Why Is Atlanta Proper So Tiny? (Sandy Springs, Roswell: fit in, city hall, school districts)

[primaltech]

Yeah, that's called an independent city, which Georgia does not have. Baltimore is one also.

Atlanta should really be an independent city, rather than straddling 2 counties.

[SAAN]

People dont live on top of each other in Atlanta like you see in the NE, just go to NYC, DC and other areas and see block after block of people living in 3-5 story buildings+ for miles and in Atlanta, you dont see many condo's or apartments over 3 stories, until recently. Even when Atlanta had projects, the were more 2-3 stories compared to the huge ones you. would see in the North East.

I see it as a good thing too that everyone doesnt have to live on top of each other and battle for a street parking spot.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by SAAN

People dont live on top of each other in Atlanta like you see in the NE, just go to NYC, DC and other areas and see block after block of people living in 3-5 story buildings+ for miles and in Atlanta, you dont see many condo's or apartments over 3 stories, until recently. Even when Atlanta had projects, the were more 2-3 stories compared to the huge ones you. would see in the North East.

I see it as a good thing too that everyone doesnt have to live on top of each other and battle for a street parking spot.

Folks down here still appreciate a little ER.

[Jandrew5]

Originally Posted by primaltech

And what's even crazier is that that largest city (Peachtree Corners) was founded only in the last few years. Before 2012, the largest city in the county was the seat Lawrenceville, at well under 30,000. Lawrenceville is still the second largest city and it only just recently hit 30,000. While the county population is at 900,000+, soon enough to be a million people. The 2nd largest county in Georgia, only a little bit behind Fulton. [....]

Thanks, that was a lot. Is there a historic reason for this? For instance in SC, our cities appear so small because of our laws on annexation. I think 75% of the neighborhood has to agree. It's so tough that none of our cities are really trying. Columbia and Charleston are annexing unincorporated land, while Greenville just doesn't care. Even without expanding the tax base, Greenville is in a surplus anyway, and it's small appearance helps regional marketing.

So Greenville's official population is 60,000, but in reality it's a city of 300,000, which would put it 3rd in the Carolinas instead of....20th.

So that's why our cities look so small, we have antiquated annex laws and fighting joining the city is apart of the state culture now. What's Georgia's excuse? Did people in Gwinnett and etc historically fight annexations? Or do the cities just not care that much to expand? What's Georgia's law?

Originally Posted by dblackga

The last major annexation that Atlanta had was the annexation of Buckhead in 1950 [....]

Thanks for all that info.

[dblackga]

Originally Posted by primaltech

Anyway, the other crazy idea I've had, is if the 5 core counties all consolidated/incorporated as the 5 boroughs of one city of Atlanta, and everything currently called a city or a suburb, would become a neighborhood of Atlanta. Which would then be a city of about 4,000,000 (slightly larger than Los Angeles, 2nd biggest in the country only to New York.) And also it would solve the whole MARTA problem. And it would probably do a lot to help the schools too, if it was all one big school system.

Oh, HELL no. Atlanta doesn't have a great track record in providing services and CERTAINLY not quality education, with a very few notable examples. Why would the North Fulton schools and the Cobb County school systems want to join with Atlanta and get sucked into that black hole of reallocation of assets? That is precisely why Sandy Springs broke out as an independent city -- no control over their own zoning, because Fulton County would approve just about anything anywhere if they thought it would bring in taxes, but then the taxes would be spent in other areas, and our infrastructure lacked attention. Law enforcement was understandably scattered due to resources -- our current Sandy Springs police department is extremely responsive. And if there's a pothole, it gets fixed in hours, if not days, when the city is alerted. I can just see you trying to sell this idea to Cobb County, home of excellent schools and vehement opposer of MARTA. :-) Not. Going. To. Happen. Ever.

[PKCorey]

Originally Posted by primaltech

Yeah, that's called an independent city, which Georgia does not have. Baltimore is one also.

Atlanta should really be an independent city, rather than straddling 2 counties.

Beside VA and their unique independent city system, Baltimore, St. Louis and Carson City are the only cities in the country that independent from their respective counties.

