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Have you seen the articles about companies with unlimited, untracked vacation?
Netflix supposedly does this. And Richard Branson apparently is going to try it at Virgin.
From what I've read Netflix vacations don't even require prior approval.
I think it's crazy. How can you run a company not knowing who is working -- you need SOME kind of schedule don't you?
The articles say people who work at the companies that do this LOVE it. They say it makes them MORE responsible. And supposedly where companies have done this people have taken LESS time off. Yeah, right.
Says they feel respected because they're trust to get their work done, and there's a 'reverse' pressure NOT to be the one who takes a lot of time off.
All I know is it wouldn't work at my job. No way. Not a chance. Could NOT be done.
I think that this type of policy is 50% company marketing and 50% psychological effect. Companies want to be able to boast about their work-life balance with claims such as having "unlimited vacation." However, I think the psychological impact of such a policy on a typical worker makes this much less of a good deal than one may initially think.
Just think about it... Most companies have a set, finite number of vacation days that may allow X days carry-over to the next year, but eventually expire. These days are your benefit and it is not only allowed, but is expected that an employee will use them all. Perhaps you've been at a company a while and have earned 6 weeks. This is a good chunk of time; however, it is unlikely that an employer will think negatively of you for using these days... After all, they expire.
Now look at the unlimited vacation days scenario. No expiring days, no 'earned days'. It's simply a "take what you need" policy. Psychologically, a good employee will be skeptical about how many days is actually acceptable. If work is always busy, is taking any days off acceptable? Perhaps you manage to slip a few long weekends in... My point is that it is very unlikely that you'd see employees with "unlimited vacation" taking much time off, and almost certainly will not see them taking 6 weeks off a year such as in the first scenario. And if they do? Guess who's got a target on their back when layoffs come around.
Have you seen the articles about companies with unlimited, untracked vacation?
Netflix supposedly does this. And Richard Branson apparently is going to try it at Virgin.
From what I've read Netflix vacations don't even require prior approval.
I think it's crazy. How can you run a company not knowing who is working -- you need SOME kind of schedule don't you?
The articles say people who work at the companies that do this LOVE it. They say it makes them MORE responsible. And supposedly where companies have done this people have taken LESS time off. Yeah, right.
Says they feel respected because they're trust to get their work done, and there's a 'reverse' pressure NOT to be the one who takes a lot of time off.
All I know is it wouldn't work at my job. No way. Not a chance. Could NOT be done.
I think if employers trust their employees it will work. Is there possible that some people will...... Of course nothing human beings do is perfect nothing. So if saying that it won't be perfectly executed is an issue that a call for us to do nothing ever.
It comes down how you view other human beings. If you think lowly of people this idea can't work. If you don't then you think the idea will work.
A position that has objective performance measurements, and non-integration of job functions with others (like an assembly line) has the ability to do this.
A person on an assembly line, or a person who works in a team setting with their skill set, would not be able to have an unlimited vacation set up as others depend on the person doing their jobs. A person who does not have objective performance standards also would be difficult to have unlimited vacation as their job performance are more subjective in nature.
A person who works alone, or has an incredibly long lead time on their job function as part of a team can have an unlimited vacation policy. A person with objective performance measurements, such as "you complete this specific task by this time, and we measure you on this and nothing else" can have such a vacation policy.
While it looks good on paper, the job function most likely would not ever allow someone to be away for no longer than two weeks to a month. Hard to take "unlimited vacation", when you have tasks that need to be completed two to three weeks out all of the time.
If it was paid vacation, my employer could not function.
If it was unpaid, it could function because the people who would choose to go unpaid are the same people who currently use all of their sick time and vacation time as soon as they earn it. They're not reliable and they aren't very productive either, so it's no skin of our back since those of us who need the income already pick up their slack.
My current job has this, as do other tech startups in San Francisco.
It's never been an issue for us. We all check with the other team leads to give them the heads up (it is not asking permission, it's just make sure there are no deadlines we weren't aware of) before committing to vacation plans. We all know who is on vacation because communicating with each other is the norm. We are all responsible people, and made sure nothing gets "dropped" when we are away by planning ahead.
Some companies advertises it as a "perk", my company doesn't. It was done mostly because it was one less thing to keep track of.
For me, it was pretty much the same as my previous job where PTO is tracked. It did come in handy when I first joined, I already had a week of vacation planned (and tickets bought). I would not have had enough paid vacation days for it after only 1 month. I do feel more freedom and flexibility in planning my vacations and days off. The only disadvantage would be if I leave the company, there would be no "unused PTO payout" (required in California).
Best Buy had this as well. The concept is called ROWE (Results Oriented Work Environment). Basically, it comes down to the fact that you are given a responsibility/role to fill. As long as you are doing your job, you are free to set your own schedule. There is essentially no vacation policy (i.e. you don't accrue any). You take as much or as little as you want/need. The good is that you can as much as you want, as long as you get your S*&T done. The bad is that if you're too busy, you don't have anything accrued to be paid out if you leave.
While I've never worked in a company that had that as an official policy - I've certainly worked in departments/groups that functioned like that. And as long as you have disciplined/responsible people, it works fine. Scheduling meetings etc. wasn't an issue as long as everyone communicated their schedules ahead of time.
This obviously won't work for every type of job. So I can's speak to how Netflix does it. I believe Best Buy's policy only applied to the back-office staff (you wouldn't get that option working at one of their stores).
I fully support the ROWE methodology. The key here is that it's not for everyone. Some people have to watch the clock.
Unlimited vacation is a trick to avoid various state laws about vacation accrual. In practice it means nobody ever takes vacation, and the company doesn't have to pay out unused vacation days if the employee leaves.
Unlimited vacation is a trick to avoid various state laws about vacation accrual. In practice it means nobody ever takes vacation, and the company doesn't have to pay out unused vacation days if the employee leaves.
No, It's not a trick, at least in Netflix. But it's part of the total company philosophy that says they don't value the rules based process driven formula, because they find it stagnates creativity and growth, but the behavior based philosophy. No it would not work in most companies because it starts first and foremost on hiring and vetting the proper employees. Most people would not be able to adapt to it. If you do not fit, you are not hired, if you cannot adapt, you are fired. They apparently have high turnover. The ones that remain are highly rewarded, and yes vacations are encouraged. You can't simply say "OK everyone has free vacation" and expect it to work in a company. It's part of the entire company culture.
I find this philosophy actually quite refreshing, and this from someone that works in the compliance/audit related field. For those that want to know more, they can see the Netflix culture and values statement slides in the attached. It's amazing: Culture
Read this slide: "Most companies have complex policies about what you can expense, how you travel, what gifts you can accept, etc.
Plus they have whole departments to verify compliance.
Netflix policy for expense: "Act in Companies best interest" (5 words long)"
Last edited by Dd714; 09-28-2014 at 03:32 PM..
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