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I'm beginning to think that knowing how well or badly a nation's people treat each other is a good indication of how well or badly you will be treated as a visitor. And how well or badly your own nation treats you, will determine how you will process your treatment abroad. And I think it's safe to say the Japanese treat each other better than Americans treat each other. Is that a fair conclusion?
So to the people in this thread who live in Japan and / or expatriated, is there a somewhat painless way to move to Japan and live there full time? I don't think I could be employed in the cities with my limited language skills (just started learning Japanese). I'm not very excited about doing the 9-5 grind lifestyle. I like the more slower-paced traditional, call it "old" self-sufficient ways of life. How about a Japanese countryside, "off-grid", hunter-gatherer type of lifestyle just until I familiarize myself with the culture and language? lol. Is that a possibility for me in Japan? Without imposing on a host, are there cheap solutions for expatriating to Japan? I heard a story once that in one prefecture so many people were leaving that, after the normal red tape, they gave land away to one couple for free if they agreed to settle it. I know that's probably the exception rather than the rule but what are land prices like in the Japanese countryside?
You're taking a huge gamble based on outsiders' opinions. I think there are some programs to go there and do farm work that don't pay much. You can do that or teach English for a bit and see if you really like it there.
How they treat each other varies by area. Tokyo-ites are more cold, people in Osaka are more friendly. I have no idea about the countryside areas and imagine they have their own differences. In general, there is a great deal of pressure to conform whenever you're working with groups, such as at school, work, perhaps local communities in rural areas. I was attracted to the idea they work based on consensus, but it's not really how it works. It's still very hierarchical, but responsibility is diffused using groups. The companies and government are still corrupt and make decisions without worker and local community approval. There are a lot of right-wing parties and they have more power than the left parties, which are just the Social Democrats and Communist Party now. The Democratic Party in power now is basically the LDP reinvented, especially after the tiny SD left the coalition early on.
There are other places in the world where personal safety in public is high and people keep to themselves and are not openly loud and hostile and you can live off the grid. Much of northern Europe is like this, to a lesser extent parts of Canada. I still love Japan but if you're basing your decision to live the rest of your life based on those factors, you may want to keep your options open.
Last edited by vaga bond; 04-08-2011 at 11:52 AM..
You're taking a huge gamble based on outsiders' opinions. I think there are some programs to go there and do farm work that don't pay much. You can do that or teach English for a bit and see if you really like it there.
How they treat each other varies by area. Tokyo-ites are more cold, people in Osaka are more friendly. I have no idea about the countryside areas and imagine they have their own differences. In general, there is a great deal of pressure to conform whenever you're working with groups, such as at school, work, perhaps local communities in rural areas. I was attracted to the idea they work based on consensus, but it's not really how it works. It's still very hierarchical, but responsibility is diffused using groups. The companies and government are still corrupt and make decisions without worker and local community approval. There are a lot of right-wing parties and they have more power than the left parties, which are just the Social Democrats and Communist Party now. The Democratic Party in power now is basically the LDP reinvented, especially after the tiny SD left the coalition early on.
There are other places in the world where personal safety in public is high and people keep to themselves and are not openly loud and hostile and you can live off the grid. Much of northern Europe is like this, to a lesser extent parts of Canada. I still love Japan but if you're basing your decision to live the rest of your life based on those factors, you may want to keep your options open.
Hmmm..That's certainly something to think about. Good advice.
I just want to make clear I'm not adverse to working or even working hard in Japan. The reason I want to buy land rather than rent is because I have a little money saved up and I would like to avoid having a mortgage in Japan and give myself a little flexibility in terms of a steady job there. As a foreigner I will expect to have some difficulty and so owning my own land there outright would at least make it easier to survive.
