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As George Carlin has pointed out, Moses received the stone tablets known as the Ten Commandments when no one else was around. This brings up a few interesting questions. First of all, why do we always have to have a middleman whenever God is presenting something to the human race? There is not a single instance in which God directly interacts with the general public, humanity is always represented by a kind of agent, not unlike a Personal Manager. The Bible states that Moses was instructed to climb Mount Sinai and that he did and God presented him with two stone tablets which had the Ten Commandments already written into the stone. Moses carefully walked back down to his people (how would it look if God gave you a couple of stone tablets and you dropped one and broke it?). Anyway, Moses presented these stone tablets to the men, women and groupies when he returned and the rest is history. First of all, it's a shame that these stone tablets no longer exist. I would love to see a forensic examination of the letters under a microscope to determine if tools were used. Also, many people believe that the Ten Commandments are very similar to earlier religious traditions. As an atheist I don't believe that anyone ever received a publication directly from God. There are some valuable moral lessons in the Ten Commandments but I believe they are the work of man. What is your opinion?
There is not a single instance in which God directly interacts with the general public, humanity is always represented by a kind of agent, not unlike a Personal Manager.
Christ Jesus is God Incarnate (God clothed in flesh).
.... how would it look if God gave you a couple of stone tablets and you dropped one and broke it?). ....
In the old movie "History of the World", Mel Brooks (Moses) was given 15 commandments in 3 tablets - he dropped one tablet and broke it, and then proclaimed he had 10 commandments. It could have happened.
I cannot believe "god's" constitution seems like a hastily-written 10 liner for dummies.
Also an entertaining link: http://web.morons.org/feature/useless-commandments.jsp (broken link)
Last edited by calmdude; 01-17-2009 at 08:54 PM..
Reason: added link
In the old movie "History of the World", Mel Brooks (Moses) was given 15 commandments in 3 tablets - he dropped one tablet and broke it, and then proclaimed he had 10 commandments. It could have happened.
I cannot believe "god's" constitution seems like a hastily-written 10 liner for dummies.
I thought that movie was hilarious. You seem not to understand the degree of primitive mentality that existed at that time . . . barely more than very bright animals. You would expect a treatise written using Black's Law Dictionary?
I thought that movie was hilarious. You seem not to understand the degree of primitive mentality that existed at that time . . . barely more than very bright animals. You would expect a treatise written using Black's Law Dictionary?
Yes -it was a fun movie.
Re Law dictionary - a simple "be good" could also have sufficed. Problem is people also look at what god does. Let us take thou shall not kill. God makes us in a way (regardless of supposed free will) such that we kill (and he knows it beforehand); he does not seem to be following a key commandment of his own. Anyway, the primitive mentality also does not explain the huge books some religions say come down directly from god....
Can you provide some specific Bible verses to back up this claim?
Sure, a good place to start is in John’s Gospel account. John 1: 1-5
Quote:
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life,1 and the life was the light of men. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
Here “the Word” is referring to Christ Jesus.
John 1: 14-18
Quote:
14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth. 15 (John bore witness about him, and cried out, “This was he of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me ranks before me, because he was before me.’ ”) 16 And from his fullness we have all received, grace upon grace. 17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ. 18 No one has ever seen God; the only God,4 who is at the Father’s side,5 he has made him known.
Yes -it was a fun movie.
Re Law dictionary - a simple "be good" could also have sufficed. Problem is people also look at what god does. Let us take thou shall not kill. God makes us in a way (regardless of supposed free will) such that we kill (and he knows it beforehand); he does not seem to be following a key commandment of his own. Anyway, the primitive mentality also does not explain the huge books some religions say come down directly from god....
There are too many premises in your remarks to deal with them all . . . none of which are necessary anyway. Nothing in our universe is created fully mature and everything evolves. What is required at early stages is not necessarily required at later ones. Free will (or choice) is absolutely the main culprit . . . because we have not yet evolved sufficiently to fully "overcome" our inner drives completely. Much of that failure can be attributed to lack of effort . . . belief only nonsense . . . and the shear difficulty of it.
You misunderstand "inspiration" . . . it is NOT dictation and MUST be filtered through the mentality that receives it . . . it is unavoidable.
verses from the Quran mentioning the tablets of Musa
150 And when Musa returned to his people, wrathful (and) in violent grief, he said: Evil is it that you have done after me; did you turn away from the bidding of your Lord? And he threw down the tablets and seized his brother by the head, dragging him towards him. He said: Son of my mother! surely the people reckoned me weak and had well-nigh slain me, therefore make not the enemies to rejoice over me and count me not among the unjust people.
151 He said: My Lord! forgive me and my brother and cause us to enter into Thy mercy, and Thou art the most Merciful of the merciful ones.
152 (As for) those who took the calf (for a god), surely wrath from their Lord and disgrace in this world's life shall overtake them, and thus do We recompense the devisers of lies.
153 And (as to) those who do evil deeds, then repent after that and believe, your Lord after that is most surely Forgiving, Merciful.
154 And when Musa's anger calmed down he took up the tablets, and in the writing thereof was guidance and mercy for those who fear for the sake of their Lord.
155 And Musa chose out of his people seventy men for Our appointment; so when the earthquake overtook them, he said: My Lord! if Thou hadst pleased, Thou hadst destroyed them before and myself (too); wilt Thou destroy us for what the fools among us have done? It is naught but Thy trial, Thou makest err with it whom Thou pleasest and guidest whom Thou pleasest: Thou art our Guardian, therefore forgive us and have mercy on us, and Thou art the best of the forgivers.
156 And ordain for us good in this world's life and m the hereafter, for surely we turn to Thee. He said: (As for) My chastisement, I will afflict with it whom I please, and My mercy encompasses all things; so I will ordain it (specially) for those who guard (against evil) and pay the poor-rate, and those who believe in Our communications.
157 Those who follow the Messenger-Prophet, the Ummi, whom they find written down with them in the Taurat and the Injeel (who) enjoins them good and forbids them evil, and makes lawful to them the good things and makes unlawful to them impure things, and removes from them their burden and the shackles which were upon them; so (as for) those who believe in him and honor him and help him, and follow the light which has been sent down with him, these it is that are the successful.
158 Say: O people! surely I am the Messenger of Allah to you all, of Him Whose is the kingdom of the heavens and the earth there is no god but He; He brings to life and causes to die therefore believe in Allah and His messenger, the Ummi Prophet who believes in Allah and His words, and follow him so that you may walk in the right way.
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). Anyway, Moses presented these stone tablets to the men, women and groupies when he returned and the rest is history. First of all, it's a shame that these stone tablets no longer exist. I would love to see a forensic examination of the letters under a microscope to determine if tools were used. Also, many people believe that the Ten Commandments are very similar to earlier religious traditions. As an atheist I don't believe that anyone ever received a publication directly from God. There are some valuable moral lessons in the Ten Commandments but I believe they are the work of man. What is your opinion?
