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Old 08-08-2018, 02:57 PM
 
6,089 posts, read 4,995,272 times
Reputation: 5985

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsflyer View Post
Lots of inovation comes out of Europe, the ip is owned by individuals and govt rather than corporations. Frankly I don’t care about the health of corporations, there very existence is, in most cases, a threat to small buisness and entrepenurer ship.

Never heard of low gdp, pretty sure Germany’s gdp is through the roof.
German GDP has been flat to falling for 10 years. While it is the biggest economy in the EU, we're talking about the EU, a place that can't even pay its own defense bills.

Individuals may own IP, but corporations actually change lives. You drive a car? Have a smart phone? Use the internet? Watch TV? All provided by large private sector corporations.
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Old 08-08-2018, 03:05 PM
 
6,089 posts, read 4,995,272 times
Reputation: 5985
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
Most Americans do have jobs. And most of those who face bankruptcy or die young because they couldn't access healthcare have jobs. Most jobs in this country do not pay a wage that people can survive off of decently. Your self-centered rant about how you have been lucky enough to avoid those misfortunes so it's okay doesn't change the fact there is a problem. You know those homeless people you've been whining about in this thread? You see a lot less of that in places without your views running the political show in the developed world.

The government creates the wealth of the capitalists. The entire economic system is based off people's claims of ownership of various resources. The land and the resources it contains. Control of those resources gives those who control them great wealth. Those who don't get little and must work for what they have via employment. If we're going to tolerate a government protecting these capitalists' claims thereby creating the inequalities we see in society, there's no reason the government shouldn't provide some benefits for the population as a whole. The government is not there to serve 1 percent of the population only. That's why we have public education, public roads, parks, and so forth.
You honestly don't seem to understand how an economy works and that's why your conclusions read as nonsensical.

If someone works their entire life, and can't afford healthcare, they are seriously underachieving. A cashier at Costco who works for $15 an hour gets full medical benefits. You're telling me someone can work their entire lives without finding a job that offers health insurance? That's just fantasy land.

Governments do NOT create wealth. I repeat. Governments do not create wealth. They have no means of actually creating wealth (does the U.S Senate actually sell a product to people?). Governments can only redistribute wealth at the end of a gun, but they cannot create it.

As for your claim that the government only works for the 1%, what are you basing that upon? Surely it isn't based on facts right?

The U.S government spends over $1 trillion USD on welfare programs now (that's TWICE the size of the US Defense budget by the way).



Is it one percenters using all the welfare programs?


Quote:
Pollution is more tolerated and widespread in the U.S. Chemical pesticides banned elsewhere as carcinogens and neurotoxins are in our food supply because of a pro-industry and anti-environment and anti-regulation environment right now. All of these things shorten people's lives and they have little to no control over it unless they're wealthy enough to escape it. People have few rights when they deal with their employers in this country so if people have a week of vacation time they're lucky but this lack of time away from work causes serious health issues over time. Mental and physical.
Stop eating junk, and you won't get junk in your body. It's extremely easy to eat clean these days, in fact there's an entire industry in the U.S dedicated to non-pesticide, organic food.
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Old 08-08-2018, 03:07 PM
 
Location: Studio City, CA 91604
3,049 posts, read 4,552,914 times
Reputation: 5961
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliRestoration View Post
People used to say the same thing about Oregon, Arizona, and Texas (not more than 20 years ago), now each of those areas has a fastly growing tech sector, and two of those states could quite possibly land Amazon HQ 2.

The point being, Alaska has a lot of potential to grow, but it doesn't need socialists at the helm.
Arizona doesn't have a "tech sector", it has call centers that pay crappy wages to indentured servants.

Texas doesn't have a "tech sector", it has an Apple computer chip manufacturing facility and a call center for the company.

Neither of those are anything close to the tech hubs that are Silicon Valley, Silicon Beach (LA) and Seattle.
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Old 08-08-2018, 03:41 PM
 
Location: The Woods
18,359 posts, read 26,520,591 times
Reputation: 11351
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliRestoration View Post
You honestly don't seem to understand how an economy works and that's why your conclusions read as nonsensical.

If someone works their entire life, and can't afford healthcare, they are seriously underachieving. A cashier at Costco who works for $15 an hour gets full medical benefits. You're telling me someone can work their entire lives without finding a job that offers health insurance? That's just fantasy land.
No, I fully understand how our economy works. I simply want an economy that is structured differently. One that serves the needs of people and the environment, one not based on the fantasy of endless room for growth.

Most jobs in this country don't pay well. In fact half pay less than $18 an hour. Do you feel half of your fellow citizens are lazy or something because they don't earn more money? https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.2e81f0561a1c

Now let's say someone making $10 or $15 an hour is offered the chance to purchase health insurance by their employer. Do you think it's going to be affordable to them? Is that insurance actually equivalent to having good healthcare available?

Let me tell you a little story from my childhood about the health insurance industry in this country. My father had "good" health insurance as a state employee. Private sector employees tend to be jealous of state workers here for their benefits like that. My mother was showing signs of cancer which my father recognized after a military career as a medic. Unknown to my parents the insurance company was ordering the doctors to not run the tests and to say she was fine, for obvious reasons (they didn't want to cover the costs). She finally went to one doctor who was awesome and refused to play that game and tested her and found the cancer was so advanced she wasn't expected to live. I spent my first year of school every night praying with my father that my mother would not die. She got lucky, somehow. But things like that tend to leave a lasting impression. For profit healthcare belongs in the dustbin of history.





