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Life is increasingly hard for Chinese men and women. For ordinary people they face low paying factory jobs that make raising children difficult. If you’re not closely tied to the Communist Party higher education and high paying jobs are difficult. One of the largest group of illegals now coming through our border are from China. They travel across the globe, through South and Central America looking for a better life.
It's less about China specifically. All across East Asia there's big gender wars going on where women are fed up with bearing the responsibilities of family and careers. Korea is worse than China really. The root cause is the men really aren't doing their fair share of household work. The result is an opt out of a household. And men get angry cause they can't get relationships, get nasty, and things snowball. There will be a big drop in babies and at some point people will figure out that there really have to be sacrifices made to raise kids, and either the population will continue to implode or they will start making the sacrifices.
It's less about China specifically. All across East Asia there's big gender wars going on where women are fed up with bearing the responsibilities of family and careers. Korea is worse than China really. The root cause is the men really aren't doing their fair share of household work. The result is an opt out of a household. And men get angry cause they can't get relationships, get nasty, and things snowball. There will be a big drop in babies and at some point people will figure out that there really have to be sacrifices made to raise kids, and either the population will continue to implode or they will start making the sacrifices.
Well let's be honest. If they wanted to make women have babies they could. Not like women will form an army to fight off the men in the country. Seriously, these post about men not being feminine enough for Western women standards needs to stop. I'm married and take on some households responsibilities, but the majority of time is consumed with providing and protecting for my household like the men before me did. My wife who seems like one of the few women in the U.S. of our generation with some traditional values, is happy to take on the greater share of household work since women are naturally more tailored to such roles. She loves our kids and wants to be the central figure in their life while they are young. She's not so fund of devoting her life to a company, neglecting her family.
It's less about China specifically. All across East Asia there's big gender wars going on where women are fed up with bearing the responsibilities of family and careers. Korea is worse than China really. The root cause is the men really aren't doing their fair share of household work. The result is an opt out of a household. And men get angry cause they can't get relationships, get nasty, and things snowball. There will be a big drop in babies and at some point people will figure out that there really have to be sacrifices made to raise kids, and either the population will continue to implode or they will start making the sacrifices.
In HK, HK women are viewed negatively as "Gong Nui", known for easily angered, bad behaviors and attitude, leading to less local dating. The results are less and less local marriages and babies born in hk. The men marry women of other places instead.
Those pleasant non "Gong Nui" women are well educated with good career have a hard time meeting men better than them as these men are small in numbers.
Another reason is the potential problems and social stigma of poor families with kids. People nowadays think have kids but poor will lead to many problems and will be despised by others.
Well let's be honest. If they wanted to make women have babies they could. Not like women will form an army to fight off the men in the country. Seriously, these post about men not being feminine enough for Western women standards needs to stop. I'm married and take on some households responsibilities, but the majority of time is consumed with providing and protecting for my household like the men before me did. My wife who seems like one of the few women in the U.S. of our generation with some traditional values, is happy to take on the greater share of household work since women are naturally more tailored to such roles. She loves our kids and wants to be the central figure in their life while they are young. She's not so fund of devoting her life to a company, neglecting her family.
Well that's the thing, you all reached a deal where you are taking one half of the work burden and she's taking the other half. Where it comes to conflict is when both spouses are expected to work and then someone has to do all the housework as job 2. In order for families to happen, someone has to sacrifice and do the household work and not be working 70 hours a week.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomboy-
In HK, HK women are viewed negatively as "Gong Nui", known for easily angered, bad behaviors and attitude, leading to less local dating. The results are less and less local marriages and babies born in hk. The men marry women of other places instead.
Those pleasant non "Gong Nui" women are well educated with good career have a hard time meeting men better than them as these men are small in numbers.
