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$70-$100 charge is the hourly shop rate and most have minimum 1 hour charges a few of them will have half hour charges.
You can get the codes read for free at most auto parts stores but that means nothing if you aren't mechanically inclined and know what the codes mean. For example a P0300 (Random/Multiple Cylinder Misfire Detected) code could be anything from fuel, ignition to bad sensors or even internal mechanical engine problems.
These trouble codes are only a starting point of what the problem is.
$70-$100 charge is the hourly shop rate and most have minimum 1 hour charges a few of them will have half hour charges.
You can get the codes read for free at most auto parts stores but that means nothing if you aren't mechanically inclined and know what the codes mean. For example a P0300 (Random/Multiple Cylinder Misfire Detected) code could be anything from fuel, ignition to bad sensors or even internal mechanical engine problems.
These trouble codes are only a starting point of what the problem is.
Good post. Code pulls can, occasionally, be tantamount to a diagnosis but frequently are not. The chain auto parts stores that offer free code pulls sells buttloads of parts associated with the code pulls. They sell buttloads of EGR valves for EGR fault codes when the problem is almost always clogged passages on certain vehicles or, for another example, a bad DPFE sensor on a Ford truck.
There is a difference between a simple OBDII code reader and a sophisticated scanner with enhanced data stream, bi-directional tests, etc. Just the annual updates for such a scanner would buy 5-15 simple code readers.
Good post. Code pulls can, occasionally, be tantamount to a diagnosis but frequently are not. The chain auto parts stores that offer free code pulls sells buttloads of parts associated with the code pulls. They sell buttloads of EGR valves for EGR fault codes when the problem is almost always clogged passages on certain vehicles or, for another example, a bad DPFE sensor on a Ford truck.
There is a difference between a simple OBDII code reader and a sophisticated scanner with enhanced data stream, bi-directional tests, etc. Just the annual updates for such a scanner would buy 5-15 simple code readers.
Don in Austin
I will respectfully disagree with this assessment. While there are code readers that only read codes there are also scanners that allow device observation. No matter what, rarely watching operation is going to be used to diagnose cause. I typically read the code, and then research cause and diagnosis for repair.
My daughters 97 F150 gave me an EGR code, and it turned out to dirty passages in the neck from the manifold to the throttlebody. When my 01 F150 gave me the same code I assumed that was the cause, but Ford had repaired the issue, and made the passages larger. Turned out it was the EGR solenoid.
Some people need to go to a mechanic, but some of us don't. I've always done my own work my entire life. I have a Autoxray 2000 scanner (not code reader) for OBD2, and Autoxray XP240 for my OBD1. My Corvette will pull codes from the dash, and I have the factory service manuals (I rarely use) for reference if I need them. Usually an internet search will bring more information than any other source will ever have.
I'll admit to being the exception, but to replace an EGR because you pull an EGR fault code means you should be going to someone else!
I will respectfully disagree with this assessment. While there are code readers that only read codes there are also scanners that allow device observation. No matter what, rarely watching operation is going to be used to diagnose cause. I typically read the code, and then research cause and diagnosis for repair.
My daughters 97 F150 gave me an EGR code, and it turned out to dirty passages in the neck from the manifold to the throttlebody. When my 01 F150 gave me the same code I assumed that was the cause, but Ford had repaired the issue, and made the passages larger. Turned out it was the EGR solenoid.
Some people need to go to a mechanic, but some of us don't. I've always done my own work my entire life. I have a Autoxray 2000 scanner (not code reader) for OBD2, and Autoxray XP240 for my OBD1. My Corvette will pull codes from the dash, and I have the factory service manuals (I rarely use) for reference if I need them. Usually an internet search will bring more information than any other source will ever have.
I'll admit to being the exception, but to replace an EGR because you pull an EGR fault code means you should be going to someone else!
I also agree. I purchased a higher end code scanner that does a little bit more than just pull and erase codes. It has proven to be all that I really need when doing my own DIY work. A lot of newer cars have their own internal diagnostics as well for subsystems. My Infiniti has a way to generate DTC's for the HVAC system through the interface to troubleshoot things like a failing temp sensor as well. There are self-test functions for the TPMS, ABS, Airbags, etc etc. If you have the information on how do to this, you can accomplish quite a bit of home repairs.
You can also purchase a cheap Consult from China...although I personally wouldn't do this
Granted, this is a skill that not many people have. I realize my mother probably won't be able to figure out how to troubleshoot a check engine light, and I sure as hell don't want to start fixing everyone's car in the neighborhood because i deem a repair as simple to the average DIYer.
So while an answer to the OP may be to go to a parts store and have the code read for free...would they know what to do with that information? For the $70-100 or so, you would hope you get a good interpretation of the problem from the mechanic as well...
