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It's an American-centric viewpoint for Americans to tell Dominicans to stop acting Dominican and start acting 'American'
Besides, in places like Cibao and the upper classes of Santo Domingo and Bani, Dominicans can lean Euro big time. It's overlooked but there's many Dominicans that don't "look Dominican" in the eyes of others.
I wonder how they're supposed to feel about being labeled "black." Ditto for Brazilians.
Whoever, if they consider that black is the past, something mildewy, decaying and chusma, they are free ti be whatever they want to be,
There are white people that want to be black, wigger, chinese thay want to beblac or klingon, and domonicans want to be dominicans with no black parafernalia, at least many of them, They are free.
No dispute from me on that. I don’t care what people consider themselves.
After the British pulled out of Guyana, in one community, Linden or Buxton, I think, the local blacks attacked and savagely beat the local East Indians and raped the women. It was retribution because the blacks or *Creoles* thought the East Indians had sided with the British prior to independence. East Indians have been leaving Guyana in droves for decades since. They are still the object of intimidation by blacks. Blacks are big, burly and physically strong by East Indian standards. Blacks bully the more economically successful, but physically frailer East Indians and have not figured out how to emulate their success --> envy.
The East Indians never sided with the British in Guyana before the Independence.And the name of the village was Buxton which was black/African based while the rival village Lusignan was East Indian.
It wasn't just one incident it was several,but a major contributing factor was there was a rumor going around that the East Indians had attacked a boy ,and so the PNC (a gangster machine political group)attacked the East Indians.There had also been attacks by East Indians in villages along the East Coast of Demerara some of them were young kids.
Since the British were going to give Guyana independence PNC was opting for administration of the government.
Before then Indians and Blacks were in one party like the UDP, UF, and even the current East Indian based PPP .
East Indians in Guyana are in no way push overs, just like an East Indian wouldn't venture into a black village neither would a black roam into a East Indian village.
Believe it or not,blacks were leaving in masses in 70s and 80s when the black based PNC ruled.
Blacks actually cannot bully any as you say economically successful Indians because the Indians there would just hire gunmen to take on any potential threat, and yes they could even hire Black gunmen too.This is why Roger Khan a Guyanese kingpin used many black soldiers like Ricardo Johnson to take on phantom squads..
Being big and burly in this age means nothing when anyone can pack a firearm.
Blacks basically intimidate other blacks in Guyana, for a piece of the pie.
The East Indians never sided with the British in Guyana before the Independence.And the name of the village was Buxton which was black/African based while the rival village Lusignan was East Indian.
It wasn't just one incident it was several,but a major contributing factor was there was a rumor going around that the East Indians had attacked a boy ,and so the PNC (a gangster machine political group)attacked the East Indians.There had also been attacks by East Indians in villages along the East Coast of Demerara some of them were young kids.
Since the British were going to give Guyana independence PNC was opting for administration of the government.
Before then Indians and Blacks were in one party like the UDP, UF, and even the current East Indian based PPP .
East Indians in Guyana are in no way push overs, just like an East Indian wouldn't venture into a black village neither would a black roam into a East Indian village.
Believe it or not,blacks were leaving in masses in 70s and 80s when the black based PNC ruled.
Blacks actually cannot bully any as you say economically successful Indians because the Indians there would just hire gunmen to take on any potential threat, and yes they could even hire Black gunmen too.This is why Roger Khan a Guyanese kingpin used many black soldiers like Ricardo Johnson to take on phantom squads..
Being big and burly in this age means nothing when anyone can pack a firearm.
Blacks basically intimidate other blacks in Guyana, for a piece of the pie.
I read in a history book on Guyana not that the East Indians sided with the British, but that blacks perceived that East Indians sided with the British against them.
The PNC was a disaster for everybody in the country. However, numerically and proportionally more East Indians than blacks have left the country.
I wonder if Georgetown is a black or an East Indian town. I spent just one evening there. It's not a pretty place, but I like the West Indian music and the Hindustani music played on local radio stations. My guess is that after dark East Indians (and others... really, anybody with any sense) stay behind locked doors with their cutlasses, machetes, and guns.
I have also heard stories of vengeance attacks (arson, basically) against successful East Indian owned businesses in Guyana following East Indian electoral victories, as well as the beating and rape of East Indian women in broad daylight in Georgetown following these victories.