Another reason is the potential problems and social stigma of poor families with kids. People nowadays think have kids but poor will lead to many problems and will be despised by others.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gong_nui haha yes this captures what I mean by gender wars perfectly! Certainly don't want to insinuate that everything is the guys problem. People fitting right into the Gong Nui stereotype probably shouldn't be having kids. I went on 2 dates with a Chinese girl like this in Atlanta, and it was scary! Some of the decline in birthrate is a good thing, cause not everyone is psychologically cut out to be a parent.
It's less about China specifically. All across East Asia there's big gender wars going on where women are fed up with bearing the responsibilities of family and careers. Korea is worse than China really. The root cause is the men really aren't doing their fair share of household work. The result is an opt out of a household. And men get angry cause they can't get relationships, get nasty, and things snowball. There will be a big drop in babies and at some point people will figure out that there really have to be sacrifices made to raise kids, and either the population will continue to implode or they will start making the sacrifices.
It is a problem in East Asia due to low immigration, but it is particularly bad in China's case because China is a developing country with a GDP per capita of barely $10,000 and low wealth level/high debt.
Situation in Korea is horrendous but at least it's a developed country that can attract some immigrants if they need to. Japan is in a similar boat.
Taiwan is slightly different because there is a much larger untapped work force (low effective retirement age so extremely low employment among people over 50, especially women, quite a lot of who have started working now because why not), stronger wealth accumulation, lower cost of living, and the society is more open to immigrants.
Last edited by Greysholic; 01-29-2024 at 01:19 AM..
It is a problem in East Asia due to low immigration, but it is particularly bad in China's case because China is a developing country with a GDP per capita of barely $10,000 and low wealth level/high debt.
Situation in Korea is horrendous but at least it's a developed country that can attract some immigrants if they need to. Japan is in a similar boat.
If you are not a immigrant city state like Singapore, then you can't fix a fertility rate of 1 with immigration. With that kind of fertility rate, then the population will be replaced by immigrants in 70 years and it will only take a few decades before the country experience large cultural conflicts.
For instance, half of the immigrants in South Korea are Chinese. If they managed to attract a lot more Chinese to fix their fertility rate, then they would have lots of low educated Chinese people that are loyal to China instead of Korea. They would gain strength as the population grows and cause massive amounts of cultural conflicts.
So no, the problem is not lack of immigration. The problem is the low fertility rate.
If you are not a immigrant city state like Singapore, then you can't fix a fertility rate of 1 with immigration. With that kind of fertility rate, then the population will be replaced by immigrants in 70 years and it will only take a few decades before the country experience large cultural conflicts.
For instance, half of the immigrants in South Korea are Chinese. If they managed to attract a lot more Chinese to fix their fertility rate, then they would have lots of low educated Chinese people that are loyal to China instead of Korea. They would gain strength as the population grows and cause massive amounts of cultural conflicts.
So no, the problem is not lack of immigration. The problem is the low fertility rate.
Then they should keep Chinese immigrants at bay. There are hundreds of millions of SE Asians and more than a billion South Asians. The immigration policy wouldn’t be similar to Sweden’s, it would be more like Denmark’s.
High income is required to attract immigrants in addition to welcoming policies. That's why there are female immigrants married to both poor and rich men in HK, Macao and Taiwan. There are now southeast asian women moving to mainland china because they have husbands. But not easy or attractive in income for overseas men to come.
Then they should keep Chinese immigrants at bay. There are hundreds of millions of SE Asians and more than a billion South Asians.
There is a reason why those countries are poor and dysfunctional. If South Korea let in a lot of poorly educated Indians, then they would be loyal to India, the immigrants would be discriminated, end up on welfare and there would probably be a rise in crime.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greysholic
The immigration policy wouldn’t be similar to Sweden’s, it would be more like Denmark’s.
Denmark's immigration policy is not that different from Sweden. Denmark has the same Schengen laws and have to follow EUs asylum rules. That means Denmark has gotten bad immigrants just like Sweden and South Korea would not get significantly different results if it followed Denmark or Sweden's example. Also, Denmark has a fertility rate of 1.5 - 2.0, not 1. Denmark doesn't need much immigration and would prefer to get less than today.
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