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Old 12-08-2014, 11:44 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
189 posts, read 260,776 times
Reputation: 218

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Quote:
Originally Posted by OpenD View Post
No, because the popular vote is irrelevant. How can you miss that central point in all this after all the times and ways I've repeated it? The Judge in the case I cited in my OP did not strike down the Hawai'i County statute because it was unpopular, but because it isn't allowed under the prevailing legal
This is how little by little our freedoms are taken away...under the pretext that masses do not know what they want and the smart elite is there to giude them and decide for them. Laws are in place and not to be questioned.
This is the problem D, you start making your point with the premise that the info you have is correct. What if it is not? We rely too much on info coming through the media which is in most cases given a spin to begin with. In your place, i would not be so sure i have the facts right.
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Old 12-09-2014, 05:47 AM
 
Location: mainland but born oahu
6,657 posts, read 7,756,825 times
Reputation: 3137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark.ca View Post
This is how little by little our freedoms are taken away...under the pretext that masses do not know what they want and the smart elite is there to giude them and decide for them. Laws are in place and not to be questioned.
This is the problem D, you start making your point with the premise that the info you have is correct. What if it is not? We rely too much on info coming through the media which is in most cases given a spin to begin with. In your place, i would not be so sure i have the facts right.
Yes the ability to be free thinkers has kinda been lost in our country. I believe thats why our country is so polarized to one extreme to another with no middle ground anymore. JMHO.
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Old 12-22-2014, 10:18 PM
 
Location: somewhere in the Kona coffee fields
834 posts, read 1,218,079 times
Reputation: 1647
Just for the record here are a few polls showing that Americans want GMO info written on the package:

The New York Times, 07/27/13
A recent New York Times poll found that 93% of Americans favor labeling of GMO food: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/28/sc...oods.html?_r=0

MSNBC, 2/25/11
Do you believe genetically modified foods should be labeled?
Yes – 96% of over 45,000 voters believe genetically modified foods should be labeled
Poll: Skepticism of Genetically Modified Foods - ABC News

Reuters / NPR, 10/2010
Poll conducted by Thompson Reuters and National Public Radio finds 93% of
Americans believe all GMO foods should be labeled as such; only 35% willing to
eat GMO fish

Washington Post, 9/17/10
Should genetically-modified food be labeled?
Yes – 95%
Post User Polls: Should genetically-modified food be labeled? - Abha Bhattarai

KSTP – St. Paul/Minneapolis, 9/21/10
Should Genetically Modified Salmon Carry a Different Label?
Yes, Should be labeled as genetically modified fish – 95%
Sorry - The Page You are Looking for Doesn't Exist | KSTP TV - Minneapolis and St. Paul

Consumer Reports, 11/11/08
2008 Food Labeling Poll found that 95 percent of respondents said they thought
food from genetically engineered animals should be labeled, and 78 percent
strongly agreed with this.
http://www.greenerchoices.org/pdf/foodpoll2008.pdf

ABC News, 6/19/01
An ABC News poll found that 93% of the American public wants the federal government to require mandatory labeling of genetically engineered foods.
Poll: Skepticism of Genetically Modified Foods - ABC News

* 90% of Americans said foods created through genetic engineering processes should have special labels on them (Rutgers University’ Food Policy Institute study, November 2001)

* 90% of American farmers support labels on biotech products if they are scientifically different from conventional foods and 61% support labels on
biotech products even if not scientifically different. (Farm Foundation/Kansas State University, survey of farms throughout the U.S., September 2001).

* 75% of Americans say it is important to them to know whether a food product contains genetically modified ingredients. (Pew Initiative on Food and Biotechnology poll, March 2001).

* 86% of Americans think that the government should require the labeling of all packaged and other food products stating that they include corn, soy or other products which have come from genetically modified crops (Harris Poll, June 2000).

* 79% of Americans said it should not be legal to sell genetically modified fruits and vegetables without special labels (USA Today, February 2000).

* 86% of Americans want labels on genetically engineered foods (International Communications Research, March 2000)

* 81% of Americans think the government should require genetically engineered food products to be labeled. 89% of Americans think the government should require pre-market safety testing of genetically engineered foods before they are marketed, as with any food additive. (MSNBC Live Vote Results, January 2000).

* 92% of Americans support legal requirements that all genetically engineered foods be labeled. (BSMG Worldwide for the Grocery Manufacturers of America, September 1999).

* Almost 70% of Americans think the U.S. government should require more extensive labeling of ingredients in genetically engineered food. (Edelman Public Relations Worldwide in Bloomberg News, September 1999).

* 81% of American consumers believe GMO food should be labeled. 58% say that if GE foods were labeled they would avoid purchasing them. (Time magazine, January 1999).

* 93% of women surveyed say they want all GMO food clearly labeled. (National Federation of Women’s Institutes, 1998).

* 93% of Americans who responded to a Novartis survey agree that GMO foods should be labeled as such. 73% of those agree strongly with the position. (Novartis, February 1997). 25% say they would be likely to avoid labeled GMO foods.

* 84% of 604 New Jersey residents polled want mandatory labeling of GMO fruits and vegetables, 60% would consider buying fresh vegetables if they were labeled as having been produced by genetic engineering and 76% favor farmers voluntarily putting labels on their produce that say the items were not genetically engineered. (USDA, July 1995).

