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It has to be more efficient than fossil fuels. That’s all. However that’s assuming miracles in energy density, and assumes resource cost for EV’s never go up, which of course is impossible given that you would need to replace billions of cars with massive battery packs. It also assume gas prices go up which seems to be impossible.
What miracle, guy? EVs are competitive now for most private automobile usage and the track record of batteries for several decades has been the same with no theoretical limit in even current battery chemistry to hit against for another few decades by which time energy density has already become radically more competitive than they are even today. EVs are now now more efficient than most fossil fuels though not necessarily all since natural gas to generate electricity is still very competitive with solar and wind, but that is still better in multiple ways than the inefficient ICE.
What miracle, guy? EVs are competitive now for most private automobile usage and the track record of batteries for several decades has been the same with no theoretical limit in even current battery chemistry to hit against for another few decades by which time energy density has already become radically more competitive than they are even today. It is now more efficient than most fossil fuels though not necessarily all since natural gas to generate electricity is still very competitive with solar and wind.
Competitive now? A Model 3 is $50k. A Bolt is a $15k car that cost $40k. I still have to worry about cold weather range, long charge times, poor towing capability (lack of range), and the only answer is I have to hope that energy density increases as the same rate as it has historically (yet it’s diminishing) and that somebody will just add more fast charging stations spaced 50 miles apart on every road in the world. They are far from competitive.
What has to happen? basically having the convenience to charge up a car as quickly and as easy as it is now to fill a car with gasoline.
Yea, that would make it really competitive because in addition to that you could also charge up at home and work or anywhere you park with an outlet and plus you wouldn't necessarily need to reserve real estate unable to house any business (including parking lots and parking garages) or people for such as you would for gas stations. If all things were equal and then you had that additional advantage along with no tailpipe emissions, quieter vehicles, and better acceleration with real estate opened up since charging can be that ubiquitous, then ICE vehicles would be scarce. Given current trends, you're looking at within a decade for that.
Yea, that would make it really competitive because in addition to that you could also charge up at home and work or anywhere you park with an outlet. If all things were equal and then you had that additional advantage along with no tailpipe emissions, quieter vehicles, and better acceleration, then ICE vehicles would be scarce. Given current trends, you're looking at within a decade for that.
But they don’t get better acceleration. Fast acceleration is a function of horsepower and traction. All that cost money and news flash, few people buy cars for acceleration. If you can charge at home it doesn’t make sense to have a huge battery. You can charge a plug in hybrid with a small battery for commuting on a 110v outlet overnight. Having a large battery means I have to pay to upgrade my home infrastructure. Otherwise to top off That extra battery, I need to hike to the nearest interstate charging station which isn’t on the way to work.
But they don’t get better acceleration. Fast acceleration is a function of horsepower and traction. All that cost money and news flash, few people buy cars for acceleration. If you can charge at home it doesn’t make sense to have a huge battery. You can charge a plug in hybrid with a small battery for commuting on a 110v outlet overnight. Having a large battery means I have to pay to upgrade my home infrastructure. Otherwise to top off That extra battery, I need to hike to the nearest interstate charging station which isn’t on the way to work.
You might confused here—EVs generally do have better acceleration that their ICE counterparts and that’s not really up for argument. Are you saying a Leaf has worse acceleration than a Lambo? Sure! That’s not really the Leaf’s counterpart by most people’s reckoning. It also wasn’t a sole reason for choosing an EV though I personally am into it. You can charge a plugin hybrid on a 110v! Plugins are great! You can also charge a straight BEV.
Again, the topic was what it takes to to make BEVs happen—I responded to a good point which is more ubiquitous and faster charging stations.
Electric automobiles are not the solution to the problems caused by the current automobile / pavement / petroleum hegemony.
It only affects one of the interested parties. And they're fighting back as hard as they can.
THE REAL SOLUTION
Electric traction rail aka railroad aka steel wheel on steel rail.
Why?
