OK, thanks for the clear answer.

When I asked you if your god would give a similar order today, you said:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
No, not as long as we are under grace.
Are all humans "under grace" today? Will we all be "under grace" in the future?

If so, then, according to your understanding, your god will never tell a group like the Israelites to slaughter another group of people.

If there are people who are not "under grace", is there a chance your god may tell them to slaughter other people, or may tell us to slaughter them?
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Old 03-25-2014, 03:26 PM
 
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Originally Posted by hiker45 View Post
OK, thanks for the clear answer.

Are all humans "under grace" today? Will we all be "under grace" in the future?

If so, then, according to your understanding, your god will never tell a group like the Israelites to slaughter another group of people.

If there are people who are not "under grace", is there a chance your god may tell them to slaughter other people, or may tell us to slaughter them?
Right now we are all under grace. Paul wrote that God is at peace with the world and entreats everyone to be at peace with Him. Under this administration of grace, God is not reckoning anyone's offenses to them in the entire world.

We believers are ambassadors as the scriptures state. Whenever a king pulls his ambassadors out of a country due to certain circumstances, usually war breaks out if a resolution cannot be reached.

When the nations begin killing off Christ's brethren which is called their great tribulation of 3 1/2 years duration, God will pull His ambassadors. Christ will return and go to war against what will be called the beast and ten kings.

But God never goes after a nation such as Midian in the OT without warrant. Besides, it's His land and He can have whoever He wants to live in that land of Israel. I know that sounds harsh, but it's just the way it is.
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Old 03-25-2014, 03:27 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Terryj View Post
And your okay with that? It kind of reminds me of those people who kill their children because "God told them to do it". Are you okay with that!

These stories in the OT about mass killings, I'm of the opinion, that these were not sanctioned by God, but instead it was a way for them to justify their actions. "If God told them to do it then it has to be okay".
Please ask yourself: Why did God have Moses take vengeance on the people of Midian. Then you will have your answer.
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Old 03-25-2014, 03:50 PM
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
31,373 posts, read 20,219,714 times
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Originally Posted by Eusebius View Post
Please ask yourself: Why did God have Moses take vengeance on the people of Midian. Then you will have your answer.
Because he was a narcissistic genocidal maniac.
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Old 03-25-2014, 03:57 PM
 
17,966 posts, read 15,988,159 times
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Originally Posted by TroutDude View Post
Because he was a narcissistic genocidal maniac.
You failed the test if that were the only question on the test. That is not the correct answer. Please look up the scripture and note why God wanted them to take vengeance on Midian. The term vengeance suggests that the Midians caused a lot of deaths to the Israelites. The Israelites lost a lot of babies and others. Atheists don't complain about what the Midianites did to Israel. They just want God to look as bad as they can to justify their ignorance about God. Now if you want to look half way intelligent and continue with an intelligent conversation with me, find out why they were to take vengeance on Midian. Otherwise, don't expect me to continue answering your puerile comments.
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