Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Florida > Tampa Bay
 [Register]
Tampa Bay Tampa - St. Petersburg - Clearwater
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-02-2013, 12:59 PM
 
121 posts, read 217,333 times
Reputation: 108

Advertisements

IMO "builders" are wasting a LOT of materials, and overcharge buyers for it. A Scam really. They buy cheap cabinets, countertops, flooring, fixtures, appliances etc, and then mark up the price of the house to where it is a flat out scam considering that the materials alone don't make up 1/4 of the price it cost them to built it. They know that of course. It would be fair that say for $150K you get the walls/roof, and for $50k you get whatever countertop YOU(the buyer) want, tiles, flooring, etc., rather than waste those cheap materials that could be used for the low income instead, to give them a cleaner/newer look for cheap. BUT definitely NOT charge middle/high incomes for cheap building materials; that is a SCAM.

Regarding this:
Quote:
Maybe flipped houses are good for community overall (no empty houses, neighbourhood houses appraised higher, the outside look of the vacant house was taken care of incl. landscape), but I personally will not buy a house from the investor.
I disagree; "flipping", even though "legal" (because I am sure there is a loop hole somewhere that allowed for it at some point), is a SCAM as well. The buyer is getting scammed because the buyer gets charged a premium for some updates, but not true value. Especially if the home is an unpopular location, and not closer to better school etc. The buyer also doesn't get to choose their own materials, and in some cases ends up ripping off perfectly fine cabinets for the ones they "really" wanted. Also A WASTE.

Too much WASTE going on. Buyers need to get smarter.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-02-2013, 01:23 PM
 
3,826 posts, read 5,809,042 times
Reputation: 2401
Quote:
Originally Posted by algia10 View Post
IMO "builders" are wasting a LOT of materials, and overcharge buyers for it. A Scam really. They buy cheap cabinets, countertops, flooring, fixtures, appliances etc, and then mark up the price of the house to where it is a flat out scam considering that the materials alone don't make up 1/4 of the price it cost them to built it. They know that of course. It would be fair that say for $150K you get the walls/roof, and for $50k you get whatever countertop YOU(the buyer) want, tiles, flooring, etc., rather than waste those cheap materials that could be used for the low income instead, to give them a cleaner/newer look for cheap. BUT definitely NOT charge middle/high incomes for cheap building materials; that is a SCAM.

Regarding this:
I disagree; "flipping", even though "legal" (because I am sure there is a loop hole somewhere that allowed for it at some point), is a SCAM as well. The buyer is getting scammed because the buyer gets charged a premium for some updates, but not true value. Especially if the home is an unpopular location, and not closer to better school etc. The buyer also doesn't get to choose their own materials, and in some cases ends up ripping off perfectly fine cabinets for the ones they "really" wanted. Also A WASTE.

Too much WASTE going on. Buyers need to get smarter.
I am not an attorney, but I don't see how it might be a scam. Investers are not making buyers to pay for their houses. Buyers can walk away if the feel the price is too high. It's their choice. Some houses are getting sold for dirt cheap on court house steps, and it's legal to buy these houses for cash (just example). Not every buyer can afford to buy ruined house with cash and invest more cash into it to make it look nice.
My research shows that most houses I was interested in were purchased by CA based investors. And not even one of them were sold for listing price... not even close to listing price. And I see many still on the market...
So, I don't think it's a scam.. If we will have buyers who willing to pay for flipped houses, investors will be around...
But I do have a problem with investors overbidding other offers from people who are planning to live in it. Whose fault is it? I think lenders who accept cash offers. Why? Because they already burned once *many time* with people who were not able to make mortgage payments...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-02-2013, 03:02 PM
 
27,214 posts, read 46,754,781 times
Reputation: 15667
It is not a scam since with due diligence and a good realtor your realtor should be able to give you all the info I gave you and than it is the OP's decision to buy or to walk.

Nobody is holding a gun to anybody's head and this is a free country and it was disclosed.

The house is in a flood zone, meaning higher home owners ins. and nothing has been changed in between the last sale and now if you read the MLS input and there have no permits been requested so no new roof, no new A/C...

The previous buyer and nw seller probably husband of the realtor are trying o make money and there is nothing illegal about it since she is disclosing that she is related.

We have public records and the property appraisers website to check for the last sale and I would check who will conduct the closing and if the title company is owned by the realtors family or office since her license is with the previous buyer!

Is it is a nice house...? It looks nice but the just value is $ 160K and with some adding it would definately be a high price for $ 200K so $ 239K as it is now listed for is overpriced to me but it is what a person will pay for what determines the price!

I believe an appraiser will not appraise the house for $ 239K and no mortgage company will provide a loan for it...

As a cash investor and broker/owner I would not buy it, but that is me...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-02-2013, 05:40 PM
 
Location: Florida & Arizona
5,978 posts, read 7,382,129 times
Reputation: 7604
You can't call this a scam anymore than you could a dealer buying a car at the auto auction, cleaning it up and selling it at a nice profit.

The nature of the market has been such that if someone has the cash, they can get some very attractive deals at low prices that can be easily flipped. I know an attorney that formed an LLC with two other businessmen that they use to do nothing more than buy distressed properties, often on the courthouse steps, and clean up/fix up and have them on the market within a month or two at a handsome profit.