Laws of Physics. Lowest coefficient of rolling resistance. Up to 95% savings in fuel consumption (more, if regenerative braking is used). Most efficient form of land transportation (barring a technological breakthrough). Safe (compare over 40,000 automobile deaths in 2017). Minimal land (one track has the equivalent carrying capacity of 9 lanes of superhighway). Scaleable (Service can improve by changes in headway, train length, double decker cars, express tracks, prepaid fares, and so on). Minimal pollution (no oil drips, shredded tire particles, filth, fumes, lung injuries). No need for parking spaces. Higher speeds possible (currently limited by bureaucratic regulations).
EU: Train passengers killed per billion passenger-kilometres, 2015-2016 (0.10 passengers killed per billion passenger-kilometres).
... 964 deaths occurred in 2016 due to railroad accidents.
Only a minority (8 %) of rail accident victims in the EU-28 were actually passengers traveling on trains or railway employees. The majority, the remaining 92 %, was constituted of ‘other persons' (e.g.: level-crossing users or unauthorised persons on railway premises).
OH STOP ALL THIS CONSPIRACY NONSENSE
You know there was no such thing as a conspiracy to eliminate America’s once premier electric traction rail network (urban and interurban). How could there be a collusion between special interests and corrupt politicians to saddle Americans like beasts of burden, enriching all the “right” people.
We’re not stupid!
We weren’t fooled into keeping an ‘old fashioned’ mode of transportation, despite it costing 20 times less in fuel compared to pneumatic tire on pavement (20:1 advantage due to rolling resistance). Americans aren’t bamboozled by mere budgetary constraints, nor are they against paving over more and more land so that we can have glorious superhighway convenience, door to door.
Who cares that one track of rail has the equivalent capacity of 9 lanes of superhighway? Or that a 4 track urban subway, like NYC, is the equivalent of 36 lanes of superhighway? And let’s not forget safety issues. We Americans are outraged at a mere hundred deaths per year by ‘police brutality’ while ignoring 40,100 (2017) annual deaths from traffic incidents. In contrast, the tally of passenger deaths via frightful rail travel is often zero in most years. (UK reported zero passenger fatalities in the last 10 years)
Americans do not want a scalable, frugal, efficient, non-polluting, fast, safe and comfortable way to travel in and through our now decaying inner cities, which lack parking space necessary for our national ritual of automobile travel. We don’t want to be free of petroleum imports, nor foreign entanglements necessary to maintain our lifeline of fuel. We prefer sacrificing our precious children and resources in endless unWars.
Americans are too smart to believe in any conspiracy to make them perpetual servants of the automobile / petroleum / pavement hegemony and all their collaborators, cohorts, and minions. That’s almost as bad as believing in a conspiracy to keep housing costs high, while driving more and more people into the streets, homeless.
But they don’t get better acceleration. Fast acceleration is a function of horsepower and traction. All that cost money and news flash, few people buy cars for acceleration. If you can charge at home it doesn’t make sense to have a huge battery. You can charge a plug in hybrid with a small battery for commuting on a 110v outlet overnight. Having a large battery means I have to pay to upgrade my home infrastructure. Otherwise to top off That extra battery, I need to hike to the nearest interstate charging station which isn’t on the way to work.
Weight. Batteries are HEAVY. Larger batteries means more weight. A quantum leap in battery technology that would enable MUCH lower weight and longer battery life needs to happen as well as much shorter charging times. A gallon of gas is much more efficient than a similar weight in other methods of propulsion.
You might confused here—EVs generally do have better acceleration that their ICE counterparts and that’s not really up for argument. Are you saying a Leaf has worse acceleration than a Lambo? Sure! That’s not really the Leaf’s counterpart by most people’s reckoning. It also wasn’t a sole reason for choosing an EV though I personally am into it. You can charge a plugin hybrid on a 110v! Plugins are great! You can also charge a straight BEV.
Again, the topic was what it takes to to make BEVs happen—I responded to a good point which is more ubiquitous and faster charging stations.
No. Acceleration is a function of horsepower and traction. Otherwise you could use a steam engine with the right gearing.
Weight. Batteries are HEAVY. Larger batteries means more weight. A quantum leap in battery technology that would enable MUCH lower weight and longer battery life needs to happen as well as much shorter charging times. A gallon of gas is much more efficient than a similar weight in other methods of propulsion.
If they bring back catenary power distribution for trams / streetcars, it might be possible to allow private automobiles to tap into it. That's probably the only practical way to improve range for battery operated electric vehicles.
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