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I don't know if you'd consider the existing Metrorail "rapid transit", but it is a rail service. For those of us who use it, it is a very efficient and timely way to get to work. Austin is the way it is not because of Capital Metro, but because of the attitude "Real Texans drive carz". I hypothetically asked an attorney at my firm if the Metrorail stopped not far from his home would he still take it and he said no. Followed up with a half-serious "Texans don't ride trains." Cap Metro is no NYC MTA, but if the populace isn't even helping partly, then mass transit is doomed to fail here. That's just the way it is. We can collectively lament or complain OR see if we can fit public transportation into our lives.
It would be nice if Metrorail could stop at the more vogue places in town, but that would cost an f-ton of money. People are already angry as it is. As an aside, I am pissy over the schedule changes. While aiming for one segment, Cap Metro totally Fs another segment (the working commuters) with their stupid schedule. I'm now having to ride a car home to work. Ugh. Despite this, though, it's been nothing but smooth sailing for this commuter and I find myself far less stressed than having to deal with Slow Pac or the parking lot known as 35.
I don't know if you'd consider the existing Metrorail "rapid transit", but it is a rail service. For those of us who use it, it is a very efficient and timely way to get to work. Austin is the way it is not because of Capital Metro, but because of the attitude "Real Texans drive carz". I hypothetically asked an attorney at my firm if the Metrorail stopped not far from his home would he still take it and he said no. Followed up with a half-serious "Texans don't ride trains." Cap Metro is no NYC MTA, but if the populace isn't even helping partly, then mass transit is doomed to fail here. That's just the way it is. We can collectively lament or complain OR see if we can fit public transportation into our lives.
It would be nice if Metrorail could stop at the more vogue places in town, but that would cost an f-ton of money. People are already angry as it is. As an aside, I am pissy over the schedule changes. While aiming for one segment, Cap Metro totally Fs another segment (the working commuters) with their stupid schedule. I'm now having to ride a car home to work. Ugh. Despite this, though, it's been nothing but smooth sailing for this commuter and I find myself far less stressed than having to deal with Slow Pac or the parking lot known as 35.
I would totally take it on weekend evenings to go downtown and to go downtown for festivals. I live 10 minutes from my office so wouldnt commute.
When you say "is what we have today smart" my answer is, it depends on what criteria you are judging the system on. For maximum convenience, today's system is probably more optimal than a limited service train. For energy conservation, riding bikes might be the best system.
You say the system now does not work, but that is a massive exaggeration. Today's system moves hundreds of thousands of people a day relatively quickly (even including traffic). The current commuter rail system only moves 450 people a day (800 boarding assuming most people make round trips)! I'm not saying the system today is perfect, but it does work well for many people. I need to say that again, the commuter rail system that cost $150 million to build (and loses money on every rider) moves around 400 people a day.
You can walk everywhere if you want to in 100 degree heat and rain, but obviously that is a non-solution for most people. Is your real agenda here to control other people and force them to live like you want or is it to make transportation better (more efficient, more convenient)?
Los Angeles has a train system too that nobody rides. LA has terrible traffic and people still choose driving over taking the train, because the train is a worse solution for most people than driving in traffic. Yes some people live and work right off the train line and they like it, but it's not worth building a very expensive system to make the commute nice for a tiny percentage of the public.
You can't ignore the way that Austin is organized when designing a transit system.
BTW Steam powered trains were around at least as far back as 1550...not that it matters.
Last edited by LittleCityATX; 09-27-2010 at 09:51 PM..
When you say "is what we have today smart" my answer is, it depends on what criteria you are judging the system on. For maximum convenience, today's system is probably more optimal than a limited service train. For energy conservation, riding bikes might be the best system.
You say the system now does not work, but that is a massive exaggeration. Today's system moves hundreds of thousands of people a day relatively quickly (even including traffic). The current commuter rail system only moves 450 people a day (800 boarding assuming most people make round trips)! I'm not saying the system today is perfect, but it does work well for many people. I need to say that again, the commuter rail system that cost $150 million to build (and loses money on every rider) moves around 400 people a day.
