Reasons We Didn't Relocate to Savannah (Nashville, White: appointed, real estate, renting)
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I am writing this post to provide insight (not sure if it is really needed) as to what we considered and thought about when making our decision about where to relocate our family.
I have been a reader of this forum for about two years as my wife and I had thought about, researched, contemplated , debated, planned, and now have started to embark upon a move from Manhattan to the South. Savannah is such a special place. It was at the top of my list all along until we finally had to pull the trigger and I couldn't justify choosing it over our final choice.
The factors we looked at are probably what you'd expect. I am including them here just as a spring board for those that might follow and inform their decision. I am also hoping that these concerns will turn out to be unfounded as time passes,
1. Crime - The time-frame during which we were looking was unfortunate as crime seemingly had been growing worse by the month. The increase in the amount and degree of gun violence was particularly troubling. In looking at the realtor sites that have shaded maps that indicate criminal activity made it look like there is an intransigent ring of crime around the historic district that occasionally spurts into other locations. Being from Manhattan, I told my wife that we had seen worse, that the activity was mostly restrained to the areas shaded, and that where we would be living in the historic district would be fine. She said that everybody thinks they are fine until they are faced with a gun on the street and that she wasn't willing to take a chance with our daughter's young life. Ugh.
2. Education - To be frank it seemed to us that there is a big divide when it comes to education along racial and income lines. We were told in confidence that anyone that has the ability to sends their kids to private schools as the public schools are for the poor and African American community. The information we found online did not seem to completely support this assertion but the abysmal grades on websites grading schools seemed to support it (although there were exceptions like Montessori and Savannah Arts that I pointed out). Again should we be willing to take chances with our daughters education and the future opportunities it is supposed to provide?
3. Employment - I have seen many comments online that disparage Savannah for the amount of employment opportunities. We did not find that to be the case but that may be due to the level of our education and experience. My wife has a masters in HR with 10 years experience at a big accounting firm while I have 20 years experience working in Telecom plus a law degree. With the recent changes to update Broughton street, the growth in shipping, the continued growth of higher education institutions, plus the ever blossoming tourisim industry there seems to be a solid base here for employment. All that said, I can not discount what others have told us about their kids having to move away to find good entry level work and sustainable jobs.
4. Culture - Our family is biracial and while racial tensions do not seem to be high, or a big issue for the city, there seems to be still something there. My sense is that no matter where we go in the US this can be more or less the case based on the local community you live in and deal with on a daily basis. Perhaps our concerns are totally unfounded, but there does seem to be invisible lines in Savannah - lines that are not crossed. Further, on visits to the area we have met with some uncomfortable exchanges where we did not expect to find them.
I am disappointed we weren't able to choose Savannah but am hopeful for others who pick Savannah as I think it is destined for great things.
I can see the concerns on all but #4. In my experience of living both above and below the Mason-Dixon line I can say with absolute certainty that racial tension exists EVERYWHERE. Actually, it was probably worse in my little corner of Pennsylvania growing up in the 70s and 80s (and probably still today) than it is in Savannah. If there are geographic lines in Savannah, they are pretty much economic, and to be fair, there is a strong correlation along racial lines that way. But, in my view, that's the determining factor, not race. And, for what it's worth, this town is just about 50/50, and we've had White and Black mayors, and White and Black council members (serving the same districts and At-Large posts, too). Is there racial tension here? Of course, but nothing out of line with racial tension found these days in New York City, or any other average place in America. I have friends here who belong to biracial families.
I can see the concerns on all but #4. In my experience of living both above and below the Mason-Dixon line I can say with absolute certainty that racial tension exists EVERYWHERE. Actually, it was probably worse in my little corner of Pennsylvania growing up in the 70s and 80s (and probably still today) than it is in Savannah. If there are geographic lines in Savannah, they are pretty much economic, and to be fair, there is a strong correlation along racial lines that way. But, in my view, that's the determining factor, not race. And, for what it's worth, this town is just about 50/50, and we've had White and Black mayors, and White and Black council members (serving the same districts and At-Large posts, too). Is there racial tension here? Of course, but nothing out of line with racial tension found these days in New York City, or any other average place in America. I have friends here who belong to biracial families.
Yeah, I wasn't going to comment on this thread at all because I feel it's nothing but a drive-by. Time will tell if and when the OP comes back to the discussion. But even if we never hear from him again, someone else may stumble upon the thread while researching a move to Savannah.
I agree with you: Points 1-3 are valid. As to 4, I think it's important to point out that I see biracial / multiracial families and couples in Savannah all the time. In fact, they stand out to me not because they're unusual or weird or rare, but because I see so many of them around town. You even see gay male couples and female lesbian couples walking around holding hands. The other day, I watched as two young men walked ahead of me down several blocks of Whitaker and Broughton streets arm-in-arm -- and not one passerby did a double-take or gave them the time of day.