I read in a history book on Guyana not that the East Indians sided with the British, but that blacks perceived that East Indians sided with the British against them.
The PNC was a disaster for everybody in the country. However, numerically and proportionally more East Indians than blacks have left the country.
I wonder if Georgetown is a black or an East Indian town. I spent just one evening there. It's not a pretty place, but I like the West Indian music and the Hindustani music played on local radio stations. My guess is that after dark East Indians (and others... really, anybody with any sense) stay behind locked doors with their cutlasses, machetes, and guns.
I have also heard stories of vengeance attacks (arson, basically) against successful East Indian owned businesses in Guyana following East Indian electoral victories, as well as the beating and rape of East Indian women in broad daylight in Georgetown following these victories.
May I ask which history book did you read and who was it written by ?But if any thing there was no need for PPP(East Indian led party) to side with the British.It t was Jagan of PPP that won the election after Independence, in act of haste it was Forbes Burnham that sought out the help of British to suspend the constitution and have the British reenter Guyana to meddle in the affairs.So if anything it was the PNC(African based group) that sided with the British.
Georgetown is a mixed city there is blacks and East Indians.And no East Indians don't stay in the house after dark with machetes lol.East Indians live in some of the roughest areas of Georgetown alongside blacks, places like Tiger Bay,Albouystown,West Rumiveldt and Kingston.
Many East Indians party and hang out with blacks with Chinese,Amerindians,and Brazilians.Some indians don't but more than not its not an issue.
As for the hooliganism you heard about after the PPP won the election. I doubt you can just attack East indian women in Georgetown in broad day light or even night because for one the East Indian men would step in and Georgetown doesn't have just blacks.Plus many blacks would be opposed to that kind of foolery too even at that time.Gunmen rob any shop black,Indian or Chinese.
You also have other ethic groups in Georgetown like Amerindians,Chinese,Cubans,Brazilians,Venezuealns and whites (more than half of whites are tourist though ).But many mixed Amerindians called Buffianos that have a hispanic look to them though and sometimes can speak Spanish since some lived in Venezuela.Same with Amerindians in Lethem too.
Go to Regent street ,Robb St ,you would see many Hispanic and Chinese working there .You also have some Brazilian restaurants and some churches. Many Hispanics come and leave for business but but Georgetown is relatively safe if you stay in the business districts. I just came from there a month ago.Yes its not like Medellin Colombia, but hopefully it will change in the next 15 years.Many of the shop owners East indian and blacks are learning Spanish for the visiting Hispanic merchants.
There are clubs like Palm Court ,704, or Gravity Lounge.People also like to party(lime) by the stores,rum shops, and houses. Checkout restaurants like Kambout and spots like Oasis.The food is also very good its heavily influenced by East Indian,Chinese,African and Amerindian dishes.Let me know if you go back maybe I can give more suggestions.
So that this very interesting thread does not get sidelined by discussions about race and race relations in Guyana, Trinidad, etc., I've started a new thread on the subject in the Americas forum.
To Reine de Coeur's point, although the African and Taino element in Puerto Rico is the result of subjugation, most Puerto Ricans on the island and on the U.S. mainland I've met are proud of their African and indigenous roots. The only Dominicans I've met that are openly proud of their African roots are younger ones raised in the U.S. It seems that in the DR many discount their African roots and emphasize their Taino origins, even though genetically the Taino element is relatively small.
Most people in PR identify as white then mixed ,same for Dominican Republic. Thing is who are we to say that they are denying their heritage or roots,when you come from various backgrounds you can't go around reminding everyone they are mixed.
Dominicans emphasize they are Dominican, from the lightest to the darkest all identify with being Dominican.
Puerto Ricans acknowledging their African heritage doesn't mean they seem themselves as kin to black. Its a mixed state.
And for the record Dominicans can have anywhere from 3 to 16% so its not that miniscule at all, do they score more amount of African yes but its still there. Along with MENA ancestry.
May I ask which history book did you read and who was it written by ?
It's been many years, but I can assure you it was written by someone who was very scholarly! I was writing a paper for a university course on Suriname and Guyana, and remember reading about horrid race relations (inquiring minds want to know!). If you've been to university, you know the drill. Read a bunch of books and articles on the subject and then "jump off" to something new. I actually went to Suriname (Paramaribo) to do some field research and had a stopover one night in Georgetown.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PrizeWinner
Let me know if you go back maybe I can give more suggestions.
