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And you are not immune to making errors when posting here. I believe you meant "poring over."
LOL! I did so, but that's how we spell it in Scotland. Sorry, but as the day wears on I incrementally revert back to my native Celtic tongue, and at this writing I've been awake for 20 hours or so. I'll try to be more attentive. (You're right though; I'm not immune to errors - nobody is.)
Again, this is an informal setting. We don't expect perfect grammar, spelling, and usage here. But some, like me, have higher standards than others. When I see people mix up "there," "their," and "they're," I want to scream. I also can't stand "should of," "would of," and "could of."
Couldn't agree more!
But the worst, at least to me, is the misuse of the apostrophe. People always seem to insert that damned apostrophe into plurals where it doesn't belong!
Mm-hm, we need to have a remedial apostrophe thread somewhere on city-data.com, I think. For instance, when quoting someone, it is incorrect to use double quotation marks. For example: 'Jesus wept,' the shortest verse in the Bible, should be enclosed in single apostrophes and the first letter of the quote, even a partial (mid-sentence) quote, should always be capitalized.
I'll PM you about the 'mistakes' in your first post, if you like. BTW, I *do* like your writing style.
In the Johnny Carson example, we don't process what we read and what we hear in the same way. Look at a transcript of an informal interview, for instance: the text will likely contains hundreds of "um"s and "ah"s that you didn't even really "hear" when listening to the interview (well, you did, but you just didn't process them).
As far as grammar in books, we most definitely DO need the grammar police. And the spelling police. And all the other editing police. My pet peeves are shifting tenses and POV, but that is really beyond the scope of what is being called "the grammar police" in this thread. That said, if I pay for a book, I expect certain standards of writing will be met. If an author chooses to think he or she doesn't have to meet them, fine - just don't expect me to buy those books.
On internet forums I am aware that what I am reading is an immediate, off-the-cuff response which has not been edited or proofread. I'm not paying for it, either, as I am a book from a publishing house.
Mm-hm, we need to have a remedial apostrophe thread somewhere on city-data.com, I think. For instance, when quoting someone, it is incorrect to use double quotation marks. For example: 'Jesus wept,' the shortest verse in the Bible, should be enclosed in single apostrophes and the first letter of the quote, even a partial (mid-sentence) quote, should always be capitalized.
No, I wonder if the rule on quotation marks you're following is also a UK thing. Here in the US, every quotation goes into double quotes: "..."
If you have a quote-within-a-quote, you use the single quotes (on a keyboard, it's the same as an apostrophe, but in reality, not the same): "...'...'..."
So I might say:
Mother yelled, "Just wait until your father gets home! He'll say 'Go to bed without your supper.'"
There are errors, and then there are errors. If something is a regional difference, or a mattter of preference, or even if it's something that used to be considered improper but is now acceptable, that's not a big deal to me, even in formal writing. But big errors, like the ones I mentioned with there, their, and they're, and putting apostrophes in plural nouns, should never be accepted or overlooked. They should also carry mandatory prison time
When an author is purposefully breaking grammar rules (Elmore Leonard) as a matter of style, it can work brilliantly.
But when an author just doesn't pay attention (James Patterson), it annoys me enough to make me put down the book and never pick it up again.
Ahhh, but we're speaking of several writers here.
Are you speaking of the books that James Patterson writes himself? (just The Alex Cross series) Or, one of the many books where a co-writer fills in his story outlines?
I was such a fan of Patterson's the first 6-7 books of the Cross stories...then he began to mass-produce everything else and the quality fell drastically across the board.
Sort of OT, but we shouldn't blame Patterson for his many substitute's errors.
In the Johnny Carson example, we don't process what we read and what we hear in the same way. Look at a transcript of an informal interview, for instance: the text will likely contains hundreds of "um"s and "ah"s that you didn't even really "hear" when listening to the interview (well, you did, but you just didn't process them).
As far as grammar in books, we most definitely DO need the grammar police. And the spelling police. And all the other editing police. My pet peeves are shifting tenses and POV, but that is really beyond the scope of what is being called "the grammar police" in this thread. That said, if I pay for a book, I expect certain standards of writing will be met. If an author chooses to think he or she doesn't have to meet them, fine - just don't expect me to buy those books.
On internet forums I am aware that what I am reading is an immediate, off-the-cuff response which has not been edited or proofread. I'm not paying for it, either, as I am a book from a publishing house.
Afternoon PNW-type-gal!
I'm as interested in tenses as I am in any other part of grammar and composition. I'm most interested, however, in discovering what avid readers either don't know or don't notice when they're reading novels, or any other material for that matter.
Hopefully, we can have fun with this, and perhaps learn a little from each other while we're at it. My first language isn't English, but I learned UK English as a teen, Canadian English when I was eighteen, and American English when I was in my twenties.
Let's take a look at your last paragraph in what I'll assume was an 'Off-the-cuff' post.
'On internet forums I am aware that what I am reading is an immediate, off-the-cuff response which has not been edited or proofread. I'm not paying for it, either, as I am a book from a publishing house.'
What you just told me, PNW-type-gal, is that YOU ARE a book from a publishing house. Do you see why? Your paragraph *should* read,
'On Internet (we capitalize 'Internet') forums, (we need a comma after 'Forums') I am aware that what I am reading is an immediate, off-the-cuff response, (we need a comma after 'Response' because you've chosen to follow it with 'Which') which has not been edited or proofread. I'm not paying for it either, (you don't need a comma before the 'Either' and the sentence would be better if you dropped the word altogether) as Iwould (you need to insert 'would' here) a book from a publishing house.'
NOW you're *not* a book from a publishing house.
I won't correct the rest of your post, as I only wanted to make a point. If we use the same argument that has been put forth by others here, expecting technical excellence from authors because correct writing will improve our own performance, perhaps we ought to edit and proofread our posts. If we're reading good literature, shouldn't our 'Off-the-cuff' responses be better?
We spend money to buy a book, and because we do we expect it to be flawless, yet here on the Internet we're spending time reading what each poster writes, and time is infinitely more valuable than money. One can always make more money. One cannot make more time.
Not if you're not! I hoped that we could have some fun with this and learn from each other in the process, but if not then there's no point in pursuing it, is there? My primary interest isn't in either teaching or learning remedial grammar, but rather in learning how people read, what bothers them most, and what they miss - for whatever reason.
Feel free to dissect and correct my posts anytime and anywhere on CD.com. I'd be grateful for the help and perhaps be a better writer for it.
I just wrote you a lengthy post that disappeared into cyberspace when I hit 'enter,' and I'm too tired to rewrite it now. I've been up for 27 hours, so I'd rather wait until I'm coherent, if that's all right with you.
You're not really 'Crankier than average,' are you?
Didn't think so!
Have a sweet and peaceful night, PNW, and may God bless you.
Love,
Mahrie.
P.S. I live high in the BC Coastal Mountains so we're practically neighbors!
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