Denver to Boulder/Louisville Light rail (calculated, vs., discount)

[brown_dog_us]

We are moving to the area this summer, and I am trying to decide if we can make S. Boulder work with my wife commuting to the LoDo. The BRT might be a way to make it work, but I'm confused on how BRT differs from an express bus. Anyone know?

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by brown_dog_us

We are moving to the area this summer, and I am trying to decide if we can make S. Boulder work with my wife commuting to the LoDo. The BRT might be a way to make it work, but I'm confused on how BRT differs from an express bus. Anyone know?

I think it's just a fancier name for "express bus".

[brown_dog_us]

lol. Thanks. That is what it sounds like to me.

I'm going to have her ride the express bus one morning and see if it'll work.

[livecontent]

The rail to Boulder/Longmont is not proposed to be light rail, it is heavy rail, specifically EMU (Electric Multiple Unit). The difference is that the rail cars are much heavier and larger. The system is designed for longer distance for commuter rail and for stations farther apart so as to accommodate higher speeds. Heavy Rail is now required when we are placing commuter rail along a freight line because of the ability of it to withstand a collision with a freight car. If the safety issues were in place in the past, it would never have been allowed to built the light rail along the Southwest Line which parallel a freight line. Light Rail is preferable for close in stations and lower speeds as we have in the downtown core.

The Gold Line, and the East Line and part of the Northwest Line to Westminster at 72nd. is being constructed as heavy rail. The North Line going through Adams county is planned as heavy rail.

The under construction I-225 rail line is being built as light rail because it extends the line from Parker Road at Nine-Mile Station.

I prefer the heavy rail configuration because the loading the cars is at the station level without steps and the need for the ramp for disabled. It is also has more comfortable seating for longer travel.

No, BRT is not a fancier name for an express bus. A BRT (Bus Rapid Transit Bus) has separate dedicated lines, either side loaded along a road or medium loaded with boarding ramps. This allow quick loading and unloading and faster travel along the dedicated roadway. An express bus is a bus that has less and limited stops to allow faster travel. There can also be express BRT buses but they would operate along the dedicated roadway with ramp loading.

The BRT that is being constructed along I-36 is planned to operated over a dedicated roadway and HOV lane. Part of the project has been completed under Phase 1.

US 36 Express Lanes/Bus Rapid Transit Project — CDOT

Livecontent

[Katarina Witt]

Thanks for the above information.

[Eddyline]

Another feature that is common to some BRT systems is that you pay or scan your card BEFORE you enter the loading area. The bus driver does not check passes/cards or take money which results in faster loading. I don't believe this is part of the RTD initial BRT plans, but could be added later.

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by Eddyline

Another feature that is common to some BRT systems is that you pay or scan your card BEFORE you enter the loading area. The bus driver does not check passes/cards or take money which results in faster loading. I don't believe this is part of the RTD initial BRT plans, but could be added later.

RTD has just this month instituted the first phase of a smart card system for limited use. That will be expanded for more fares in the future. You will see now, on the buses, these smart card readers.

RTD

You may not realize it but, when an express buses leaves downtown, fares are not collected on boarding, so as to allow faster boarding but are collected and passes checked on departure.

Livecontent

[OhioToCO]

Originally Posted by brown_dog_us

We are moving to the area this summer, and I am trying to decide if we can make S. Boulder work with my wife commuting to the LoDo. The BRT might be a way to make it work, but I'm confused on how BRT differs from an express bus. Anyone know?

BRT will not speed up current bus commute all that much - I can't find the exact timing now, but I remember reading in the Fast Tracks documents somewhere, that commute from Louisville PnR to Downtown will be 3 minutes faster than it is today for express bus.

To brown_dog_us - I commute from Gunbarrel to Uptown three days a week, and here is my break down with current bus system:
20 minutes to drive to Louisville PnR, about 25-30 minutes on a bus (in good weather, no accidents), about 10 minute walk from Broadway to my office = about 1 hr door to door.
From S. Boulder - depending on where exactly - 5-10 to Table Mesa PnR, about 25 minutes on Express (BX or BMX) to LoDo, and then a short walk, hopefully, from Market Street Station. The reason Table Mesa to LoDo is shorter than my ride, even though Table Mesa is farther west, is because I take another bus, the one that goes to Civic Center, and it makes one extra stop on US36 - at Flatirons Shopping Center - and then travels through Downtown, which is at least another 5-10 minutes.
So, for your wife's commute 30-35 minutes normally, but can be as long as an hour or more in bad weather. RTD and US36 in general is very slow when it snows, so account for that, if your wife has to be at a certain time every day of the week. I wouldn't count on BRT speeding it up by more than 5 minutes. Go to RTD to research B-bus schedules.
It works well for me, even though I have an hour commute. It's not bad three times a week, I can work from home if the weather really bad and I suspect I will spend 30 minutes waiting for a bus and then another hour on a bus. Most of all - I love this time to myself and would never drive to Downtown, unless I really have to for some reason.

