Carlos Santanta embarrasses himself at yesterdays Braves game. (Homer: move, health)

[BringBackCobain]

Originally Posted by afonega1

How much money do illegal immigrants provide in state and local tax revenue,retail receipts in goods purchased.Renting apartments and houses from landlords?Why is it so easy to find the supposed cost to the government but NOT the contribution to the government?How can you possibly accept one without the other being known?

The study took account of that. In terms of net dollar amount, illegal immigrants cost money. Any revenue they provide is subsumed by the costs.

[testa50]

Originally Posted by northwinds

I haven't backpedaled from anything. Here is a Wiki article that talks about the various studies on this subject including the aforementioned Pew study that estimates there are 11-12 million. It also mentions the Bear Stearns study that estimates there are 20 million or more illegals. I'm really not sure what we're arguing about....whether its 12 million or 20 million its too many and needs to be dealt with in some fashion. But before we deal with this group we need to make sure that another 12-20 million don't come in the next ten years. We had an amnesty back in 1988 and legalized 2.3 million...and since then another 12-20 million have come in. Obviously, we can't keep letting this happen. The strain on our health care system, education system, etc. won't withstand the burden. Hope that helps you to understand the situation better....

That Bear Stearns study is pretty much the lone outlier of illegal immigrant estimates. Why you'd feel passionately that immigrant calculations ought to be based on remittance outflows (which vary due to many factors, including legal immigrant presence) rather than direct tabulation based on adjjusted census data is beyond me. Even most anti-immigrant groups concede the number isn't anywhere above 15 million.

[northwinds]

Originally Posted by testa50

That Bear Stearns study is pretty much the lone outlier of illegal immigrant estimates. Why you'd feel passionately that immigrant calculations ought to be based on remittance outflows (which vary due to many factors, including legal immigrant presence) rather than direct tabulation based on adjjusted census data is beyond me. Even most anti-immigrant groups concede the number isn't anywhere above 15 million.

Again...what's your friggin' point. Whether its 11 million, or 15 million or 20 million or 25 million its still a problem. Nobody knows and that's part of the problem. Do you not understand that millions of illegal folks putting pressure on the health care system and education system is a huge problem for this country. Part of the reason that we can't get anywhere with the immigration debate is that the left wants to pretend like all the illegals are God-fearing, family oriented, law abiding folks that have no intention of taking advantage of the system. Meanwhile Joe SixPack goes to the emergency room with an injury and can't get in to see a doctor because there are 20 Spanish speaking people in front of him who use the ER as their primary care physician. Sticking your head in the sand and pretending that this isn't happening all over the country doesn't make you a "compassionate" person. These same liberals are the idiots who encouraged the Hispanics to take to the streets with Mexican instead of American flags back in May of 2007, right before the Senate shot down the last hope at immigration reform....morons.

[huddledmasses]

Originally Posted by BringBackCobain

You have lost whatever credibility you had.

"That be ray-suss!"

Yet you guys are trying to cite studies performed by actual racist organizations and get all mad that we come to these conclusions. lol.

[huddledmasses]

Originally Posted by BringBackCobain

The study took account of that. In terms of net dollar amount, illegal immigrants cost money. Any revenue they provide is subsumed by the costs.

Please point out in the study where the taxes they pay in are accounted for.

[northwinds]

Here's a survey that has 85% in support of the new immigration law....just for informational purposes here.

[waronxmas]

Originally Posted by huddledmasses

Yet you guys are trying to cite studies performed by actual racist organizations and get all mad that we come to these conclusions. lol.

Bingo. I suppose citing a source that isn't a racist/bigoted/xenophobic organization is too much to ask...

[JPD]

Originally Posted by BringBackCobain

You have lost whatever credibility you had.

Funny that you bring up credibility after having destroyed any of your own credibility by saying this:

Liberals/progressives always root for forces that go against Western civilization. They want illegal immigrants to flood the country. They want Sharia law implemented. They want the country to go bankrupt. They want Christianity subverted. The ultimate goal is communism, and anything that will further that goal will be supported.

[northwinds]

Oops....Here's the link

Surveys | AccessNorthGa.com

[testa50]

Originally Posted by northwinds

Again...what's your friggin' point. Whether its 11 million, or 15 million or 20 million or 25 million its still a problem. Nobody knows and that's part of the problem.

I'm sure the fact that you chose the biggest number imaginable is just a coincidence.

Do you not understand that millions of illegal folks putting pressure on the health care system and education system is a huge problem for this country. Part of the reason that we can't get anywhere with the immigration debate is that the left wants to pretend like all the illegals are God-fearing, family oriented, law abiding folks that have no intention of taking advantage of the system. Meanwhile Joe SixPack goes to the emergency room with an injury and can't get in to see a doctor because there are 20 Spanish speaking people in front of him who use the ER as their primary care physician. Sticking your head in the sand and pretending that this isn't happening all over the country doesn't make you a "compassionate" person. These same liberals are the idiots who encouraged the Hispanics to take to the streets with Mexican instead of American flags back in May of 2007, right before the Senate shot down the last hope at immigration reform....morons.

I don't think it's a particularly huge problem for this country. To the extent that it is a problem, the only way to really address it is by offering amnesty and creating a temporary worker status that explicitly denies non-emergency benefits. You could charge a hefty amount for this sort of visa and have a mandatory health savings account as a stipulation--after all, people are willing to shell out $5k to come work here to coyotes as it is--and this could pretty much close the gap on the extra medical costs that enrage you so.

Also, the bolded is awesome. You do realize that ~50% of these folks (in Georgia; in most states far more) are LEGALLY here...right? Or did you take a line out of the FAIR playbook?