Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
We have a 2001 Saturn SL2, manual transmission. We recently replaced the engine, and while the car has very high mileage (over 240K) we hope and expect to get at least 2-3 more years of service from the vehicle.
But we are having an unusual problem. Every now and then, the car refuses to start. The starter, battery, and alternator all test out fine. A jump start will not succeed when the car develops this attitude problem. The problem is more common when trying to start from a warm engine. About two to three times per month, when you stop for gas, plan to be there for at least an hour before the car will start again. We can’t park it to run into a convenience store for a drink, we have to keep it running.
Once or twice a month, it will also not start from a cold engine.
So, how do we get it to start? Waiting 45 minutes or more, without doing anything else, the car will start right up. Pushing the car a few feet forward or back will start it sometimes. If you’re parked on a hill though, and let it roll rather than pushing, and it won’t start.
We’ve had it to three different mechanics. One told us the rug on the floor of the drivers side was getting caught under the clutch, so you couldn’t push the clutch down far enough, so the car wouldn’t start. We got rid of the rug, still having the same problem.
One told us it had something to do with a gasket getting oil on it, and causing the car not to start from a warm engine. That didn’t explain the cold start issue, but it sounded semi-reasonable, so we let them do $400 worth of work. It fixed the problem for about 4 weeks, and now it’s back.
The third mechanic has no idea what would cause this, he wants to replace all the wiring in the car. That’s expensive, and I think unnecessary. It feels to me like random guesswork – fix enough things on the car, and one of them is bound to fix the problem.
My husband thinks it’s the ignition switch, but it seems to me that the non-start would be happening more often. We’ve had it work fine for 2-3 weeks, then refuse to start 2-3 times in so many days. Then we’ve had it happen once every 6-10 days, for a significant stretch of time.
I tracked things like weather, number of passengers, time of day, and come up with no patterns.
The only theory I can come up with that makes ANY sense to me, is that the car is 13 years old. We all know that teenagers are moody and difficult.
Any other theories? My mechanics and husband don’t buy mine.
I would replace the clutch switch and the neutral safety switch "just because". Those switches prevent starting while in gear - and they get dirty / wear out with that high a mileage.
Also examine / test all the wiring and connections to those switches. Wires which bend back and forth will break eventually - like a coat hanger. So a car bouncing up/down for 200k miles can wear out wiring. Give the wiring a "wiggle" test. (Connect continuity tester and wiggle the wires to be sure there are no breaks or intermittent connections in the wire.)
Another test is a voltage drop test (for wiring). And ohms measurement on the wiring / switches / connections. High ohms is bad, low ohms is good.
Many mechanics are good at mechanical things, but do not know much about the above electrical testing. Find an automotive electrical person!
My FIL had the same issue but with a Mazda MPV (older model, 2000 or so). Would just randomly not start, no crank or anything. So he pretty much left it running and never turned off the car until he went home.
Not sure what the culprit was but I think it was a related to relays or something like that
Location: The Circle City. Sometimes NE of Bagdad.
24,480 posts, read 26,021,800 times
Reputation: 59858
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarrieM
We have a 2001 Saturn SL2, manual transmission. We recently replaced the engine, and while the car has very high mileage (over 240K) we hope and expect to get at least 2-3 more years of service from the vehicle.
But we are having an unusual problem. Every now and then, the car refuses to start. The starter, battery, and alternator all test out fine. A jump start will not succeed when the car develops this attitude problem. The problem is more common when trying to start from a warm engine. About two to three times per month, when you stop for gas, plan to be there for at least an hour before the car will start again. We can’t park it to run into a convenience store for a drink, we have to keep it running.
Once or twice a month, it will also not start from a cold engine.
So, how do we get it to start? Waiting 45 minutes or more, without doing anything else, the car will start right up. Pushing the car a few feet forward or back will start it sometimes. If you’re parked on a hill though, and let it roll rather than pushing, and it won’t start.
We’ve had it to three different mechanics. One told us the rug on the floor of the drivers side was getting caught under the clutch, so you couldn’t push the clutch down far enough, so the car wouldn’t start. We got rid of the rug, still having the same problem.