I have no interest in going back to Georgetown (no offense intended, if you identify with the place). I feel pretty much all travelled out. I read news that there are big oil deposits in Guyana and the country stands to get really rich. I hope things go well for Guyana and her people. Thanks for the offer!
Quote:
Originally Posted by PrizeWinner
No the black population in Guyana has gone down too.
Most people in PR identify as white then mixed ,same for Dominican Republic. Thing is who are we to say that they are denying their heritage or roots,when you come from various backgrounds you can't go around reminding everyone they are mixed.
Dominicans emphasize they are Dominican, from the lightest to the darkest all identify with being Dominican.
Puerto Ricans acknowledging their African heritage doesn't mean they seem themselves as kin to black. Its a mixed state.
And for the record Dominicans can have anywhere from 3 to 16% so its not that miniscule at all, do they score more amount of African yes but its still there. Along with MENA ancestry.
Everyone should be free to identify as they wish. When I lived in Puerto Rico, I knew families in which some siblings looked white, while others were darker, more African-featured... in the same family. They didn't seem hung up on racial identity, although you often hear that lighter-skinned folk "have it easier".
It's been many years, but I can assure you it was written by someone who was very scholarly! I was writing a paper for a university course on Suriname and Guyana, and remember reading about horrid race relations (inquiring minds want to know!). If you've been to university, you know the drill. Read a bunch of books and articles on the subject and then "jump off" to something new. I actually went to Suriname (Paramaribo) to do some field research and had a stopover one night in Georgetown.
The person may of been scholarly but that person definitely HAD NO IDEA on what THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT when it comes to the history of political parties and race relations in Guyana.
Plus that person doesn't understand that the PPP once had many members of both blacks and Indians until there was a major schism.One can figure what that hints, because the disturbances didn't come until Independence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2ner
I have no interest in going back to Georgetown (no offense intended, if you identify with the place). I feel pretty much all travelled out. I read news that there are big oil deposits in Guyana and the country stands to get really rich. I hope things go well for Guyana and her people. Thanks for the offer!
Hopefully it can be progressive.But Guyana has always had a abundance of natural resources that attracted people there.
But a day is not enough to actually see Georgetown for what it is, there are beautiful parts I am not going to lie though its not like Medllin or Rio De Janerio ,its has its great parts,its like Jersey City or maybe Charlestown.
Here is an article I found of foreigners like Cubans or other immigrants that come there and stay and those that leave.
Statistics already provided by Felix to the bipartisan parliamentary Foreign Relations Committee show that there are no departure records for 7,255 of the 44,747 Cubans who went to Guyana last year , and of the 22,520 who entered Guyana from January to April of this year, 6,170 have not lodged any departure records with immigration. Going as far back as 2013 to April, 2018, 17,615 , there are no Guyana immigration departure records for Cubans.
As far as Haitians are concerned, there appeared to be a steep rise in the number of Haitians arriving but there are no immigration forms to show that they departed. During 2017 and 2018- 3,515 arrived and 291 left in 2017 and between January and April, only 85 of the 1,238 officially departed, bringing to a total of 4,377 for all of last year and 2018 so far. From 2013 to April 2018, the total number of Haitians for whom there are no Guyana immigration departure records stands at 5,485.
When asked their opinions on the crime rate in Guyana and whether they harboured any fear on the streets of Georgetown, most of the Cubans we spoke with had either never heard about Guyana’s crime rate or didn’t care. The all stated that the people in Guyana are “muchas tranquillas (very peaceful)” and so far no harm has come to them.
Yes,East Indians are leaving but so are Afro-Guyanese, their numbers have dropped in Guyana too.And I've seen those demographics reports and others well enough to surmise what the numbers of demographics of Guyana are.
Everyone should be free to identify as they wish. When I lived in Puerto Rico, I knew families in which some siblings looked white, while others were darker, more African-featured... in the same family. They didn't seem hung up on racial identity, although you often hear that lighter-skinned folk "have it easier".
Yes I agree one when ethnicities are mixed the people from this culture stances in identity may vary individual to individual.
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