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Regardless of what the US Census results will state in the next few weeks for Atlanta, it is poised to surpass Philadelphia MSA within 5 years of time either way and CSA by 2020.
How are all of you feeling about the Census results expected to come out soon? Anyone nervous about what it could be?
We don't care about Philly. We are more concerned with our economy and for developments such as Aerotropolis, SOB, Westside Park, etc to get off the ground.
Regardless of what the US Census results will state in the next few weeks for Atlanta, it is poised to surpass Philadelphia MSA within 5 years of time either way and CSA by 2020.
How are all of you feeling about the Census results expected to come out soon? Anyone nervous about what it could be?
If we have population growth above 50k, I am going to be really worried about the effect it will have on our unemployment rate. We need to get our unemployment rate below 10% before we start adding new residents again. If that means lagging behind Philadelphia until 2020, so be it. The only reason we were growing so fast in the 2000s is because people moved here without a job, thinking this was the land of milk and honey where a job would just be handed to them. Maybe with our unemployment rate so high, they'll get the hint and wait to move here until they have a J-O-B.
Secondly, we have entered a new era where the next 50 years will not be like the previous 50 years because abundance will be a thing of the past and resource scarcity will radically change how and where we live.
Thirdly, one really cannot extrapolate from the past and assume that things will continue the same course despite radical global changes manifesting that will impact our existance here in the USA.
Finally, really.....comparing metropolitan areas is not an apple to apple comparison often. Is it fair to compare Metro Atlants 5.6 million people with Metro Philly's 6 million people given Metro Altanta is some 9,000 square miles and metro Philly 6 million comes in half that space? If you were to expand metro philly's count to 9,000 square miles it would near 7 or even 8 million people. If you were to shrink metro Atlanta to Philly's current foot print, Atlanta would likely loose a million or so people. Where one chooses to start and end counting is based upon communtting patterns and politics.
The only reason why the Atlanta-area has a chance to pass Philly in population anytime soon is because of the ridiculous size of its boundaries. So typical for a southern and western sprawl. Draw the same size radius around Philadelphia that Atlanta uses for its metro and it would be WAY larger. Take a look below
Philadelphia Metro: 4,629 square miles
Atlanta Mero: 8,376 square miles
Atlanta is around 1.8 times larger than Philly in its geographic size but is still home to a few hundred thousand less people. I'd like to see what Philadelphia's population would be if you considered it to have a similar 8,376 square radius. It would be encroaching on the metro's of New York and Balimore and would probably add at least a few million more to it's total making this a moot point.
Want a better way to compare and contrast the size of a market? Use Urban area population NOT MSA.
Philadelphia - 1,799 square-miles - 5,325,000 population
Atlanta - 1,963 square miles - 3,500,000 population
These are all 2009 estimates so they're likely pretty accurate. Bottom line? Even though Philly's urban area is still over 9% smaller than that of Atlanta its population is 52% larger! The south and west are growing faster, no doubt. But a lot of their recent population achievements are based on somewhat bull**** definitions of city, market, and area sizes and populations.
The only reason why the Atlanta-area has a chance to pass Philly in population anytime soon is because of the ridiculous size of its boundaries. So typical for a southern and western sprawl. Draw the same size radius around Philadelphia that Atlanta uses for its metro and it would be WAY larger. Take a look below
Philadelphia Metro: 4,629 square miles
Atlanta Mero: 8,376 square miles
Atlanta is around 1.8 times larger than Philly in its geographic size but is still home to a few hundred thousand less people. I'd like to see what Philadelphia's population would be if you considered it to have a similar 8,376 square radius. It would be encroaching on the metro's of New York and Balimore and would probably add at least a few million more to it's total making this a moot point.
Want a better way to compare and contrast the size of a market? Use Urban area population NOT MSA.
Philadelphia - 1,799 square-miles - 5,325,000 population
Atlanta - 1,963 square miles - 3,500,000 population
These are all 2009 estimates so they're likely pretty accurate. Bottom line? Even though Philly's urban area is still over 9% smaller than that of Atlanta its population is 52% larger! The south and west are growing faster, no doubt. But a lot of their recent population achievements are based on somewhat bull**** definitions of city, market, and area sizes and populations.
Well... I sort of have to interject a little bit here. We aren't exactly ever going to win the density award and many people don't like how they city has grown as sprawled as it is, but at the end of the day the MSA boundaries are drawn that way because that whole area is economically integrated. We have a good amount of our populace living in far off exurban areas, but driving in to our main core counties every day.
So you are welcome to not like the way it has grown and complain about it, but the definition isn't bull. Some people really are just driving in that far. They aren't locating to these exurban areas to be in rural Georgia. They are locating there to be near Atlanta, but live a semi-rural lifestyle or have a large land lot. Either way, the economic influence and commuting patterns is clearly Atlanta. You can notice in those 8000 sq. mi there aren't exactly any other major cities people are locating near and commuting to.
In these respects MSA is more important to examine and not urban area. MSA is a definition based on commuting patterns and economic integration. Urban areas are based on population density and just that.
