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Link to chthankgod's school district link about what the state has to pump in, how many kids, real estate value and poverty. It's on the NY state list. I think it should be in all areas, so I put up the link.
If you want to know what you are really paying for, or how much you suck out of the state coffers, look here. See if you are one of the districts paying its way or sucking the taxes dry.
genoobie, look at this on the NY state site where it is originally posted.
Then, look at what you get for $/child, what the district gets for "leanness" of money they spend, what they get and actual "need"..... and also how much the rest of us pay so places like Buffalo can get excessive amounts per kid. Look at the poverty levels and relationship to what a district gets. Look at the median housing value.If you compare the poverty rates to the money the state pumps into a system, the more poverty, the more money. Who pays the NY taxes that go to those high "need? districts? The rest of us; we pay our taxes and some goes to Albany from other taxes. [The fallacy of Lotto funding education and returning money to districts has been well documented.]
You get cheap taxes in the City because of the high poverty and low value of the real estate. You are not kidding anyone. You are taking from the rest of the state.
My district of 6,037 students gets $4,970/child. [16% get free or reduced lunches.] Need vs. resource is 0.37
Yours is 39,252 students getting $16,377/child [83% free/reduced lunches.] Need vs. resource is 4.85
How on earth are your school taxes lower than mine? How can you tout it so much as a benefit of the city? What are they anyway? If they are so low, it is because the taxes of the rest of the state are pumped in because the city keeps money given to schools artificially low; you have a different tax system. That started with Mayor Griffin (late 1970s) never upping the taxes to the limit allowed and it made city people very happy. I know; I taught there and our monies for education were rotten then.
Last edited by BuffaloTransplant; 01-27-2013 at 07:51 PM..
^This is no different from the national example of who puts in more and who gets more in terms of funding. I think a difference may be that there should be vested interest in the center cities, as it is tough for an area to move forward with a center city with no investment. With that said, in regards to schools, it may or should be adjusted in that regard in order to get better "results".
See BuffaloTransplant, that points to a larger problem of how districts are funded and poverty in America in general. Your points reek of hypocrisy. You moved to an exclusive area because you claim the schools were better. Now you are complaining that the taxes are too high in your exclusive area. Well, if you lower your taxes then your area will become less exclusive and your schools will suffer. Can't have it both ways. Incidentally, you made money for 30 years out of a "high needs" district. So your hypocrisy goes even deeper because you are referring to the "rest of us" as if you were some sort of outside tax paying entity. Your argument is riddled with contradictions. Incidentally, on that same map, in the southern tier, the area is riddled with large funding amounts per student, but the Free/Reduced lunch categories are much lower. Just an observation.
Finally, when people making minimum wage shell out 1/3 to 1/2 of their income for rent, who exactly is being taken from then?
genoobie, look at this on the NY state site where it is originally posted.
Then, look at what you get for $/child, what the district gets for "leanness" of money they spend, what they get and actual "need"..... and also how much the rest of us pay so places like Buffalo can get excessive amounts per kid. Look at the poverty levels and relationship to what a district gets. Look at the median housing value.If you compare the poverty rates to the money the state pumps into a system, the more poverty, the more money. Who pays the NY taxes that go to those high "need? districts? The rest of us; we pay our taxes and some goes to Albany from other taxes. [The fallacy of Lotto funding education and returning money to districts has been well documented.]
You get cheap taxes in the City because of the high poverty and low value of the real estate. You are not kidding anyone. You are taking from the rest of the state.
My district of 6,037 students gets $4,970/child. [16% get free or reduced lunches.] Need vs. resource is 0.37
Yours is 39,252 students getting $16,377/child [83% free/reduced lunches.] Need vs. resource is 4.85
How on earth are your school taxes lower than mine? How can you tout it so much as a benefit of the city? What are they anyway? If they are so low, it is because the taxes of the rest of the state are pumped in because the city keeps money given to schools artificially low; you have a different tax system. That started with Mayor Griffin (late 1970s) never upping the taxes to the limit allowed and it made city people very happy. I know; I taught there and our monies for education were rotten then.