You can walk everywhere if you want to in 100 degree heat and rain, but obviously that is a non-solution for most people. Is your real agenda here to control other people and force them to live like you want or is it to make transportation better (more efficient, more convenient)?
Los Angeles has a train system too that nobody rides. LA has terrible traffic and people still choose driving over taking the train, because the train is a worse solution for most people than driving in traffic. Yes some people live and work right off the train line and they like it, but it's not worth building a very expensive system to make the commute nice for a tiny percentage of the public.
You can't ignore the way that Austin is organized when designing a transit system.
BTW Steam powered trains were around at least as far back as 1550...not that it matters.
Actually alot of ppl in LA ride the Train , everytime they open a line it fills up. About 1.5 million ppl use the LA Transit system after the 2030 plan is finished that will climb to 6 million. Your transit system and Laughable Rail line is built and laided out all wrong thats why you get low ridership. Also 150 million $$ for a line that long is expensive. There are 4 lines here that are shorter and costing half that. You get Traffic everywhere , we get Traffic up here in the NYC Metro and 85% of the region uses Transit daily. 14 million Daily , we currently restoring our rail system back to 1950s levels to keep up with demands. Building a Transit system encourages smart dense growth and investments into your city. Roads and Highways do not cause developments. If were restoring Rural lines here that tells you something , lines that go through areas with farms and small towns. Those lines still get a decent ridership of 4,000+
When you say "is what we have today smart" my answer is, it depends on what criteria you are judging the system on. For maximum convenience, today's system is probably more optimal than a limited service train. For energy conservation, riding bikes might be the best system.
You say the system now does not work, but that is a massive exaggeration. Today's system moves hundreds of thousands of people a day relatively quickly (even including traffic). The current commuter rail system only moves 450 people a day (800 boarding assuming most people make round trips)! I'm not saying the system today is perfect, but it does work well for many people. I need to say that again, the commuter rail system that cost $150 million to build (and loses money on every rider) moves around 400 people a day.
You can walk everywhere if you want to in 100 degree heat and rain, but obviously that is a non-solution for most people. Is your real agenda here to control other people and force them to live like you want or is it to make transportation better (more efficient, more convenient)?
Los Angeles has a train system too that nobody rides. LA has terrible traffic and people still choose driving over taking the train, because the train is a worse solution for most people than driving in traffic. Yes some people live and work right off the train line and they like it, but it's not worth building a very expensive system to make the commute nice for a tiny percentage of the public.
You can't ignore the way that Austin is organized when designing a transit system.
BTW Steam powered trains were around at least as far back as 1550...not that it matters.
Actually, the entire USA is behind the times per national transit*****we "sold our souls" to the interstates long ago...once we built them out, we had no time or money to elaborate on the train concept, had a pale version of a national train system(Amtrak) that was poorly funded and fizzled, and now we are stuck with an highway infrastructure that we cannot afford to maintain...per the nationl, state, and local interstate grid, we cannot even afford to maintain the larger bridges and overpasses than are rapidly aging anymore, let alone build out new roads that simply get overwhelmed shortly after buildout.
.the layout of the city indeed seems to preclude anything but SMART transport....when one has to drive 2 miles from the subdivision to get groceries or gas, with no sidewalks for the kids(so mega gas burning driving all kids under 16 everywhere), and work sites spread all over the city, any sense of gridwork or continuity is obviously a challenge to overlay logically....pods are no answer either..I think we subconsciously channel jetson's morning cartoons when we conjure up that idea, or anything that smacks of that same waste of individual vehicles rambling all over like overexcited gas molecules in a flask....
It's a tradeoff...you can have "complete freedom", or be a part of an overarching commonweal..but what we have are all the headaches of both with none of the benefits of either....and all these cars on the roads are using a vehicle that harnesses only 15% of the energy burned to actually
engage the driving "train" on the transmission..all the rest is dissipated as heat and friction, along with the wind drag on the highways...LA may prefer their cars to the newer public trans options, but they also have the most polluted metro in the US, specifically because of that dependence on those cars....and that's also one of ther reasons, along with the crime and economy, so many people are bailing out of So Cal, and moving to places like Austin, only to continue the same song and dance here...they've found a great place to maintain that continuity in Austin!
