MARTA unveils its dream project list for November Referendum (title, commute)

[jsvh]

You are not going to attract new riders with more buses that just sit in traffic. Major cities require high-capacity transit in dedicated RoW to function effectively.

[Mossberg]

...and also, buses are for poor black people! lol


Many idiots actually believe that crap unfortunately.


Seriously though, the "optional" riders are more likely to ride a train than take buses. It's a sad truth, but one which helps justifies rail over buses that are stuck in traffic.

[cqholt]

Originally Posted by Mossberg

...and also, buses are for poor black people! lol


Many idiots actually believe that crap unfortunately.


Seriously though, the "optional" riders are more likely to ride a train than take buses. It's a sad truth, but one which helps justifies rail over buses that are stuck in traffic.

Unless those buses have dedicated lanes, then the stigma might go away. Research has shown that demand riders will ride BRT.

[magnetar]

I guess I'm an "optional" rider and the biggest reason I'll take the train instead of a bus is reliability. I know the train's coming at least every 15-20 minutes, and I know exactly where it's going. My experiences trying to use the bus in Atlanta haven't been so consistent. If we can get bus routes that are easier to comprehend, and more frequent service, I think that would have the biggest impact on who uses buses in Atlanta. Race undoubtedly plays a part in why some people choose not to use transit, and that's unfortunate, but there are issues of user-friendliness and reliability at play, too.

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by cqholt

Unless those buses have dedicated lanes, then the stigma might go away. Research has shown that demand riders will ride BRT.

True BRT has similar economic effects to Streetcars and LRT due to its visible permanence. The problem will come in with things like capacity and limited roadways.

Streetcars and LRT vehicles can be strung together to form a train, carrying twice as many people, without needing an additional driver, and without introducing an extra vehicle to have to schedule, which helps prevent things like bunching up.

Streetcars also have the benefit of still bringing economic incentives whether or not they're in a dedicated lane, which is somewhat inevitable given the narrow older streets of downtown where there's simply no room for transit only lanes. That's not to say that we shouldn't be pushing for transit only lanes where-ever we can, but that streetcars still represent permanent infrastructure vs. a bus on a normal street, which doesn't.

[fourthwarden]

Question: does anyone have the most recent project lists from MARTA and the City? I can't seem to find any actual list, and i'm not so sure I should just trust CQ's map as being up to date and complete (sorry CQ).

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by fourthwarden

Question: does anyone have the most recent project lists from MARTA and the City?

This is what the actual legislation has in it: http://renewatl.com/wp-content/uploa...hall-edits.pdf

Basically it has most all of the routes on the "wish list" (more projects than the money will cover alone) but they will be target projects as matching funds become available.

[fourthwarden]

Originally Posted by jsvh

This is what the actual legislation has in it: http://renewatl.com/wp-content/uploa...hall-edits.pdf

Basically it has most all of the routes on the "wish list" (more projects than the money will cover alone) but they will be target projects as matching funds become available.

Yeup! That's what I was looking for, from MARTA at least, thanks jsvh! Do you have source? Just curious, as to where it came from so I have an idea for the future.

Now I just need the city's...

[bu2]

Originally Posted by Mossberg

...and also, buses are for poor black people! lol


Many idiots actually believe that crap unfortunately.


Seriously though, the "optional" riders are more likely to ride a train than take buses. It's a sad truth, but one which helps justifies rail over buses that are stuck in traffic.

Buses work fine on short trips, 3-4 miles or less, when service is frequent and reliable, even without dedicated lanes.

When buses are not frequent or reliable or are on long trips, then, yes, the buses are overwhelmingly for poor, mostly minority people. People with a choice are doing something different.

[primaltech]

This whole concept of 'Arterial Rapid Transit', is the key. IMO.

It's the maximum quality transit return for dollar spent, and should be able to be implemented without GDOT interference.

And I would define ART as, every quality and characteristic of BRT, except the exclusive dedicated travel lanes. But it has signal/intersection priority so that it doesn't have to wait at red lights, or have to yield to oncoming cars on left turns, etc.

I would even have us treat it and refer to it as BRT. I would like to see very limited and spaced out stops (bus stations), permanent and named stations, BRT lines and stations on the official main system rail map, even without dedicated lanes.

Buses, and/or streetcars. But the former is so much cheaper and easier and faster to implement. Put the streetcar only on non-road ROW's like the BeltLine, and on major-status, potentially high capacity-demanding corridors like Peachtree. And even still, it can be complimented with articulated or double decker buses running the same route in the same lane.