You do realize, it's a state law that says Buffalo, Rochester, Albany, and NYC can not collect school taxes, and their schools are funded from the state education fund, right?
See BuffaloTransplant, that points to a larger problem of how districts are funded and poverty in America in general. Your points reek of hypocrisy. You moved to an exclusive area because you claim the schools were better. Now you are complaining that the taxes are too high in your exclusive area. Well, if you lower your taxes then your area will become less exclusive and your schools will suffer. Can't have it both ways. Incidentally, you made money for 30 years out of a "high needs" district. So your hypocrisy goes even deeper because you are referring to the "rest of us" as if you were some sort of outside tax paying entity. Your argument is riddled with contradictions. Incidentally, on that same map, in the southern tier, the area is riddled with large funding amounts per student, but the Free/Reduced lunch categories are much lower. Just an observation.
^^^ Exactly.
People move to a more expensive area, and then complain because the area is too expensive. It's akin to someone buying a house near the airport, then complaining to the NFTA that they need to do something about the airport noise.
BuffaloTransplant, if you are so offended by some small amount of your taxes going to pay for the education of WNY's poorest children who happen to live in Buffalo for various reasons, you are welcome to host some of the extreme poverty of WNY. That way the disparity won't seem so dramatic to you.
IT Guy:
The "Big 5" (NYC, Buffalo, Syracuse, Rochester and Albany -- 6, if you count Yonkers, which was counted for a while) do not actually tax separately for schools. However, their mayors can use part of the general tax for schools.. As to what Buffalo did about this possible source of funding? In the mid 1970s, then Mayor Griffin had incoming general taxes and wanted to make people like him more... so he slid the portion which could have been used for schools to pad his city accounts. [There was a cap as to how much you could raise, so since then, the City Schools have suffered.] Look it up. It happens in all cities: BTW, if you didn't read it, Bloomberg is going berserk as he didn't negotiate an evaluation plan and the NYC schools will get $0. Maybe ( *if cuomo holds to what he says), other districts will get great funding.
Genoobie:
I am far from living anywhere "exclusive". We have a little house we bought in the 1970s in the $20K range. The "exclusive" homes out here are the people leaving the city and building in the past decade... and I would bet many pay every penny they have for the mortgage. [We pay zip - paid it off long ago.] I don't call it "exclusive" when our house is about 900 sq. feet, backed up to a hay field . To me, "exclusive is a McMansion ( or perhaps a very large city house that is all redone (yours, perhaps?)) FWIW, I think my taxes are quite decent; never said they were too much. I asked how much yours were. I said the city gets too much state money because it has so little coming in -- and that money you get comes from every other NY taxpayer, hence, your taxes are as low, as you proclaim. If you look at the Southern Tier, a lot of that money goes to transportation. If you read the paper this week, you'd see lots of districts, for some idiotic reason, got a hike in monies -- but it was mostly taken back when BOCES money got cut. Give with one hand, take with the other.; That is State Ed. :: Clueless.
Also, as to having made money off the city? I made less in salary than any burb around here and much less than downstate. You make great money now. When my hubby started he got $5K; I came in at just over $6.5K. We made less in salary when we retired than lots of downstate teachers make in pensions! The contract you work under is built on the ones we fought for, and I bet you will never walk 2 weeks on a picket line and lose a month salary to defend it. [The only "benefit" of working in the city was by working in poverty schools you got federal student loans written off over 10 years. Given SUNY schools tuition was $400 when I was an undergrad, I had a tiny amount of loans -- about $500 -- and my husband had none.] Your defenses reek of hypocrisy: your only goal in promoting the city is to make sure your job is secure. Bashing all other areas for living and districts for schools is not what I would call ethical. [And if you really have such a good heart, charge you tenants less.]
JSmith:
Feel free to host anyone you want. I am free to live where I want and to do so in a district that spends responsibly.
My point is that the City does not nor has it for many, many years.
Last edited by BuffaloTransplant; 01-28-2013 at 03:04 PM..
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