Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Actually it’s the mixed population that is growing while the East Indian and African populations are decreasing. The same is true for Trinidad. The mixed populations are the fastest growing in both places.
Yes, the mixed population in Guyana is growing, but the black or Creole population has remained relatively stable (i.e., with slight declines) and the East Indian population has declined massively. It's a matter of degree or magnitude. In the 1980 Census, East Indians were 51.9% of the population and blacks were 30.8%. Thirty-two years later, in Guyana's 2012 Census, East Indians had fallen to just 39.8% (a gaping 12.0%-point drop) and blacks were at 29.3% (a mere 1.5%-point drop).
Before independence, yes, the black population was shrinking relative to the East Indian population (East Indians have larger families). Independence and the violence, corruption and mayhem that followed it changed all that, however. After and since independence, East Indians have been seeking a safe haven abroad at much higher rates than blacks -- hence, their declining relative numbers.
Puerto Rico isnt comparable...as the society is the product of one group that subjugated the other two. Eventually as slavery ended and people mixed, things improved. They are also virtually Christian, with more being Catholic. However, colorism is an issue there.
In Guyana, neither of the largest groups subjugated the other but both were in survival mode. Plus Guyana’s diversity is far beyond that of Puerto Rico...as the former is ethnically and religiously diverse. It has had struggles but it is one of the few places in the world where Christians, Hindus and Muslims etc live peacefully overall (same for Trinidad and Suriname). Makes for some great festivals, foods and overall culture.
So that this very interesting thread does not get sidelined by discussions about race and race relations in Guyana, Trinidad, etc., I've started a new thread on the subject in the Americas forum.
To Reine de Coeur's point, although the African and Taino element in Puerto Rico is the result of subjugation, most Puerto Ricans on the island and on the U.S. mainland I've met are proud of their African and indigenous roots. The only Dominicans I've met that are openly proud of their African roots are younger ones raised in the U.S. It seems that in the DR many discount their African roots and emphasize their Taino origins, even though genetically the Taino element is relatively small.
Blacks in the former British, Dutch and French West Indies, including Guyana, Trinidad, and Suriname... and Belize have historically expected all other groups to assimilate to *Creole* culture... to blend with them. They tend to see themselves as the founding people. However, East Indians in Guyana (and Trinidad and Suriname) really want nothing of it generally, although they do speak Guyanese Creole (or their version of it).
Not really. Everyone recognizes the Amerindians as the First Nations, the founding peoples of the various lands.
Further, your comments regarding assimilation are too simplistic. Also T&T, Guyana and Suriname have major similarities but there are some difference in how the societies have developed too.
Assimilation was desired of all groups by the colonial powers but those powers did their best to keep the groups separate. Neither group expected blending with each other as far as mixing is concerned. Africans and Indians arrived in survival mode and continued in it.
Of course, African descendants in the Caribbean mixed more and tend to be more accepting of mixing due to slavery but Africans in general are not big on mixing with others. East Indians everywhere tend to shun mixing. After indentured labor, Indians were expected to do as the Africans, Chinese and other groups did in order to gain certain positions and be successful in society etc. It seems that Indians regrouped and then began to really move into all areas of society. Despite those who dislike it, mixing happened and continues to happen.
Cannot speak for Guyana or Suriname, but half of Trinidad is mixed, whether admittedly or not. A number of Indians have other backgrounds and the same for Africans. People may identify as what they predominantly are but mixed people are just as numerous as non-mixed. For example, there are a number of Indians with more recent Venezuelan background and one cannot always tell unless divulged. The African population has definitely mixed with various groups. There’s way more to the discussion though.
Btw, everyone speaks a local Creole...
Last edited by ReineDeCoeur; 09-01-2018 at 12:24 AM..