[livecontent]

Originally Posted by OhioToCO

BRT will not speed up current bus commute all that much - I can't find the exact timing now, but I remember reading in the Fast Tracks documents somewhere, that commute from Louisville PnR to Downtown will be 3 minutes faster than it is today for express bus.

To brown_dog_us - I commute from Gunbarrel to Uptown three days a week, and here is my break down with current bus system:
20 minutes to drive to Louisville PnR, about 25-30 minutes on a bus (in good weather, no accidents), about 10 minute walk from Broadway to my office = about 1 hr door to door.
From S. Boulder - depending on where exactly - 5-10 to Table Mesa PnR, about 25 minutes on Express (BX or BMX) to LoDo, and then a short walk, hopefully, from Market Street Station. The reason Table Mesa to LoDo is shorter than my ride, even though Table Mesa is farther west, is because I take another bus, the one that goes to Civic Center, and it makes one extra stop on US36 - at Flatirons Shopping Center - and then travels through Downtown, which is at least another 5-10 minutes.
So, for your wife's commute 30-35 minutes normally, but can be as long as an hour or more in bad weather. RTD and US36 in general is very slow when it snows, so account for that, if your wife has to be at a certain time every day of the week. I wouldn't count on BRT speeding it up by more than 5 minutes. Go to RTD to research B-bus schedules.
It works well for me, even though I have an hour commute. It's not bad three times a week, I can work from home if the weather really bad and I suspect I will spend 30 minutes waiting for a bus and then another hour on a bus. Most of all - I love this time to myself and would never drive to Downtown, unless I really have to for some reason.

I commend you for the use of public transit and your experience and suggestion of travel are valued. However, Your statements about projected travel times and reductions of travel times are not correct.

This analysis has been done in the EIS (Environmental Inpact Statement). You really need to read this very large and complicated document to understand what really is going to be put into place in the preferred alternative. All alternatives are taken in consideration included not doing anything. Unfortunately these documents are expansive and to find the specific information is very difficult. I have a link to the specific chapter, at the end of this post, which gives this analysis.

One of the issues that managed lanes will be added and expanded which will reduce travel times in these managed lanes. In addition the increased use of managed lanes will significantly reduce travel on the general purpose Lanes with reduced traffic so as to reduce the travel times in these general purpose lanes. This is also based on the projected increased occupancy factor per vehicle occupancy.

In looking at the analysis, it will reduce travel in the General Purpose Lanes of 8 minutes comparing trips in these same lanes today to future projection. In the managed lanes the reductions will also be 8 minutes from the current situation to future projection. What is most significant is that travel in the managed lane travel will be 20 minutes less than travel in the General Purpose Lanes. Meaning that commuters will save much more time in travel if they use the managed lanes vs. the all purpose lanes.

Also: "...Congestion and crashes on highways can affect travel time, and therefore, make trips unpredictable. Managed lanes provide greater consistency in travel time and reliability to the users and therefore reduce the need for managed lane users to allow extra time to accommodate unpredictable, congested conditions..." What this means there is less predictable chance of accidents in managed lanes so that the reliability of travel is more ascertain.

Keep in mind as demand increases in the future, the savings in travel time will be more to a point, whereby no more savings can be achieved unless we see much less individual private auto travel. There is only so much improvements with more lanes and more technology along the corridor that can be added.

Another issue that also must be mentioned is that the project involves significant interchange improvements which will allow reduce travel times in accessing I-36 from connecting routes which will add to the time savings in travel on I-36.

All this is detailed in Vol. 1 Chapter 3 of the EIS:

Chapter 3 — CDOT

Livecontent

[brown_dog_us]

Originally Posted by OhioToCO

....Most of all - I love this time to myself and would never drive to Downtown, unless I really have to for some reason.

This is what my wife thinks too!

Thanks for the break down of the commute times. It really helps.