As I've stated numerous times on here due to growing up in Maryland, the whole rush for cities here is weird to me.

In majority of the state, everything is run at the county level (besides Baltimore). They are very few cities in most counties. For the most part, the counties are unincorporated like here and everything still gets done without complaints.

[primaltech]

Originally Posted by Jandrew5

Or do the cities just not care that much to expand?

This is definitely the case with most of the historic cities in Gwinnett and Cobb (besides Smyrna, which annexes often), and cities like Decatur who don't want to lose their status of being exclusive and elite.

Well, Norcross and Duluth have annexed a bit, and Duluth would love to annex the Gwinnett Place area, but I haven't heard anything about those plans.

Peachtree Corners being founded (and with greedy borders that stretched well outside of the area historically known as Peachtree Corners), sparked some cities to try to annex quickly before the new city grabbed it up.

But for the most part, outside of Fulton and DeKalb, most everywhere is unincorporated and the people seem to be happy with that model for now.

[primaltech]

Originally Posted by dblackga

Oh, HELL no. Atlanta doesn't have a great track record in providing services and CERTAINLY not quality education, with a very few notable examples. Why would the North Fulton schools and the Cobb County school systems want to join with Atlanta and get sucked into that black hole of reallocation of assets? That is precisely why Sandy Springs broke out as an independent city -- no control over their own zoning, because Fulton County would approve just about anything anywhere if they thought it would bring in taxes, but then the taxes would be spent in other areas, and our infrastructure lacked attention. Law enforcement was understandably scattered due to resources -- our current Sandy Springs police department is extremely responsive. And if there's a pothole, it gets fixed in hours, if not days, when the city is alerted. I can just see you trying to sell this idea to Cobb County, home of excellent schools and vehement opposer of MARTA. :-) Not. Going. To. Happen. Ever.

I agree that it will definitely never happen, but, some of those complaints might not apply to what would be a completely different hypothetical animal than the small Atlanta we think of today.

Anyway, here's another idea. Marietta and Cobb County could become a consolidated city-county (like Athens/Clarke County), with coterminus borders. With the other cities and communities in Cobb becoming neighborhoods of Marietta. Taxes would be the same, same services, everything the same, except it would all be consolidated as one government for max efficiency.

Not to mention, this city would have 750,000 people, a ton more than Atlanta. (And interestingly, it wouldn't even be that much less dense than Atlanta.)

[stillinthesouth]

Originally Posted by SAAN

People dont live on top of each other in Atlanta like you see in the NE, just go to NYC, DC and other areas and see block after block of people living in 3-5 story buildings+ for miles and in Atlanta, you dont see many condo's or apartments over 3 stories, until recently. Even when Atlanta had projects, the were more 2-3 stories compared to the huge ones you. would see in the North East.

I see it as a good thing too that everyone doesnt have to live on top of each other and battle for a street parking spot.

Actually, there are 3-5 story apartment buildings all over the city, with more going up all the time. On Cumberland Blvd near the Braves stadium, at least five 5-6 story apartment projects have opened up in the past couple years. These projects aren't a new thing in the city core, but what is fairly new is the numerous large apartment buildings being developed just inside & outside the perimeter.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by primaltech

I agree that it will definitely never happen, but, some of those complaints might not apply to what would be a completely different hypothetical animal than the small Atlanta we think of today.

Anyway, here's another idea. Marietta and Cobb County could become a consolidated city-county (like Athens/Clarke County), with coterminus borders. With the other cities and communities in Cobb becoming neighborhoods of Marietta. Taxes would be the same, same services, everything the same, except it would all be consolidated as one government for max efficiency.

Not to mention, this city would have 750,000 people, a ton more than Atlanta. (And interestingly, it wouldn't even be that much less dense than Atlanta.)

That's a good point. Right now, Atlanta is dominated by the Intown and Southwest Atlanta interests. A bigger Atlanta (say one that included Sandy Springs, Dunwoody, Brookhaven and unincorporated DeKalb inside 285) would have to be more responsive to the interests of the outer areas and not just Intown.