I'm pretty sure the purchasable, inhabitable land in Japan is quite expensive. It's about the size of California with a much larger population. Much of the area where you don't see city on a satellite map is hills and mountains or farm land already owned. It's one of the reasons the cities are so dense and property is so expensive in them. I'm not sure which country has cheap open land for you to purchase. Again, I'd think parts of Canada and perhaps Norway or Sweden or the wild parts of Australia would be a better idea. Maybe Russia? If you're off the grid, you not going to have to worry about their problems in the city areas. Just found this discussion about where to find cheap land: http://www.namepros.com/the-break-ro...and-world.html
dude they are people, and people are the same wherever you go
generally speaking, yes, people are the same wherever you go. but there is the little matter of the crime rate in japan being drastically different from the united states. so, in that respect, i would say they are very different. case in point:
the following was given as a response in Yahoo Answers (i can't vouch for it's validity) to a question about countries with the lowest crime rates:
"I lived in Japan for a year, and the crime rate there is VERY low. The first time I realised this, I was walking in a park with my sister and saw a camera sitting on a stump near the sidewalk. I asked her if we should take it to a lost and found, she told me no, that when someone finds something there, they leave it in a prominent place close to where they found it so that the person who lost it can go back and it will be there. This sounded crazy to me but it's true. Throughout my time there I encountered this many times-necklaces hanging on tree branches, jackets folded neatly on park benches. It was astonishing."
Besides the low crime rate, what has attracted you to Japan? Why Japan? Why not, say, Vietnam or Thailand? What did you see or hear that got you to start thinking about Japan?
Besides the low crime rate, what has attracted you to Japan? Why Japan? Why not, say, Vietnam or Thailand? What did you see or hear that got you to start thinking about Japan?
I can't really put aside the low crime rate because that is one of the primary and initial attractions to Japan for me. I've always heard they had a very low crime rate and thug culture like here in America just doesn't appeal to me in any sense. I've also always heard the Japanese are well mannered, for the most part. That's not to say people from other Asian countries are any less impressive. I once worked with a middle aged woman from Vietnam who perhaps made one of the strongest impressions on me of anyone. Soft-spoken, wise. I've known so really great Chinese and Philipino people, as well. And no, I'm not saying I'm surprised by this. As someone said in this thread "people are the same everywhere". I know the West has no monopoly on manners and, in America, it appears we are losing ours. There is a pernicious belief going around in the States that you're not tough if your nice or kind or considerate of others. To me this kind of thinking flips common sense on it's head. I mean, if that were correct I guess we should all just get nastier and nastier to each other until what? I've had enough of this stupidity and I'm ready to leave. I want to live somewhere where people freaking like each other. Is that too much to ask? I don't think it should be.
But I digress. Japan's love affair with technology is also attractive to me since I also love technology. It's natural beauty, as well. And to directly answer your question, I can't say I would rule out Vietnam or China. I don't know if it's the underlying hand of Buddhism connecting these countries that makes their people so attractive to me. I've never known anyone from Thailand but I hear there is a strong Buddhist tradition there, as well.
I am the last person to discourage you from following this desire you have. Since I was thirteen years old (we're talking more than 20 years now) I started to fall in love with a lot of Asian cultures. But my main love was Japan. I could not believe my eyes when in 1993-1994 I went to Japan as an exchange student. I felt like I was in heaven. Really, I had the hardest time leaving it. When I arrived back to Texas and my mom saw me crying when I arrived at the airport, she thought I was crying because I was finally home when in reality I was crying because I was no longer in Japan.
I see that you live in New Jersey and although I only know about the stereotypes of New Jersey, I wonder if you are very disillusioned because you just don't find that many friendly people in New Jersey. If you go to the Texas forum and in particular the Dallas sub-forum which I am always at, I've seen countless of people comment of how friendly people in Texas are. So you just might find what you want in your own country...just saying.
Other than that, like I said, I would not discourage you at all to follow your dream. But you must realize that speaking the language is EXTREMELY important. I took two years of Japanese while in the university and then went as an exchange student and I thought those two years would be helpful but they really were not. To make matters worse, whatever Japanese person you meet here in America will want to speak English only and so you are left not having someone to practice with for free. Well, at least that's been my experience.