Quote:
Governments do NOT create wealth. I repeat. Governments do not create wealth. They have no means of actually creating wealth (does the U.S Senate actually sell a product to people?). Governments can only redistribute wealth at the end of a gun, but they cannot create it.
Who printed the money you're using? Who built the roads the economy relies on? Who enforces the claims of property ownership it relies on? Take away the government and your money is the worthless paper and ink it really is anyways and anything you own is only yours if no one stronger takes it from you.




Quote:
Stop eating junk, and you won't get junk in your body. It's extremely easy to eat clean these days, in fact there's an entire industry in the U.S dedicated to non-pesticide, organic food.
https://www.timesunion.com/news/arti...n-13123370.php

120 square miles in southern VT and more land in NY contaminated by airborne PFOA emissions from a manufacturing plant. The soil and water are now unsuitable for use and impossible to clean up. There are sites like this literally throughout this country, primarily in non-wealthy neighborhoods. People are living in toxic environments without even knowing it. Start digging into history around where you live, past industrial sites within considerable distances, you may be shocked to find similar issues.

And Trump just legalized asbestos again too via his EPA for new uses. Think you and your children are not unknowingly being exposed to poisons? Just consider it isn't just farmworkers being exposed to this stuff, it's in the food you eat too: https://grist.org/briefly/trump-save...l-farmworkers/
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Old 08-21-2018, 09:41 AM
 
6,089 posts, read 4,995,272 times
Reputation: 5985
Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsflyer View Post
My platform is not about my 6 figure job. And the Venezuela angle is tired, I notice vultures don’t like to discuss Norway which is wildly successful.
Okay, so if you like Norway, do you agree that there should be no federal or state minimum wage, just like Norway?
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Old 08-21-2018, 09:43 AM
 
6,089 posts, read 4,995,272 times
Reputation: 5985
Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsflyer View Post
How much poverty comes with all the consessions that have to be made to attract vultures. You need dead bodies and prey to attract vultures and preditors.
Capitalism has raised MORE people out of poverty than ANY other philosophy on the planet. In fact, modern capitalism (sparked by the industrial revolution) ended about a millennia of global poverty.

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Old 08-21-2018, 09:45 AM
 
6,089 posts, read 4,995,272 times
Reputation: 5985
Quote:
Originally Posted by kttam186290 View Post
Arizona doesn't have a "tech sector", it has call centers that pay crappy wages to indentured servants.

Texas doesn't have a "tech sector", it has an Apple computer chip manufacturing facility and a call center for the company.

Neither of those are anything close to the tech hubs that are Silicon Valley, Silicon Beach (LA) and Seattle.
Uh no one said Arizona or Texas were Silicon Valley.

But if you think Texas is just an "Apple Computer Chip manufacturer", then you're wildly ignorant about the tech sector within the state. Which is fine by me, because I'm actually making money investing there, the less pigs at the trough, the better for my bank account. I get rich when people are ignorant. They'll get in, eventually, but very very late, and only when most of the cheese is off the table.
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Old 08-21-2018, 09:48 AM
 
6,089 posts, read 4,995,272 times
Reputation: 5985
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
No, I fully understand how our economy works. I simply want an economy that is structured differently. One that serves the needs of people and the environment, one not based on the fantasy of endless room for growth.
No, you want an economy that picks winners and losers based on your own personal moral compass. That's not an economy, it's a fantasy. Markets are agnostic, you have personal motives. I'll pick an agnostic market thank you.


Quote:
Who printed the money you're using? Who built the roads the economy relies on? Who enforces the claims of property ownership it relies on? Take away the government and your money is the worthless paper and ink it really is anyways and anything you own is only yours if no one stronger takes it from you.
Who said take away government? That's anarchy. I'm simply making the point that government shouldn't be redistributing wealth.



Quote:
And Trump just legalized asbestos again too via his EPA for new uses.
Asbestos can actually have safe applications, just not as a fire retardant in someone's ceiling.
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Old 08-21-2018, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Juneau, AK + Puna, HI
10,578 posts, read 7,793,544 times
Reputation: 16096
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliRestoration View Post
Markets are agnostic, you have personal motives. I'll pick an agnostic market thank you..
Incorrect word choice.

Perhaps ambivalent or indifferent is what you're looking for. But if you believe that, I think you're the one imagining a utopia that doesn't actually exist.

Governments regulate economies in the real world.
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Old 08-21-2018, 12:31 PM
 
6,089 posts, read 4,995,272 times
Reputation: 5985
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Cleric View Post
Incorrect word choice.

Perhaps ambivalent or indifferent is what you're looking for. But if you believe that, I think you're the one imagining a utopia that doesn't actually exist.

Governments regulate economies in the real world.
No, I meant what I said. Markets being "ambivalent" would mean that the markets have different personal feelings towards participants. Market agnostic means there are no feelings one way or the other.

As for Utopia, of course markets are not perfect meritocracies, nothing in the world is perfect. But capitalistic markets are FAR FAR better than socialist distribution of wealth has been proven by hundreds of years of history.

Last edited by CaliRestoration; 08-21-2018 at 12:56 PM..
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