Getting Sued for Back Rent When Not on Lease--Odds of this happening, and standing up in court? (apartment, tenant)
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Upon my college graduation, I'm moving out of state this December and am getting my first place that's not on a college campus. Whether or not that is an apartment or a room in an apartment/house remains to be determined.
I've been thinking. . . (and this applies only if I rent a room which, if I were to do that, I would rent only until April 1st, or 3.5 months)
Frankly, I grew up with parents who were getting evicted every 3-6 months depending on what state they lived in and how long the process took. I've lived in over 40 houses, and the longest I ever spent in one place was just 10 months. I can't tell you how many times I've sat on a court bench, my toes not even reaching the floor, listening to my landlord (rightly) slam my parents, knowing that he/she would never see a cent of the money they deserved and was only wasting their time and money taking my relatives to court.
That in mind, I'm VERY, VERY apprehensive about signing onto anyone's lease. The questions below are presented with the assumption that I did NOT sign onto my roommate's lease with their landlord. People are telling me I'm ridiculous for thinking the way I am, however, so I'd like some feedback.
1. If my living in an apartment turns out to be a violation of the lease, could I be held responsible for violating the contract despite the fact that I never even signed onto the contract into the first place? Minus the fact that I'd be kicked out, would this be my roommate's legal problem, or mine as well?
2. With my budget ($450/mo in Saint Louis), I'll probably wind up renting with some not-too-upright citizens. Maybe I'm paranoid, but I'm definitely not putting it past those that I wind up living with to be evicted even in the short, 15-week span I'll be living with them. This makes me want to demand to see the lease, and pay my rent directly to their landlord (provided me being there isn't a violation of the lease, of course). With that in mind, say my roommate's nonpayment results in eviction. If I never sign onto a lease or enter a contract with the landlord, can he/she sue me for backpaid rent in a case that's likely to stand in court? If so, wtf do I do to prevent this mess from happening aside from crossing my fingers and hoping I can find a landlord who rents on a roommate by roommate basis or a roommate who, well, is a good person?
3. And if paying my rent to the landlord won't affect my legal obligation to the landlord, is refusing to pay my rent to anyone but the landlord reasonable in a roommate situation? I figure it's best to ask before I go off looking like an a*hole.
4. Lastly, say I can still be taken to court (in a non-frivolous manner) by my roommate's landlord (still hypothetical, fyi) for unpaid rent. I have my written contract with my roommate, as well as receipts for every month of rent that I paid. I'm entirely paid up, and I paid on time. In other words, I've completed all of my contractual obligations. Will this make any difference before a judge?
I know I'm thinking waaaay in advance and am putting all my eggs into a bad basket. I know. But frankly, I'm not gonna lie, I'm scared. I don't want to get screwed just because I'm going to Saint Louis to find a job and live on $8k in savings and thus, will be hard pressed to get a landlord to rent to me and may wind up having to rent a room and face the situation described above.
Last edited by Dr_Pepper; 08-03-2011 at 01:58 AM..
and pay my rent directly to their landlord (provided me being there isn't a violation of the lease, of course).
In my experience...
Usually when you move into a room in an existing situation - you pay your rent to the person you're living with - and they're responsible for the total mortgage or rent. And it's usually month to month, and the fact that you only want to stay 3.5 months would probably be no problem.
But if you're going to ask to pay directly to the landlord, that's not usually a 3.5 month deal - that's usually a put you on the lease, and you stay for at least a year situation. And you would have to agree to be totally responsible for the full rent, if your roommate leaves. Each of you would have to agree to that.
Really? Quite honestly, when my parents rent was paid it was maybe 70% of the time actually paid by them. Often a church would write a check, or my grandma, or some other poor citizen sucked in. As I recall, these third parties typically demanded that the check be written in the landlord's name, not my parents name.
...but if I, unsolicited by my roommate's landlord, mail him a check or money order every month helping toward my roommate's rent, that's cause for the landlord to stop by and ask to have me put on the lease? If so, could I refuse to be added but still stay and pay if there's nothing else prohibiting me? In that situation (put yourself in the shoes of someone living in the ghetto, lol), what would you do?
Thanks! +rep.
Also, just a clarification:
Quote:
And it's usually month to month, and the fact that you only want to stay 3.5 months would probably be no problem.
--if I rent a room, I only want to do so until April 1st, at least to begin with. I can only hope I would be able to find a job(s) (bagging groceries, making cold calls--whatever that'll pay $350 a week altogether) by then and get my own studio or 1 bedroom (which I know would likely be a yearlong obligation and definitely not month to month).
You can look on Craigslist for a room in a house. Sometimes it is a few roomates with one of them the owner, sometimes it is an older person needing extra income, some are furnished, some not. Drive around looking for "student room available" signs or something like that. Those situations are more flexible.
Wow - sorry to hear that. I can feel for ya as I grew up with a single mom and lived in about 27 places by the time I was 17. But anyway....
usual disclaimer - I am not an attorney and this is not a substitute for legal advice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Pepper
1. If my living in an apartment turns out to be a violation of the lease, could I be held responsible for violating the contract despite the fact that I never even signed onto the contract into the first place? Minus the fact that I'd be kicked out, would this be my roommate's legal problem, or mine as well?
