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As a downtown resident who will pick up and move to the suburbs the minute I graduate and start making money, I think I can answer.
1) Public schools - if I ever have a kid, the day he turns five, I want him (her?) in a good school. In this economy, private school is likely a stretch to afford, if not out of reach altogether. So, locating where there's a good school district will become an absolute necessity. Because schools constitute the lion's share of property taxes - might as well get your money's worth.
2) Yard space (or space in general) - I'm tired of having to turn down my stereo set after about 8 PM.
3) City taxes - Between property taxes and city income taxes, it's simply too expensive to live here. And I don't get the level of service or amenities that justify those taxes. Ohio is weird in this respect - if you live in an unincorporated township, the township can't levy any form of income tax (while cities can). Consequently, taxes are far, far lower in townships - and there's tons of development in the far-flung areas.
4) Noise - Ties back in #2 somewhat, but the endless traffic, horns, helicopters, etc. bugs me.
5) Safety - There's been two burglaries on my block in the past month. 'Nuff said.
As a downtown resident who will pick up and move to the suburbs the minute I graduate and start making money, I think I can answer.
1) Public schools - if I ever have a kid, the day he turns five, I want him (her?) in a good school. In this economy, private school is likely a stretch to afford, if not out of reach altogether. So, locating where there's a good school district will become an absolute necessity. Because schools constitute the lion's share of property taxes - might as well get your money's worth.
2) Yard space (or space in general) - I'm tired of having to turn down my stereo set after about 8 PM.
3) City taxes - Between property taxes and city income taxes, it's simply too expensive to live here. And I don't get the level of service or amenities that justify those taxes. Ohio is weird in this respect - if you live in an unincorporated township, the township can't levy any form of income tax (while cities can). Consequently, taxes are far, far lower in townships - and there's tons of development in the far-flung areas.
4) Noise - Ties back in #2 somewhat, but the endless traffic, horns, helicopters, etc. bugs me.
5) Safety - There's been two burglaries on my block in the past month. 'Nuff said.
Hi Hensleya,
Good points, but as far as stereo noise is concerned, you really shouldn't have the stereo blaring past 8 anyway, city or suburb. That's the whole point of using ear plugs/head phones, and the whole point of being a good neighbor.
I also feel that the size of the city might influence someone's choices. In a small/mid-sized city, you're more apt to find better schools/more space than in larger cities, so perhaps you might still consider city living. But in very large metro areas, this is less true..
I also feel that the size of the city might influence someone's choices. In a small/mid-sized city, you're more apt to find better schools/more space than in larger cities, so perhaps you might still consider city living. But in very large metro areas, this is less true..
Good point. I was happy as a clam living in Cincinnati, but I do not want to live in Philadelphia, income taxes notwithstanding. Philadelphia is a kazillion times more dense than Cincinnati, and I prefer not living on top of other people.
The city's income taxes, though, were the reason we decided to live in the suburbs; my late spouse was self-employed, and the difference between paying around 4 percent in income taxes and 1 percent was quite significant to him. I work in Philadelphia, but still pay a lower income tax rate than a resident, and pay no income taxes at all to my home municipality.
What I don't get is the bigger lawns. If there were lawns in the city, wouldn't you just be transforming the city into the suburbs? The premise is interesting, but I would think the following would be relevant:
1. Schools - This is mentioned.
2. Lower Crime - Assume that neighborhoods in cities that are currently plagued with crime get all cleaned up.
3. Pricetag - Assume that all those "safe" neighborhoods with good schools are as reasonably priced as the surrounding suburbs.
What I don't get is the bigger lawns. If there were lawns in the city, wouldn't you just be transforming the city into the suburbs? The premise is interesting, but I would think the following would be relevant:
1. Schools - This is mentioned.
2. Lower Crime - Assume that neighborhoods in cities that are currently plagued with crime get all cleaned up.
3. Pricetag - Assume that all those "safe" neighborhoods with good schools are as reasonably priced as the surrounding suburbs.
True. To make the concept reasonable, I suppose pricetag would vary no differently than suburban neighborhoods with good schools and low crime. Location and desirability would cause the variance, just as it does in the burbs. The purpose of the assumption being that neighborhoods with good schools and low crime aren't so expensive that the middle class can't afford them.
Agreed in a sense these amentities already exist, this would mean basically no delineation between urban and suburban environments and lead to less diversity for personal choice
Also nearly ALL cities already have such amentities witin their borders and some suburban areas have either the same issues and/or lack of space
It would have to be a group effort, and not just a family or two. I don't know too many people wo want to play the role of "urban pioneer" all by themselves..esp if the adventure fails to take hold and they become stuck with a property they can't unload quickly.
I should point out that some large cities do have "suburban-looking" parts; Boston, in particular has sections of Hyde Park and almost all of West Roxbury that could easily be mistaken for postwar suburbia. But you have to know where to look..
"What would be the point?"
Perhaps to cut down on car/gas usage, or even to cut down to one ( or no) car; better access to major cultural institutions ( museums, stadiums, parks, concerts, restaurants) that are still predominantly in city centers, taking advantage of public transit, perhaps put an end to never-ending sprawl, etc...
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