Now that leads to another issue...mechanics who just throw parts at a problem or those that troubleshoot.
I will respectfully disagree with this assessment. While there are code readers that only read codes there are also scanners that allow device observation. No matter what, rarely watching operation is going to be used to diagnose cause. I typically read the code, and then research cause and diagnosis for repair.
My daughters 97 F150 gave me an EGR code, and it turned out to dirty passages in the neck from the manifold to the throttlebody. When my 01 F150 gave me the same code I assumed that was the cause, but Ford had repaired the issue, and made the passages larger. Turned out it was the EGR solenoid.
Some people need to go to a mechanic, but some of us don't. I've always done my own work my entire life. I have a Autoxray 2000 scanner (not code reader) for OBD2, and Autoxray XP240 for my OBD1. My Corvette will pull codes from the dash, and I have the factory service manuals (I rarely use) for reference if I need them. Usually an internet search will bring more information than any other source will ever have.
I'll admit to being the exception, but to replace an EGR because you pull an EGR fault code means you should be going to someone else!
I don't understand what you disagree with. Of course there is a wide range of scanners. At the very bottom end pull and erase generic OBDII codes and little else. Intermediate supports factory specific (P1xxx) codes, possibly with descriptions, datastream and a few bi-directional tests. Top end includes codes for OBDII and factory specific engine, systems other than engine, and most bi-directional controls. To do absolutely everything that can be accessed through the OBDII port will generally require the factory tool and software.
You can research pattern failures on the internet but you can also conduct logical testing. Ford truck with P0401:
What are the DPFE readings as seen on the scan tool?
What were freeze frame readings when code was set?
Does opening the EGR valve manually cause rough idle/stall?
Does the EGR solenoid turn EGR on and off when hot-wired and do DPFE readings respond appropriately ?
I will respectfully disagree with this assessment. While there are code readers that only read codes there are also scanners that allow device observation. No matter what, rarely watching operation is going to be used to diagnose cause. I typically read the code, and then research cause and diagnosis for repair.
My daughters 97 F150 gave me an EGR code, and it turned out to dirty passages in the neck from the manifold to the throttlebody. When my 01 F150 gave me the same code I assumed that was the cause, but Ford had repaired the issue, and made the passages larger. Turned out it was the EGR solenoid.
Some people need to go to a mechanic, but some of us don't. I've always done my own work my entire life. I have a Autoxray 2000 scanner (not code reader) for OBD2, and Autoxray XP240 for my OBD1. My Corvette will pull codes from the dash, and I have the factory service manuals (I rarely use) for reference if I need them. Usually an internet search will bring more information than any other source will ever have.
I'll admit to being the exception, but to replace an EGR because you pull an EGR fault code means you should be going to someone else!
I've been fixing cars for close to 20 years I'm not a pro myself but I'm damn good. I disagree with you saying "rarely watching operation is going to be used to diagnose cause"
For example you can have bad 02 sensors and no codes. With an advanced scan tool with live data you can watch oxygen sensor voltage waveforms to see if they are switching correctly. A lazy 02 sensor will not set a code all the time.
Bad 02 sensors can affect fuel economy severely and without live data with a more advanced scan tool you would never know the 02 is bad. Or it could be a small exhaust leak ahead of the 02 that you can't hear.
I've been fixing cars for close to 20 years I'm not a pro myself but I'm damn good. I disagree with you saying "rarely watching operation is going to be used to diagnose cause"
For example you can have bad 02 sensors and no codes. With an advanced scan tool with live data you can watch oxygen sensor voltage waveforms to see if they are switching correctly. A lazy 02 sensor will not set a code all the time.
Bad 02 sensors can affect fuel economy severely and without live data with a more advanced scan tool you would never know the 02 is bad. Or it could be a small exhaust leak ahead of the 02 that you can't hear.
Don't need to if it's recording cross counts it's functioning. I watch voltage when tuning custom engines, but never to determine operation.
The cheap code scanners (even ones up to $250 in most cases) are never going to be as good as the dealer specific diagnostic tools. As cars get more and more complex, the dealer tool is increasingly the only one that is actually worth a damn.
Personally, I don't like to waste money. If I buy a scan tool, it needs to be able to do everything from reading codes, to resetting service indicators, to calibrating TPMS or turning on/off functions. Nowadays, only the manufacturer diagnostic stuff can do that.
Don't need to if it's recording cross counts it's functioning. I watch voltage when tuning custom engines, but never to determine operation.
Doesn't sound like you know how an 02 sensor is supposed to work. Just because it's "functioning" doesn't mean it's functioning properly.
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