Yes, the mixed population in Guyana is growing, but the black or Creole population has remained relatively stable (i.e., with slight declines) and the East Indian population has declined massively. It's a matter of degree or magnitude. In the 1980 Census, East Indians were 51.9% of the population and blacks were 30.8%. Thirty-two years later, in Guyana's 2012 Census, East Indians had fallen to just 39.8% (a gaping 12.0%-point drop) and blacks were at 29.3% (a mere 1.5%-point drop).
Before independence, yes, the black population was shrinking relative to the East Indian population (East Indians have larger families). Independence and the violence, corruption and mayhem that followed it changed all that, however. After and since independence, East Indians have been seeking a safe haven abroad at much higher rates than blacks -- hence, their declining relative numbers.
So that this very interesting thread does not get sidelined by discussions about race and race relations in Guyana, Trinidad, etc., I've started a new thread on the subject in the Americas forum.
To Reine de Coeur's point, although the African and Taino element in Puerto Rico is the result of subjugation, most Puerto Ricans on the island and on the U.S. mainland I've met are proud of their African and indigenous roots. The only Dominicans I've met that are openly proud of their African roots are younger ones raised in the U.S. It seems that in the DR many discount their African roots and emphasize their Taino origins, even though genetically the Taino element is relatively small.
The majority of Puerto Ricans are predominantly of Spanish/European heritage. The African and the Taino were outnumbered by the descendants of the Spanish and assimilation was inevitable. Puerto Ricans generally recognized their mixed heritage but those who are darker suffer more discrimination. Many will say that there is no racism and push that idea. Nothing wrong with promoting the ideal but the colorism/racism is there...
I personally have not felt the discounting of African roots among Dominicans as much as people claim. It’s there, certainly. But not identifying as black shouldn’t be equated with denial of African heritage which people tend to do. The African is melded all through the DR, as much as the Spanish. The DR just feels like a mixed place.
The majority of Puerto Ricans are predominantly of Spanish/European heritage. The African and the Taino were outnumbered by the descendants of the Spanish and assimilation was inevitable. Puerto Ricans generally recognized their mixed heritage but those who are darker suffer more discrimination. Many will say that there is no racism and push that idea. Nothing wrong with promoting the ideal but the colorism/racism is there...
I personally have not felt the discounting of African roots among Dominicans as much as people claim. It’s there, certainly. But not identifying as black shouldn’t be equated with denial of African heritage which people tend to do. The African is melded all through the DR, as much as the Spanish. The DR just feels like a mixed place.
But people are free to self-identify with any culture, no matter their ancestry. Why self-denial?
The same happened in Europe as former Celtics became Latin, former Latins became Germany, just culture.
But people are free to self-identify with any culture, no matter their ancestry. Why self-denial?
The same happened in Europe as former Celtics became Latin, former Latins became Germany, just culture.
The whole issue is about so-called race, not culture. People claim that Dominicans are denying their heritage by not identifying as “black.” To me, not using the term “black”’ does not mean someone is denying their heritage. The majority of Dominicans are mixed and identify that way. Imo, that makes sense.
The whole issue is about so-called race, not culture. People claim that Dominicans are denying their heritage by not identifying as “black.” To me, not using the term “black”’ does not mean someone is denying their heritage. The majority of Dominicans are mixed and identify that way. Imo, that makes sense.
It's an American-centric viewpoint for Americans to tell Dominicans to stop acting Dominican and start acting 'American'
The whole issue is about so-called race, not culture. People claim that Dominicans are denying their heritage by not identifying as “black.” To me, not using the term “black”’ does not mean someone is denying their heritage. The majority of Dominicans are mixed and identify that way. Imo, that makes sense.
Whoever, if they consider that black is the past, something mildewy, decaying and chusma, they are free ti be whatever they want to be,
There are white people that want to be black, wigger, chinese thay want to beblac or klingon, and domonicans want to be dominicans with no black parafernalia, at least many of them, They are free.
It's an American-centric viewpoint for Americans to tell Dominicans to stop acting Dominican and start acting 'American'
Agreed and it’s really nonsensical, imho.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