Looked up the other 14 cities ahead of us in population, and they all have either light rail or rapid transit...Yep, we seem to worship stats and top ten lists here in Austin, so I hate to toss out another one...but, this one makes you think a bit, doesn't it?
One caveat..one of the cities is working on it now, for built out in 2012, San Antonio...thats what sparked conversation about the Austin-SA train on here, by the way..
All the other 13 cities have fully functioning systems..Austin has nothing..
I might be misunderstanding when someone says that "Austin has nothing" and "Austin is the largest city with no light rail/rapid transit system" regarding trains, but didn't a commuter rail from Leander to downtown with about 8 or 10 stops along the way (with most of them within the city limits) open a few months ago? Or is some other negative distinction being made here?
Found this stat on Yahoo, per the world passing the USA in many categories...
Brazil, Canada, and Mexico all invest a greater share of GDP in clean energy
A Pew survey found that Brazil invests 0.37% of its economy in clean energy. Canada invests 0.25% and Mexico invests 0.14%. America is eleventh in the world at 0.13%.
Here is the link...keep in mind that if we have no money for any new trans grid, or even to maintain the current trans infrastructure, where will even the solvent US cities be in 5-10 years? Reading this, we can either debunk it and go on as before with the old ways, or wake up like a SOB and shake things up beyond belief here, before its too late, and we don't have access to funding for a more sustainable, affordable system even if we had the wil to build one..
Central, but not near one of the stops. Close to the track. Like a little kid, I only get to watch it go by my street and wonder! Don't commute but would like the opportunity to ride the train. The limited schedule negates any usage from me. Guess I'll have to take a day off work to cross that one off the list....
Speaking of "special events," think about UT football. I'm surprised that they haven't partnered and promoted a gameday park-and-ride, down to the MLK stop with shuttles to campus. I can't think of a better LARGE event, with multiple dates to increase ridership....
Paul, sure we have the Leander-DT, but that's not really a fully functional system...just 9 stops, no service at all between 9AM and 3PM(That's either way..entire system shuts down in both directions daily for 6 hours, during the 9-5 rush).....and no service after 6:25 southbound on week-end nights, so no one can use it to go DT or to UT for events.....no service at all on week-ends as well....
So much money was spent and wasted that the planners would have looked like fools to back out, but they have far too much of a shell of a system to call this light rail....looks like it, smells like it, but is not it...and no tracks solely dedicated to the trains, so they must jostle with right of way issues with other MoPac trains, and sometimes actually have to stop and let them pass....
Can they add to it, and make it a bona-fide system? Sure.....but this version is such a pale shade of a healthy, fullu functioning system that it doesn't count.
Paul, sure we have the Leander-DT, but that's not really a fully functional system...just 9 stops, no service at all between 9AM and 3PM(That's either way..entire system shuts down in both directions daily for 6 hours, during the 9-5 rush).....and no service after 6:25 southbound on week-end nights, so no one can use it to go DT or to UT for events.....no service at all on week-ends as well....
So much money was spent and wasted that the planners would have looked like fools to back out, but they have far too much of a shell of a system to call this light rail....looks like it, smells like it, but is not it...and no tracks solely dedicated to the trains, so they must jostle with right of way issues with other MoPac trains, and sometimes actually have to stop and let them pass....
Can they add to it, and make it a bona-fide system? Sure.....but this version is such a pale shade of a healthy, fullu functioning system that it doesn't count.
I'm not debating whether or not the line is great or even passable. I guess I was just curious as to why, if you already knew of the existence of it, you specifically said that "Austin has nothing" and "Austin is the largest city with no light rail/rapid transit system", both of which are simply untrue. But I probably should have already known why you'd do that.
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