Yes, I see this all the time in Savannah. And always in the back of my mind I think, "If only all those people on CD who think the South is nothing but a bunch of backwards ignorant racists were here …"
Yes more crime than an average small southern city, but also more progressive. I think with the right leadership both elected officials and community leaders, we'll see ourselves through this crime wave and into a great time for Savannah. It's morning in Savannah, soon. To rather roughly paraphrase a past President.
Thanks for asking about the plan B. In a sense there wasn’t one; instead it was a list of options.
In writing my post I had sought to add something to the relocation discussion that I hadn’t seen when I looked online. In addition, I initially did not include our ultimate selection as I wanted to avoid shifting the posts’ focus to comparing Savannah to other places. Perhaps that was an error and I should have included our methodology for making our decision and what the ultimate choice was.
We had set up a spreadsheet with rows listing potential places to relocate and the columns listing decision factors - -
The four factors I included in my post were just that, the deciding factors for us that caused us not to elect to relocate to Savannah, it did not contain all the reasons we think of Savannah so highly. In my experience I have found it more useful to know why people choose not to relocate to a given location rather than why they do. There are a million posts about thinking of moving but few after the fact indicating decisions made. I thought this would be useful. I hope that anyone reading this would just use it as the experience and opinion of one person and not a stated fact about the area.
As for finding the same issues in other areas I would just indicate that we all realize in making the choice to relocate, you engage in a balancing act and that no place is perfect in and of it self. We are all just trying to find a place that is the right fit and that is different for each person / family.
Ultimately we chose the Triangle area. My wife has a position lined up in Raleigh and I have alternative work locations to chose from in Cary and Chapel hill. We will be moving to the area in the next month or so and will be renting first so we can really get to know the area before making a decision on where to purchase a home.
Hi CoastalGAGuy, Newsboy, and SavannahLife
When writing my post I initially wasn’t going to include the thoughts you referenced in Issue 4 Culture. I finally decided to include it as it was something I would want to read about and explore for myself if I were starting my search all over. My intention was not to brand or label Savannah as racist or hostile to biracial families. However my experience there made me feel it was something worth mentioning for those who might come after me to consider.
Specifically two incidents led me to feel that I ought to include it. The first was an occasion while I was shopping in a supermarket and was asked point blank how much I paid for my daughter. I was incredulous at the question and moved on without responding. The second instance occurred when my wife was getting the car which was parked a few blocks away from where we were looking at houses. Essentially she was asked what she was doing walking in that area (specifically referencing her race.
Honestly I do not think this is the norm for Savannah and it wasn’t something that happened to us every day we were there. We made several trips and it was during our longest stay that both occasions occurred. But I must say it gave us pause and when we looked at the totality of factors it was definitely up there and deserved mention.
I understand that people can say that these are two random occurrences and that they might not happen again in years of living there. People can debate whether the lack of economic and racial diversity in public schools along with concentration of lower income housing is something that may have contributed to such ignorant behavior. People can say that this could happen anywhere; but the problem is it didn’t. It happened in Savannah and not in the other places we looked at and visited (even so it was not the main reason we did not choose Savannah but one among a few). It could well be that it was bad luck; but it is what it is. Regardless it was something I experienced and would want to know if others relocating and exploring the area experienced.
I hope that anyone who reads this post takes it as one person’s thoughts and experience and does not give it undue weight but instead just adds it to an array of factors that they will use to make their final decision on where they choose to live.
Hi SavannahLife
I agree with you. I think the crime wave shall pass with good government as it did here in New York; I also agree that Savannah has a bright future ahead.
All makes sense to me. Think if those things happened to me, I'd move somewhere else to.
But wouldn't have thought of the Triangle area. Best of luck to you and the family.
I agree w/ your all of your points (especially the crime) except for #4. My wife is black and looks it. I'm white and look it. Her sons from a previous marriage to another white guy look white, except for her youngest son who looks more like a big Polynesian guy w/ darker features. We've honestly never had any issues around this anywhere in the US.
But that doesn't mean we're going to move to Hattiesburg, Mississippi either! You have to exercise some common sense. Small towns have small minds, and that's true whether or not you're up North or down South. Savannah is a relatively small place in the old South, and the thing is, the races are often kept somewhat apart by culture not racism. The churches, food, dialect and lots of other things are different. If we lived in the old South, it's quite natural for people to reminiscence about their pasts, and the pasts of blacks is very different than the pasts of whites. Our friends would not have that much in common in that regard. I know, it's been done.
Good government in New york? Thanks for that. I needed a smile. I am not sure there is any such thing as good government. No, I'm sure there isn't. As someone much wiser than I once said, that government which governs least governs best. Most people just want the government to get the heck out of their lives, both Democratic and Republican. Ever worked in politics? I wouldn't let those people within 100 yards of my family, friends or pets.
As I read your original post I can 'relate' to some of the concerns you have expressed especially those in topic #4
Historically, folks who haven't lived through certain experiences, frankly can't recognize what you identified.
I think your post reflects good observation and judgment
Best of Luck
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