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This is not true, however I wasn't referring to a bishop being asked to leave the church. I was referring to a bishop who choses to leave based upon the heiarchy of church officials.
What I wrote is not true??
Are you calling me a liar, or merely ignorant? You apparently think you know more about the church I have been an active member of for 40 years than I do. Please provide your evidence that serving bishops who commit adultery are not excommunicated.
I suppose with thousands of human beings serving as bishops all over the world at any given time it's possible though highly unlikely that one or even a few of them might abandon their faith because they don't like a General Authority. But I'm interested in seeing your documentation of such a thing happening, please provide a link.
If you are simply expressing your uninformed opinion about the LDS Church then say so instead of giving the impression that you are informed when you're not and thus possibly misleading members of this board.
Not in my experience. Both of my grandfathers were bishops
Are you calling me a liar, or merely ignorant?
Neither, you have your own experiences to draw from. My grandmother was cheated on my my grandfather who was a bishop and was never excommunicated, later she was murdered by a member of her ward who was hired by the primary president of her ward to kill her. She was strangled and shot in the head in her home after attending sunday school (when it was held on a wednesday) only to be discovered by her 12 year old son. This was back in the 60's, you may not have been a member at that time.
You apparently think you know more about the church I have been an active member of for 40 years than I do. Please provide your evidence that serving bishops who commit adultery are not excommunicated.
Again simply my own experience. I don't claim to know more than you, but when you mention things that are arguable I am willing to state my opinion
I suppose with thousands of human beings serving as bishops all over the world at any given time it's possible though highly unlikely that one or even a few of them might abandon their faith because they don't like a General Authority. But I'm interested in seeing your documentation of such a thing happening, please provide a link.
You would just dismiss it as anti mormon propaganda and I'm not interested in wasting my time.
If you are simply expressing your uninformed opinion about the LDS Church then say so instead of giving the impression that you are informed when you're not and thus possibly misleading members of this board.
You presume that I am uninformed, that is your mistake.
That's a tragic story. But I'm sure if your grandfather was a serving bishop and his stake president knew he was an adulterer that he would have been excommunicated or the stake president would not have been doing his duty. (Assuming I understand your story correctly.)
Were you an active Latter-day Saint at one time yourself, or did that story come down through the decades with all the bitterness that could accompany such sad events in one's family?
That's a tragic story. But I'm sure if your grandfather was a serving bishop and his stake president knew he was an adulterer that he would have been excommunicated or the stake president would not have been doing his duty. (Assuming I understand your story correctly.)
Were you an active Latter-day Saint at one time yourself, or did that story come down through the decades with all the bitterness that could accompany such sad events in one's family?
Back pedal.
Why are you assuming that the stake president would have ousted him if he knew he was an adulter? Didn't they just say "later she was murdered by a member of her ward who was hired by the primary president of her ward to kill her."
The president of the WARD? Please stop justifying every negative thing, it just isn't rational behavior.
Were you an active Latter-day Saint at one time yourself, or did that story come down through the decades with all the bitterness that could accompany such sad events in one's family?
Justamere being relatively new to this board I guess you wouldn't know that I was raised mormon. I have shared many thoughts and opinions through the years and have always been very respectful of mormons, for most of my family and many of my friends are mormon.
For the last two years of posting on this forum I have never mentioned this story for it really has little to do with mormonism or the reason I left. I was willing to share it with you because you were interested in knowing why I stated my opinions the way I did, or why I know the things I do.
The bitterness you mention was not passed down from generation to generation due to the fact that my grandfather was an advocate of "forgive and forget". All the articles in newspapers and national magazines were never allowed in their home. My grandfather remarried a woman in his ward about 6 months after my grandmother's death bringing the family count to 12. A few years later they were divorced. Most of his children have remained very strong mormons and some with bouts of inactivity here and there.
The 'bitterness' if any that you may sense from my post's is directed towards Joseph Smith and Brigham Young, two very creepy men if you ask me. Many of my mormon friends have opened up to me stating that they could never leave due to how their family would react, they feel very controlled, and guilty. Although they don't agree with much of it, they go through the motions and never live a fullfulling life...they live out of duty and obligation, to me that is very sad.
Many of my gay friends have served missions and would actually love to be a part of the mormon religion (not sure why) but can't be true to themselves and also be a mormon, creating a large inner conflict. Very sad!
My direct family are all mormon and my sister is the relief society president of her ward. If it works for them in their life, I have no problem with it. However I create a boundary of religious respect. When I am at a mormon home I bow my head and fold my arms and am respectful for the way they pray. (I am however avoided at all costs to lead the prayer, in my defense, I say very good prayers) When I am in a Christian home I will hold hands while we pray because it is respectful even if that is not how I pray in my home.
I don't expect someone with 40 years of active fellowship in this religion to understand my views, feelings or opinions but I do respect you as a fellow human being even if I don't agree with your belief's.
My grandfather (who was a bishop and has that unfortunate experience with a woman in his ward he was counseling) was ALWAYS a big advocate for the church, constantly talking about church and died very involved in the church. Was a rock in the gospel you could say, he was one of those who sounded much like Justamere. Just FYI.
Last edited by moonsavvy; 02-05-2009 at 10:11 AM..
The 'bitterness' if any that you may sense from my post's is directed towards Joseph Smith and Brigham Young, two very creepy men if you ask me. Many of my mormon friends have opened up to me stating that they could never leave due to how their family would react, they feel very controlled, and guilty. Although they don't agree with much of it, they go through the motions and never live a fullfulling life...they live out of duty and obligation, to me that is very sad.
Many of my gay friends have served missions and would actually love to be a part of the mormon religion (not sure why) but can't be true to themselves and also be a mormon, creating a large inner conflict. Very sad!
Thank you for sharing your story with us.
I too find it sad that people are not allowed to live life as themselves and still be able to worship.
Life should be full of joy and happiness. Theirs seems to be full of strife.
Why are you assuming that the stake president would have ousted him if he knew he was an adulter? Didn't they just say "later she was murdered by a member of her ward who was hired by the primary president of her ward to kill her."
The president of the WARD? Please stop justifying every negative thing, it just isn't rational behavior.
Well, that's what is supposed to happen. But that's not always the case. Church leaders are people and sometimes people "forget" to follow the rules when it's convenient to do so. And sometimes people don't apply the rules equally. I'm not absolutely positive, but I believe that adultery is a sin that results in excommunication (removal of church membership), or at least disfellowship (can't say prayers, can't take the sacrament, can't hold callings but still a member). Either way, the bishop should have been removed from his calling.
Oh, and an FYI, the "primary president" isn't the president of the ward. The primary is the sunday school class for the little kids, the primary president is the woman who is in charge of that group, not the whole ward. You may have already known that, but your response made it seem like you didn't.
Oh, and an FYI, the "primary president" isn't the president of the ward. The primary is the sunday school class for the little kids, the primary president is the woman who is in charge of that group, not the whole ward. You may have already known that, but your response made it seem like you didn't.
So you believe that since the murderer was just responsible for little minds and shaping the future generations of LDS it is not as bad as if the president did it?
Am i missing something?
This person- who sadly was in charge of ANYTHING and worked for the church- hired someone to kill another member.
How is this EVER justifiable?
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When I am in a Christian home I will hold hands while we pray because it is respectful even if that is not how I pray in my home.