* 92% of 36,000 polled say they want GMO food labeled, with a 94% pro-labeling response from women and a 84% pro-labeling response from men. (Vance Publishing, in Food R&D, February 1995).

* 85% of those polled think that labeling of GMO food is “very important” (USDA, 1992).

* In an FDA sponsored survey in 1992, 8 state attorneys general asked the FDA to require mandatory labeling of all GMO foods.

That's a pretty impressive amount of studies all scoring in the same percentile over 20 years. And even more impressive to be able to sway politicians via lobbying to suppress this. To brush them off as being conducted unprofessional makes one look foolish. There is no single poll where the numbers would show that consumers don't care.
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Old 12-23-2014, 12:08 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
189 posts, read 260,776 times
Reputation: 218
Proposition 37 was on the vote in California in 2012 and guess what? Was rejected!!!
People say they want this then big money gets pumped into the campaign and the people forget all about it and believe whatever big money tells them. So forget about what the polls say, they said the same thing in Cali the years before the vote.
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Old 12-23-2014, 01:19 AM
 
Location: mainland but born oahu
6,657 posts, read 7,756,825 times
Reputation: 3137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark.ca View Post
Proposition 37 was on the vote in California in 2012 and guess what? Was rejected!!!
People say they want this then big money gets pumped into the campaign and the people forget all about it and believe whatever big money tells them. So forget about what the polls say, they said the same thing in Cali the years before the vote.
Another problem is people confuse capitalism as democracy and foolishly support every aspect of capitalism thinking they are being patriotic.
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Old 12-23-2014, 07:46 AM
 
8,886 posts, read 4,583,975 times
Reputation: 16242
Studies show that 87.3% of all statistics you see on the internet are made up.....

Mahalo and Merry Christmas
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Old 12-23-2014, 10:14 AM
 
Location: Volcano
12,969 posts, read 28,447,082 times
Reputation: 10760
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaraBenNemsi View Post
Just for the record here are a few polls showing that Americans want GMO info written on the package:
There are also a significant number of Americans who want racial segregation restored, and Christianity taught in public schools. But like the call for mandatory GMO labelling, all three have been ruled unconstitutional in Federal Courts.

The popularity of anything does not trump the Constitution.
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Old 12-23-2014, 10:36 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles area
189 posts, read 260,776 times
Reputation: 218
You are bringing the same constitution argument, D...the problem is the constitution keeps getting amended to fit the big corporations needs. Seriously, how hard can it be to print GMO on a label? They keep throwing sand in your eyes about the increased cost of doing so...guess what?!...the cost are going up anyway. Remind me again, how is this costing the farmers more? You know what you grow so why not tell the customer about it? I'm increasingly more and more against the rejection of labeling change just because the constant cover ups they use.
Your other exemples are just BS, are you telling us that over 70% of americans want segregation or a certain religion though in school, come on! Look at the numbers here...
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Old 12-23-2014, 11:47 AM
 
Location: Volcano
12,969 posts, read 28,447,082 times
Reputation: 10760
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark.ca View Post
You are bringing the same constitution argument, D...the problem is the constitution keeps getting amended to fit the big corporations needs.
In fact the last Amendment to the Constitution to be passed was the 26th, securing the vote for 18 year olds, in 1971

And the last to be ratified, after a long delay, was the 27th, in 1992, preventing pay raises for legislators from taking place until after an election of Representatives has taken place.

Quote:
Seriously, how hard can it be to print GMO on a label?
That doesn't matter if making it a requirement is a violation of the Constitution... as it was ruled to be in the Vermont case in 1995.

Quote:
They keep throwing sand in your eyes about the increased cost of doing so...guess what?!...the cost are going up anyway. Remind me again, how is this costing the farmers more? You know what you grow so why not tell the customer about it?
It's naive to think the cost of the label is the issue. Along with regulations for something like this comes record keeping at each change of hands, reporting, confirmation, enforcement.

And along with that comes the quite reasonable fear that sales will suffer, since the GMO "label" has become "demonized," to use the term the court used in the Vermont case... that is to say, people have been made afraid of GMOs without any sound reason... there's not really any credible evidence that GMOs are unsafe to eat, and there's an abundance of credible evidence that they are safe. So what we have here is merely a very popular superstition

Quote:
Your other exemples are just BS, are you telling us that over 70% of americans want segregation or a certain religion though in school, come on! Look at the numbers here...
Actually, I have looked, and the figures are startling. I never said they were over 70%, but anything over 0% is scary to me because it means that many people either don't understand or don't believe in the Constitution.

And as I keep saying, have been saying, and will continue saying is that our Constitutional right to Freedom of Speech is not subject to a popularity vote.
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Old 12-23-2014, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Kahala
12,120 posts, read 17,914,289 times
Reputation: 6176
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark.ca View Post
Seriously, how hard can it be to print GMO on a label? They keep throwing sand in your eyes about the increased cost of doing so...guess what?!...the cost are going up anyway. ..
Just about everything is GMO. So labeling isn't the issue. Just label everything.

But that would be silly. Seriously, if non-GMO is so important - how hard can it be to print non-GMO?

You know what - it is hard - very hard. Virtually impossible since pretty much everything is GMO nowadays. So, why bother? It just seems like a silly exercise.
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