Is Baltimore an Internationally influential city or an Nationally influential city?

[Woodlands]

Originally Posted by bufflove

Yeah, I was mostly talking about sunbelt cities that have rocketed into the top 10 most populous because their city boundaries are constantly expanded and include several rings of what would traditionally be considered suburbs. Baltimore's population size, tax base, and stature/influence would be very different today if its boundaries were similarly expanded over the last 100 years.

I wonder if it is safe to say that the city would have in upwards of 1 million people if the older suburbs and "urbanized" areas of the surrounding Counties were in the City Limits? Such as Arbutus, Halethorpe, Landsdowne, Catonsville, Woodlawn, Pikesville, Towson, Parkville, Carney, Essex, Rosedale, Dundalk, Brooklyn Park?

[Joakim3]

Originally Posted by Woodlands

I wonder if it is safe to say that the city would have in upwards of 1 million people if the older suburbs and "urbanized" areas of the surrounding Counties were in the City Limits? Such as Arbutus, Halethorpe, Landsdowne, Catonsville, Woodlawn, Pikesville, Towson, Parkville, Carney, Essex, Rosedale, Dundalk, Brooklyn Park?

Yes, theres roughly ~1 million people living inside the 695 beltway, and another ~200k that commute into that area during the normal workday.

[Tom Lennox 70]

Neither. I've read before that its actually the largest city in the US without a Fortune 500 company headquartered in the downtown area though some are in the suburbs. Its stature has only decreased with deindustrialization and the closure of Sparrows Point steel and many other factories in the surroudning area. Baltimore was more important nationally when its industries were in full swing, like when Bethlehem Steel was the largest steel plant in America.

Now when most people mention Baltimore its only in terms of violent crime. The port is the 20th in the nation in terms of gross tonnage shipped, ranking below cities like Mobile, Corpus Christi, Lake Charles, and Baton Rouge. And I wouldn't say its in Washington DC's shadow the way Oakland is in San Francisco's shadow. The cultural influence isn't that strong either, I would say many smaller cities like New Orleans, Nashville, Memphis, Orlando, and Las Vegas have a stronger national influence culturally. Johns Hopkins is one of many important research centers in the country.

[Tom Lennox 70]

Originally Posted by bufflove

Yeah, I was mostly talking about sunbelt cities that have rocketed into the top 10 most populous because their city boundaries are constantly expanded and include several rings of what would traditionally be considered suburbs. Baltimore's population size, tax base, and stature/influence would be very different today if its boundaries were similarly expanded over the last 100 years.

Annexation is also more palatable in some areas like Jacksonville, Phoenix, Dallas, Atlanta that don't have a city core that's a run down war zone and a black hole for tax money, and even so, in many other cities some wealthier areas are actually trying to leave the city and incorporate as independent communities. There is a secession movement in Buckhead in Atlanta and St. George in Baton Rouge where people are tired of having their taxes redistributed to other parts of the city while having no political voice. I highly doubt residents of Catonsville, Dundalk, and Towson would want to be part of Baltimore City.

[Joakim3]

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

Neither. I've read before that it's actually the largest city in the US without a Fortune 500 company headquartered in the downtown area though some are in the suburbs. Its stature has only decreased with deindustrialization and the closure of Sparrows Point steel and many other factories in the surroudning area. Baltimore was more important nationally when its industries were in full swing, like when Bethlehem Steel was the largest steel plant in America.

Baltimore has 2 fortune 500 companies HQ'd in the city. T. Rowe Price and Constellation

F500 HQ's don't make or break cities unless you think St. Louis is more prevalent than Seattle or Atlanta

Originally Posted by Tom Lennox 70

Now when most people mention Baltimore its only in terms of violent crime. The port is the 20th in the nation in terms of gross tonnage shipped, ranking below cities like Mobile, Corpus Christi, Lake Charles, and Baton Rouge. And I wouldn't say it's in Washington DC's shadow the way Oakland is in San Francisco's shadow. The cultural influence isn't that strong either, I would say many smaller cities like New Orleans, Nashville, Memphis, Orlando, and Las Vegas have a stronger national influence culturally. Johns Hopkins is one of many important research centers in the country.

Those ports have gross such large gross tonnage because they import/export oil from the gulf in ULCC ships. Baltimore is 9th by total value passing through the port which is more indicative of prominence/influence.

On a side note... if Baltimore wasn't a nationally important city, there would be this much media attention on the port being shut down

[bus man]

Originally Posted by Woodlands

I wonder if it is safe to say that the city would have in upwards of 1 million people if the older suburbs and "urbanized" areas of the surrounding Counties were in the City Limits? Such as Arbutus, Halethorpe, Landsdowne, Catonsville, Woodlawn, Pikesville, Towson, Parkville, Carney, Essex, Rosedale, Dundalk, Brooklyn Park?

No, the city would not have 1 million population if everything inside I-695 were annexed. Reason being, many thousands of residents of those places would pack up and move outside of the Beltway rather than be part of a dysfunctional city with horrible schools, out of control crime, crumbling infrastructure, and sky-high property taxes.

[Joakim3]

Originally Posted by bus man

No, the city would not have 1 million population if everything inside I-695 were annexed. Reason being, many thousands of residents of those places would pack up and move outside of the Beltway rather than be part of a dysfunctional city with horrible schools, out of control crime, crumbling infrastructure, and sky-high property taxes.

That’s not how that works. The property rate would go down overnight because the city would have 40% larger tax base if everything in the beltway was incorporated.

The taxes in the city are so high because Baltimore county is a net negative and doesn’t put in as much as it uses and leaves the economic bag to the city proper despite have ~400k more people.

A classic “us vs. them” that has caused way more harm than good to both parties.

[John13]

Originally Posted by bus man

No, the city would not have 1 million population if everything inside I-695 were annexed. Reason being, many thousands of residents of those places would pack up and move outside of the Beltway rather than be part of a dysfunctional city with horrible schools, out of control crime, crumbling infrastructure, and sky-high property taxes.

In recent years, maybe a couple of decades or so, I wondered why the parents hardly get any blame at all in regards to their children's learning experience. Just like I have read / seen time and time again it's always the teachers fault. They are not the ones supposed to raise the children. I feel sorry for the so many unwanted children that had no say at all in being born.

My neighbor is a Baltimore City school teacher. A few months ago I noticed her fairly new car was all keyed up. She seems upstanding and smart, I hear her going to work every single day and always on time. Such disrespect, and criminal. If possibly found which isn't going to happen, the parents should get charged too.

A large part of that and other unruliness is caused by parents who either don't care at all or most of the time don't want to be bothered. There is so much damn anger out there and it would really help if the parent or parents would take more responsibility and give their children proper tools so they can succeed.

Out of control crime is mostly in certain neighborhoods. I may be moving soon as I want an upgrade and more bang for my buck. I'm leaning strongly to staying in Baltimore where there are plenty of good neighborhoods to choose from. I'm mostly looking at Mt. Vernon. For a single person anyway rents and what one can get in the city is way better than anywhere else in the entire Baltimore - DC region. Despite getting mugged once in DC, I am not afraid of being a victim of crime here. But like if I was in any other big city, or anywhere else for that matter in this country, I will be vigilant.