The only reason why the Atlanta-area has a chance to pass Philly in population anytime soon is because of the ridiculous size of its boundaries. So typical for a southern and western sprawl. Draw the same size radius around Philadelphia that Atlanta uses for its metro and it would be WAY larger. Take a look below
Philadelphia Metro: 4,629 square miles
Atlanta Mero: 8,376 square miles
Atlanta is around 1.8 times larger than Philly in its geographic size but is still home to a few hundred thousand less people. I'd like to see what Philadelphia's population would be if you considered it to have a similar 8,376 square radius. It would be encroaching on the metro's of New York and Balimore and would probably add at least a few million more to it's total making this a moot point.
Want a better way to compare and contrast the size of a market? Use Urban area population NOT MSA.
Philadelphia - 1,799 square-miles - 5,325,000 population
Atlanta - 1,963 square miles - 3,500,000 population
These are all 2009 estimates so they're likely pretty accurate. Bottom line? Even though Philly's urban area is still over 9% smaller than that of Atlanta its population is 52% larger! The south and west are growing faster, no doubt. But a lot of their recent population achievements are based on somewhat bull**** definitions of city, market, and area sizes and populations.
HOW ABOUT THIS LITTLE FACT: Philadelphia was founded in 1682. Atlanta wasn't founded until 1837 -- NEARLY 150 YEARS LATER! Philly was once the largest city in America -- and one of the biggest in the world! Not anymore. In just a little over 160 years, Atlanta has grown from nothing to become one of the nation's largest urban centers and a global business center to boot. Philly on the other hand is the city that America forgot -- overshadowed by NYC to the north and DC to the South. That must really suck.
Well... I sort of have to interject a little bit here. We aren't exactly ever going to win the density award and many people don't like how they city has grown as sprawled as it is, but at the end of the day the MSA boundaries are drawn that way because that whole area is economically integrated. We have a good amount of our populace living in far off exurban areas, but driving in to our main core counties every day.
So you are welcome to not like the way it has grown and complain about it, but the definition isn't bull. Some people really are just driving in that far. They aren't locating to these exurban areas to be in rural Georgia. They are locating there to be near Atlanta, but live a semi-rural lifestyle or have a large land lot. Either way, the economic influence and commuting patterns is clearly Atlanta. You can notice in those 8000 sq. mi there aren't exactly any other major cities people are locating near and commuting to.
In these respects MSA is more important to examine and not urban area. MSA is a definition based on commuting patterns and economic integration. Urban areas are based on population density and just that.
Location: The Greatest city on Earth: City of Atlanta Proper
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Ugh, why do the density fetishists think that saying how many people live in "x" amount of space is the winner of all conversations and situations on C-D?
I guess it might have to do with the fact that in some cases that's all a city can brag about. Not Philly of course. I like Philly.
The only reason why the Atlanta-area has a chance to pass Philly in population anytime soon is because of the ridiculous size of its boundaries. So typical for a southern and western sprawl. Draw the same size radius around Philadelphia that Atlanta uses for its metro and it would be WAY larger. Take a look below
Philadelphia Metro: 4,629 square miles
Atlanta Mero: 8,376 square miles
Atlanta is around 1.8 times larger than Philly in its geographic size but is still home to a few hundred thousand less people. I'd like to see what Philadelphia's population would be if you considered it to have a similar 8,376 square radius. It would be encroaching on the metro's of New York and Balimore and would probably add at least a few million more to it's total making this a moot point.
Want a better way to compare and contrast the size of a market? Use Urban area population NOT MSA.
Philadelphia - 1,799 square-miles - 5,325,000 population
Atlanta - 1,963 square miles - 3,500,000 population
These are all 2009 estimates so they're likely pretty accurate. Bottom line? Even though Philly's urban area is still over 9% smaller than that of Atlanta its population is 52% larger! The south and west are growing faster, no doubt.But
a lot of their recent population achievements are based on somewhat bull**** definitions of city, market, and area sizes and populations.
I agree with this assessment. I do not like the new trend of cities being low density and sprawled out. It is extremely wasteful. I once visited San Diego and drove past a San Diego city limits sign. I drove for what seemed like forever before seeing any sky scrapers or anything that wasn't hills and bushes. What a BS city line.
HOW ABOUT THIS LITTLE FACT: Philadelphia was founded in 1682. Atlanta wasn't founded until 1837 -- NEARLY 150 YEARS LATER! Philly was once the largest city in America -- and one of the biggest in the world! Not anymore. In just a little over 160 years, Atlanta has grown from nothing to become one of the nation's largest urban centers and a global business center to boot. Philly on the other hand is the city that America forgot -- overshadowed by NYC to the north and DC to the South. That must really suck.
Metro Atlanta hasn't even officially passed Metropolitan areas of Miami, Washington DC, Houston, or Dallas yet, but yet you Atlantans jump all the way up to Philly and have the nerve to make a thread about Atlanta Metro surpassing Philadelphia metro. This thread is a joke.
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