One told us it had something to do with a gasket getting oil on it, and causing the car not to start from a warm engine. That didn’t explain the cold start issue, but it sounded semi-reasonable, so we let them do $400 worth of work. It fixed the problem for about 4 weeks, and now it’s back.
The third mechanic has no idea what would cause this, he wants to replace all the wiring in the car. That’s expensive, and I think unnecessary. It feels to me like random guesswork – fix enough things on the car, and one of them is bound to fix the problem.
My husband thinks it’s the ignition switch, but it seems to me that the non-start would be happening more often. We’ve had it work fine for 2-3 weeks, then refuse to start 2-3 times in so many days. Then we’ve had it happen once every 6-10 days, for a significant stretch of time.
I tracked things like weather, number of passengers, time of day, and come up with no patterns.
The only theory I can come up with that makes ANY sense to me, is that the car is 13 years old. We all know that teenagers are moody and difficult.
Any other theories? My mechanics and husband don’t buy mine.
The question I have.. I am assuming that the car turns over, just doesn't fire?
IF that's the case, you eliminate the battery, alternator and starter right there.
There's 2 other things that cause a car not to start (More, but, we're keeping it simple here)
1) No fire
2) No fuel
(Outside of simple, we have incorrect fuel/air mixture, which could be from a number of things, or lack of compression and so on, but.. we're not going there)
So, when this happens.. Are you not getting fire, or not getting fuel? A timing light will pretty much narrow it down.. My bet would be fuel.. And.. Fuel pump would be the chief suspect.
But.. Things like fuel filter could come into play.. I wouldn't suspect it because whether the vehicle is hot or cold would make no difference to it.
Million dollar question.. Does it turn over or not? Because if it doesn't.. All what I said above goes out the window.
The question I have.. I am assuming that the car turns over, just doesn't fire?
IF that's the case, you eliminate the battery, alternator and starter right there.
There's 2 other things that cause a car not to start (More, but, we're keeping it simple here)
1) No fire
2) No fuel
(Outside of simple, we have incorrect fuel/air mixture, which could be from a number of things, or lack of compression and so on, but.. we're not going there)
So, when this happens.. Are you not getting fire, or not getting fuel? A timing light will pretty much narrow it down.. My bet would be fuel.. And.. Fuel pump would be the chief suspect.
But.. Things like fuel filter could come into play.. I wouldn't suspect it because whether the vehicle is hot or cold would make no difference to it.
Million dollar question.. Does it turn over or not? Because if it doesn't.. All what I said above goes out the window.
90+% of the time, the car starts just fine. When the non-start issue happens, we turn the key and have full electrical power (lights, radio, etc all work fine) but there is no clicking (like you would hear with a dead starter), there is no sound of the car trying to start, there is nothing but lights and radio. But wait an hour, or push it a few feet, and it seems to start up again just fine.
We're taking it to a mechanic who specializes in electrical systems over the holiday weekend. Hopefully it's something simple like the ignition switch.
Location: IN>Germany>ND>OH>TX>CA>Currently NoVa and a Vacation Lake House in PA
3,259 posts, read 4,338,417 times
Reputation: 13476
Sounds like it could be the starter getting heat soaked. I don't recall that being a problem for the S-Series of cars though. I agree with the above poster that Saturnfans is a very good resource.
Is there or was there ever a car alarm installed or factory alarm with starter kill on this car? You can also check voltage to the starter solenoid when you are having this non start. If you do not have voltage when you are trying to crank something is breaking the start circuit.
We have a 2002 JeeP which had a similar problem and it turned out to be a bad ground on a starter relay under the main fuse block in the engine compartment. It also had a dead spot in the starter. I actually carried a remote starter with me and when it wouldn't start I would climb under, connect the remote start and fire it up. What a pain.
I eventually had to bring it to the mechanics and that bad ground is what they found. I was mad that I hadn't dug deep enough to fix it myself.
My custom sports car had a hard starting problem when hot which I found was a common problem. It would turn over like it had a dead battery. The solution was a new battery and putting in a heavier battery cable ( the battery is in the trunk) and now it starts like a champ.
Search for a bad ground.
Check that ignition switch.
Also you may want to check the timing of the engine.
Good luck.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