If you move in and the lease does not allow the tenant to have friends move in or sublet, I wouldn't think you can be held responsible for violating the terms of a contract. If you didn't sign anything, you can't be held responsible. The likely scenario would be that the LL would give notice to the legal tenant for you to move out or be evicted. The only way you could be held responsible for anything would be if you did something in violation of the law, like destruction of property, drug use or sales etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Pepper
2. With my budget ($450/mo in Saint Louis), I'll probably wind up renting with some not-too-upright citizens. Maybe I'm paranoid, but I'm definitely not putting it past those that I wind up living with to be evicted even in the short, 15-week span I'll be living with them. This makes me want to demand to see the lease, and pay my rent directly to their landlord (provided me being there isn't a violation of the lease, of course). With that in mind, say my roommate's nonpayment results in eviction. If I never sign onto a lease or enter a contract with the landlord, can he/she sue me for backpaid rent in a case that's likely to stand in court? If so, wtf do I do to prevent this mess from happening aside from crossing my fingers and hoping I can find a landlord who rents on a roommate by roommate basis or a roommate who, well, is a good person?
If I understand this you are trying to make sure rent gets paid without getting roped into an obligation yes? And maybe without the LL finding out you are living there? Tricky tricky. Again, unless you sign something which says you agree to pay rent, you can't be held liable. The possible fact that you might be paying rent on behalf of a tenant does not result in an obligation. My advice to you since this seems like a possible delicate situation is to visit the LL personally and say you are paying rent for your friend, pay CASH and get a receipt in writing to the effect that it was for rent specifying which unit, month, date, how much etc. Put the receipts in a safe place just in case.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Pepper
3. And if paying my rent to the landlord won't affect my legal obligation to the landlord, is refusing to pay my rent to anyone but the landlord reasonable in a roommate situation? I figure it's best to ask before I go off looking like an a*hole.
Depends - if you get a formal sublet agreement from the legal tenant, you may be stuck paying the rent to them and if they blow it on beer (or whatever ) there is nothing you can do about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Pepper
4. Lastly, say I can still be taken to court (in a non-frivolous manner) by my roommate's landlord (still hypothetical, fyi) for unpaid rent. I have my written contract with my roommate, as well as receipts for every month of rent that I paid. I'm entirely paid up, and I paid on time. In other words, I've completed all of my contractual obligations. Will this make any difference before a judge?
I am not an attorney - but in general you can only be sued by someone you have a contract with. As long as you do not sign a lease/contract/agreement with the landlord they have no basis for suing you for unpaid rent. The only person who could sue you would be the roommate. Again, once they get your rent money they can do whatever they want with it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Pepper
...but if I, unsolicited by my roommate's landlord, mail him a check or money order every month helping toward my roommate's rent, that's cause for the landlord to stop by and ask to have me put on the lease? If so, could I refuse to be added but still stay and pay if there's nothing else prohibiting me? In that situation (put yourself in the shoes of someone living in the ghetto, lol), what would you do?
From what you are describing the LL might not even get bent out of shape over someone else living there as long as rent is being paid so you may be ok. The LL is the one holding the longer stick here so if they want you on the lease you may not have a choice. Once you sign a lease you are on the hook for the rent and anything else that comes with being on the lease.
Seriously is there any chance of finding another place to rent? Like maybe a room in a house from a nice person like SouthernBelle is suggesting? I don't want to pry into your life, but who needs the headaches it sounds like you are in for, and you might find someone with a large place, spare room who can use the cash.
If I were in your situation I'd try very hard to find a room in an owner's house for short term stay to avoid this potential issue. Another thing, I guess you can do is get a copy of the leasee's documented permission from the LL to allow additional residents at the apartment/abode and if there are terms pertaining to rent collection for additional residents, simply abide by them. I wouldn't agree to live someplace w/o documentation of the owner's permission.
@Frugal: thanks!!! I can only hope you're right. I haven't yet even so much as gone to an interview for a place that's for rent. I'm not moving until December, and I know that the listings that'll be available then won't be posted until at least October (which is when I'll be returning to Saint Louis, consequently). Right now, I've just been perusing the Craigslist ads, seeing what's available in my budget and where. Who I'll be able to rent from and under what circumstances remains to be determined.
The best way to avoid getting yourself into these situations is to get a job the minute you arrive - temp work, McDonalds, whatever it takes to get some money coming in. Don't allow yourself to end up in this kind of situation where you have to live with questionable people, wondering if eviction is around the corner each day. You don't need to live like that.
Since you are looking for strictly short term, and I'm assuming you don't have a lot of 'stuff' (furniture, etc) you may want to consider an extended stay hotel suite. A lady I know had to do this when her condo was damaged by fire, and she concluded that when she tallied her normal monthly bills in the condo, vs the weekly rate at the hotel, she was nearly breaking even. The chain she was staying in provided breakfast, she would take a yogurt and a piece of fruit with her and called that lunch.
She had a fully equipped kitchen, 24 hour maintenance, laundry on site, plus access to the gym, pool, etc. Maid service daily, newspaper delivered every morning, full cable service, etc. She had a cell phone, so never had to use the hotel phone with its outrageous prices. If you know you will be there for 3-4 months, you can often negotiate a lower rate than the standard weekly rates. No legal worries, plenty of privacy, lots of advantages to hotel living.
I agree. I really think you're WAY overthinking this whole situation. Once you start seriously looking for a place I'm sure everything will fall into place.
Particularly in this economy there are plenty of private owners out there who are looking to temporarily rent out a room in their home to help with expenses.
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) there is nothing you can do about it.
I haven't yet even so much as gone to an interview for a place that's for rent. I'm not moving until December, and I know that the listings that'll be available then won't be posted until at least October (which is when I'll be returning to Saint Louis, consequently). Right now, I've just been perusing the Craigslist ads, seeing what's available in my budget and where. Who I'll be able to rent from and under what circumstances remains to be determined. 