I hear a lot of desperation, in a way, in your writing and I am concerned that once you get there the reality will be different and your expectations will come crashing down. So I'm glad you are investigating it now and getting different perspectives. But I would advise that the quickest and maybe easiest way to get there is by teaching English. It usually is to elementary aged kids. You might want to apply somewhere in the South or the North or towards the West but probably stay away from the East cause as you've seen in the news, it is still very volatile.
I just want to make clear I'm not adverse to working or even working hard in Japan. The reason I want to buy land rather than rent is because I have a little money saved up and I would like to avoid having a mortgage in Japan and give myself a little flexibility in terms of a steady job there. As a foreigner I will expect to have some difficulty and so owning my own land there outright would at least make it easier to survive.
Very American concept to get a few acres and own land. I think it would be worse without knowing Japanese to deal with ownership issues. Living in the city is the most common place for foreigners to go who have language issues. The further away you go, the less you'll see or hear any english at all.
Usually people just rent. Maybe if you find a wife, you can look into buying property. Seems like a better way to start out, anyways.
I think the other problem is things you don't like about the U.S., won't be here, but there are other issues/problems that could bother you. I personally quite like Japan, but I certainly notice that a ton of other foreigners here have their issues. I think what helped me more was spending a lot of time in many other countries before coming here. People that come directly from the U.S., usually experience the most culture shock, and become hyper-aware of the differences that they don't like. Generally, the people with the highest expectations, can be let down the most. But than again, every individual's experience is different. You'll definitely go through a 'cultural shock' cycle, everyone does. Because of that, you don't want to be planning on trying to find the cheapest land in Japan and staying there forever without having any other experiences whatsoever with the country and the people.
For me, I came here without expectation, assuming it would be more or less similar to South Korea where I lived a long time before here. Quite a bit differnet in a postive way, from South Korea. It's all relative. I also don't have anything at stake, renting, non-Japanese wife, non-Japanese kid, and could leave anytime really. But, for me, it works. So, I'm here. I think committing to property and building assets as a Day 1 Plan could really do your head in when you start going through 'cultural shock' cycles, and everyone does. You might want to read about those, just interesting in general.
Moorhen3 is also right about differnet places in the States being drastically different. You could go to Iowa or Minnesota or Oregon and just have a completely different culture, as well as Texas or Oklahoma. I don't think of any of those places as thug culture or the 'what are you looking at, punk' mindsets. For that matter, Europe, wouldn't have thug culture, although I heard the UK has soccer hooligans.
Regarding Asia, having spent a lot of time in and throughout Asia. Most countries around here have kind considerate people. They all have different issues to contend with though.
Last edited by Tiger Beer; 04-08-2011 at 08:13 PM..
I see that you live in New Jersey and although I only know about the stereotypes of New Jersey, I wonder if you are very disillusioned because you just don't find that many friendly people in New Jersey. If you go to the Texas forum and in particular the Dallas sub-forum which I am always at, I've seen countless of people comment of how friendly people in Texas are. So you just might find what you want in your own country...just saying.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shankapotomus
@moorhen
You're right. It could be just New Jersey.
Shankapotomus,
I believe Moorhen3 made a good point there... if your desire is to really buy acreage at a nominal price and live off-grid with a great cohesive group of people, you might be interested in reading this one TX thread and then the website link where they eventually took their conversations too.
I've been following this TX thread since its' inception and wow, it's been amazing to see peeps from all over the country come together to form their own little bit of heaven out of almost nothing, but they have and seem to be thriving.
Forewarning, though, these peeps seem to get together every few days for bar-b-ques, cookouts, etc., so weight may become an issue!
Also, this was not meant to take away or discourage any of your interest in Japan at all, because I, too, find the country, culture and people fascinating. But, possibly you can have the best of both worlds... own your own dirt and vacation in Japan when the mood strikes.
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