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Boing and Airbus hold a duopoly of the worlds airliners, but it seems that Russia's United Aircraft Corporation and China's Comac are trying to end that. Back in May these two companies had their maiden flights for their airliners that will compete with the Boing 737 MAX and the Airbus A320neo. The Russians built the Irkut MC-21 and the Chinese built the Comac C919. Furthermore these two companies are partnering up to build the Comac C929 which will compete with the Boing 787 and the Airbus A330neo, it is projected to be complete in 2025-2028. There is also the Ilyushin Il-96-400 that is scheduled for 2019. So how successful do you think they will be? Will their planes be bought all around the world or only their domestic airlines will end up buying them?
russia has tried before and failed. china is going to use boeing resources against boeing, but i am not sure theyh can pull it off like airbus did. still it might become the third largest commercial aircraft manufacturer in the world, someday.
The article uses 'jumbo jet' as synonymous with 'widebody'. But the terms are not the same - a jumbo jet refers to the largest of the widebodies, such as the 747 and the A380. The aircraft described in this article would not be a jumbo. Popular Science should know better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grega94
Boing and Airbus hold a duopoly of the worlds airliners, but it seems that Russia's United Aircraft Corporation and China's Comac are trying to end that. Back in May these two companies had their maiden flights for their airliners that will compete with the Boing 737 MAX and the Airbus A320neo. The Russians built the Irkut MC-21 and the Chinese built the Comac C919. Furthermore these two companies are partnering up to build the Comac C929 which will compete with the Boing 787 and the Airbus A330neo, it is projected to be complete in 2025-2028. There is also the Ilyushin Il-96-400 that is scheduled for 2019. So how successful do you think they will be? Will their planes be bought all around the world or only their domestic airlines will end up buying them?
No, they don't. Numerous other manufacturers make airliners. Embraer and Bombardier, for example.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlaskaErik
If it ain't Boeing, I ain't going.
Gee, thanks. That fourth-grade bit of nonsense hasn't been posted a thousand times already. Oh, wait...
Airbus exists for one reason and one reason only: to be a thorn in Boeings side.
They would NEVER have been able to stand on their own two feet were they not propped up through massive subsidies; where national pride and ego are the primary driving factors behind their existence (ironically Boeing used the same sense of nationalism to market the 787).
The Airbus A380 represents the pinnacle of this. That was a plane that has/had no viable market. Both Boeing and McDonnell-Douglas before them had studied similar concepts and both got shelved because they correctly concluded that the market was too small to justify the massive investments. Even Airbus came to the same conclusion but built it anyway because they simply "had" to have the title of "biggest plane" no matter what the cost; a classic Pyrrhic Victory if there ever was one. It's only because of one airline-Emirates-that that plane is even still alive. And now with them on shaky ground, Airbus has painted itself into quite a difficult corner.
And meanwhile Boeing willingly abandoned the 100-150 seat market completely, basically handing it over to the likes of Bombardier and EMBRAER. No wonder everyone else is chomping at the bit to get a piece of that pie.
Well they can certainly build it - but don't know if the demand is there.
Also there is inertia on the part of airlines towards staying with existing airframes or variants for reasons of crew training, technical support and spares. So they'd have to really have a big selling point above and beyond national pride - if they're going to pressure Russian and Chinese carriers already flying Boeing and Airbus metal.
Well they can certainly build it - but don't know if the demand is there.
Also there is inertia on the part of airlines towards staying with existing airframes or variants for reasons of crew training, technical support and spares. So they'd have to really have a big selling point above and beyond national pride - if they're going to pressure Russian and Chinese carriers already flying Boeing and Airbus metal.
Keep in mind that the Chinese COMAC plane is essentially a clone of the MD-80, a plane that was quite popular and successful until Boeing killed it in order to protect their 737 line.
Don't underestimate the power and allure of national bragging rights. Keep in mind it's only-ONLY in the United States where nationalism, protectionism, image, and pride seems to be looked down on. It's VERY much alive everywhere else in the world. Again, look at the 787. That was an entirely new airframe that was not a derivative of anything else. And Boeing exploited that to the max: "If you buy these Dreamliners, you can fly them around the world with the pride of knowing that X percent parts and labor content came from your little fiefdom".
And it was a hit. Airlines from all six inhabited continents swallowed that line and lapped it up. And ordered in droves.
On a plane that was otherwise and untested and unproven technology.
Of course that led to a major production disaster since Boeing outsourced so much that they were little more than a project manager that otherwise had little involvement. Why do you think they churn out as many as they do? They basically arrive at the various plants essentially as kits where all Boeing does is put them together.....like a 1:1 Revell.
Airbus exists for one reason and one reason only: to be a thorn in Boeings side.
They would NEVER have been able to stand on their own two feet were they not propped up through massive subsidies; where national pride and ego are the primary driving factors behind their existence (ironically Boeing used the same sense of nationalism to market the 787).
Well, it is never good to have a monopoly, so the European decision to found Airbus was a good one. Without any competition, Boeing would never have been able to develop its current products.
However, both companies are/have received state aid in a similar amount. It is just that the American ones are usually called "USAF new tanker programm" or something like that.
The problems for both, the Chinese and Russians, is the supply chain. Customers of Russian airplanes have always had problems with spare parts and reliability. Chinese are still buying old Russian style (copied) engines for their airplanes.
The IL96-400 is actually existing already, as a cargo plane has been flying around for many years and now converted to passenger. Aeroflot just phased out all IL-96-300 as they are not economically feasible and use outdated technology, are not reliable and burn too much fuel. I have flown on them and loved them for being smooth and (except horrible seats at Cubana) comfortable. However, they are not a threat to Airbus or Boeing - maybe Putin orders one or two for his executive fleet, maybe he forces some Russian airlines to buy 3 or 4 more, but the programme will not be very successful.
I do not think that I will ever be willing to fly in any Chinese airplane. I just do not have trust, based on experience. If they think they can make money, they will build bridges out of styrofoam. https://www.muripo.com/2012/05/30/ma...rofoam-inside/
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