No scam here - just open market capitalism - they have the cash so they can move quickly when these properties become available. The County wants 100% cash within 24 hours of a foreclosure sale. No lender is going to get you that kind of money on that short notice.

Perfectly legal in all respects. It's just the way the market works.

RM
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-02-2013, 05:46 PM
 
27,214 posts, read 46,754,781 times
Reputation: 15667
Quote:
Originally Posted by MortonR View Post
You can't call this a scam anymore than you could a dealer buying a car at the auto auction, cleaning it up and selling it at a nice profit.

The nature of the market has been such that if someone has the cash, they can get some very attractive deals at low prices that can be easily flipped. I know an attorney that formed an LLC with two other businessmen that they use to do nothing more than buy distressed properties, often on the courthouse steps, and clean up/fix up and have them on the market within a month or two at a handsome profit.

No scam here - just open market capitalism - they have the cash so they can move quickly when these properties become available. The County wants 100% cash within 24 hours of a foreclosure sale. No lender is going to get you that kind of money on that short notice.

Perfectly legal in all respects. It's just the way the market works.

RM
I agree with you and I checked this agent and the brokerage a little bit and noticed they buy and flip and do some painting and use the same furniture to stage it.

Nothing major but they make it look nice and if people pay for cosmetic improvements like some paint and perhaps some sod....than I don't call it a scam but a smart way of legally making money.

There are licensed agents who don't disclose that they are related, and that is a scam...

Again I wouldn't buy it, but that is my choice.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-03-2013, 04:59 AM
 
27,214 posts, read 46,754,781 times
Reputation: 15667
Always check who is your realtor and often the unknown small brokerages do business like this....they buy and flip homes and only have a real estate license to save on the commission and make more money.

Often the owner of the homes has no license but their wife has and the owner is often the owner of the brokerage which doesn't require a license, only a broker of record.

3 day cash buyers is the same the owner doesn't disclose that he is the owner of the brokerage and does the same...but they also get stuck with homes they can't flip and loose money selling them.

We dealt with offices like that and only after research you figure things out. Most of these brokerages have agents that recently got their real estate license like The agent in the OP listing.

Many times they only allow a certain title company and their fees are very high so they make money on that too. Therefore we now put in our contracts that fees need to be disclosed upfront and we have a back out for our clients if the fees are inflated later on.

Be smarter than the people who like to think they are legally smart...although many of these owners of small brokerages who do things like this are working in a grey part...

If you choose Coldwelll Banker, Remax, Etc. you don't have to worry about these things too much and things will be more open and clear.

Any office with " sell fast, 3 day cash buyers ( new wealth realty) and fast action Jackson who's wife Carole Jackson has a license and they buy homes up cheap, mostly with sinkholes and than don't disclose the sinkhole and often don't disclose that they are related since they use all these LLC....

Use common sense and wise advise from realtors with offices that are around the block for a long time with a good name.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-03-2013, 09:46 AM
 
5 posts, read 6,487 times
Reputation: 15
Hey Everybody

We put in another offer, it was countered at too high a price and we walked. I'm glad I ran it by you guys. I learned a whole bunch while I was at it and I am thankful for your honest opinions. BTW I'm also looking for a new Realtor.

Thank you again
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-03-2013, 11:27 AM
 
27,214 posts, read 46,754,781 times
Reputation: 15667
Good luck with your further search and I believe you made a good decision. Always use your brain and not your heart when to buy a home which should be mostly a business decision to avoid later regrets.

If the hous is not yet on the market than wait since many will come on the market soner than later since a lot of people are waiting to move...some prices may go up a little but it will not go up as fast as it went down and if people are smart and notbuying these so called fast mini fix uppers for prices that should incl. a new roof, new A/C, etc. than the prices will gradually go up and not inflated.

In my community an investor bought a REO and fixed it up a little bit soit looks much nicer with minimum investments...maybe smart since he made a lot of mone and now the new investor tries to rent it out for $ 2150 while the current rental amounts over there are for similar sqft $ 1550.- so it is on the market for a whle and sitting empty!

For us all this ale willbring th values up in an inflated unrealistic way but it is better than going down. The other upside is the house now looks nice...The down side is that the house is empty for a long time and the chances are that the A/C's will be gone or someone will again damage it and it will start all over. I checked who bought it and this investor bought many overpriced homes...so not a very smart person behin that company or not his own money he used to buy them...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-03-2013, 12:16 PM
 
3,826 posts, read 5,809,042 times
Reputation: 2401
VagusX,
I am glad you walked away from that house for 2 reasons - first will be for misrepresentation of that property and second - to let investors have this house for as long as possible.

Bentlebee,
I agree with 100%. Very well said!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-03-2013, 01:44 PM
 
1,024 posts, read 1,801,136 times
Reputation: 982
Quote:
Originally Posted by VagusX View Post
Hey Everybody

We put in another offer, it was countered at too high a price and we walked. I'm glad I ran it by you guys. I learned a whole bunch while I was at it and I am thankful for your honest opinions. BTW I'm also looking for a new Realtor.

Thank you again

Good for you! Good luck on finding another home. Please let us know where you decide to settle. It's always interesting to see where people end up.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Settings
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2020 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Florida > Tampa Bay

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:40 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top