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Sure that might be true. Maybe the "Texas Model" doesn't translate to CA or other states..but at the end of the day Texas itself has proven to be attractive to businesses because of the lower costs of operating , more business friendly environment, educated workforce,etc
And for people , they are seeing a place that is affordable , low unemployment rates, etc .
I was born in CA , but I'm not blind to this reality.
You are just making stuff up now. I didn't say that. I said that certain types of businesses where minimum wage workers work will likely decline or the retail spaces will be turned into different types of businesses that won't hire minimum wage workers, like lawyers offices, startups, etc...or another option is housing.
You don't live in L.A...so you probably don't have an idea of what is going on.
Things change, why are you bringing up the "statistics of 30 years" lol.
In the investment world they say
Past performance is not indicative of future results.
We see it all the time in the economy, a company could be doing great for many years even 30 years or longer and then it's out of business.
Like I said before too Jamba Juice is just one example, for every Jamba juice there are many many more that the media doesn't mention because they aren't household names.
This article mentions how 9,000 businesses have moved out of California just in the past 7 years! http://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/bl...xpansions.html
I know you don't think that article is credible....but I think everyone here would trust that business journal over what you say.
I'm not making anything up jm. You are in denial.
And you keep bringing up that I don't live in LA. What does that have to do with Jamba Juice? Jamba Juice is in Emeryville up in the BAY. You don't live up there. Them leaving doesn't impact LA.
"Past performance is not indicative of future results" is a contradictory platitude. Like "birds of a feather flock together"/"opposites attract" ... which is true jm? Both platitudes are used to impart wisdom under differing circumstances. Past performance is very much a key factor in what bankers lend money on and investors buy into.
And now you jump right back into the Jamba Juice is "but one example" of many that will spell disaster. And you again refer back to a "study" made by a business consultant who specializes in moving businesses out of state, to market himself - in which the nature and sizes of the businesses aren't identified - and which claims that facilities expansions in other states is equivalent to businesses moving out of state, which is ridiculous. But you refuse to acknowledge a study of more than four times the data frame, made by independent research firms and public policy institutes that completely eviserates every claim Vranich's "study" makes and what you are claiming to be true.
As I pointed out earlier, 9,000 businesses DID NOT move out of California in the past 7 years. That number includes expansions made elsewhere. And even if 9,000 had moved it would represent only .0004% of California businesses - again with no mention of the AMOUNT of business and employment they represent - and, most significantly, doesn't mention the offsetting reality of how many new businesses started in the same period.
Once again, you are throwing out total bunk. Can't even accurately quote a ridiculous "study" when you say it proves that 9,000 businesses left - it says "left or expanded" elsewhere.
You're the ludicrous one ..but you're not hilarious..unfortunately..
Those are considerable businesses that moved, probably not 9,000 tiny taco stands or burger joints ..
Also
"he found evidence of at least $62 billion in capital that was diverted to other locations. Additionally, the loss of so many business owners and their employees has had a negative impact on California charities. Companies that have left California brought with them the people who donated to California philanthropies, organized new charitable organizations, and volunteered their time.
Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/426974/businesses-leave-california-texas"
Yes there are millions of businesses in CA but many people register a business and then don't even do anything with it, or they are sole proprietors,etc.
I guess $62 BILLION is chump change to you..you must really be wealthy then.
Well, it might be, although everything in life is relative. So let's take that statement apart shall we and examine it. ... Oh wait, there's no data or sourcing for the statement! Which means, it isn't meaningful (let alone credible) until someone supplies the bases.
All we know so far is that the statement is made by a salesman, Joe Vranich, who sells his consulting services specializing in moving California businesses out of state. Nothing to be skeptical of there, right? I mean, a guy with vested income interest in moving businesses out of California wouldn't engage in speciously gathering statistical figures and assembling them to make a sophist argument. Would he?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982
Those are considerable businesses that moved, probably not 9,000 tiny taco stands or burger joints ..
Well, we don't know, do we jm?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982
Also
"he found evidence of at least $62 billion in capital that was diverted to other locations. Additionally, the loss of so many business owners and their employees has had a negative impact on California charities. Companies that have left California brought with them the people who donated to California philanthropies, organized new charitable organizations, and volunteered their time.
Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/426974/businesses-leave-california-texas"
Wow! A BIG number! With absolutely no explanation of how it is derived.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jm1982
Yes there are millions of businesses in CA but many people register a business and then don't even do anything with it, or they are sole proprietors,etc.
Correct, jm. And we have no idea what % those are of the 9,000 that left or expanded elsewhere, do we? And we have no idea how many of those 9,000 were expansions of businesses that stayed in California. For example, last year Apple committed to an expansion in Austin Texas that was projected to hire about 7,000 employees! What a loss for California! Eh?!!! Why didn't they open that division in California? Well, as it turns out, Apple also
Quote:
... bought a large parcel in North San Jose along First Street, enough land for an office and research campus where the technology titan could eventually have up to 15,000 workers, public records show.
Cupertino-based Apple paid $138.2 million in cash on July 31 for the 40-acre site near North First Street and Component Drive, according to county records. The land sale represents a healthy profit for the seller, an affiliate of Connecticut-based Five Mile Capital Partners, which paid $40 million for the property in 2010.Apple sets stage for San Jose campus with 15,000 workers - San Jose Mercury News
Meanwhile, you want to ignore:
Quote:
California cranks out new businesses and jobs despite criticism
The Golden State perennially ranks at the bottom of national surveys gauging business friendliness. ... a new study drawing on more than three decades' worth of census business-formation data tells quite a different story.
California has spawned new businesses at one of the fastest rates in the nation over the last decade, and faster than the U.S. economy overall, the report found. The state is also a leader in job creation tied to those new businesses:
In 2013, California added jobs from newly established businesses faster than all but four other states.
For each year since 1976, California's pace of new business creation has been faster than the U.S. rate, and often faster than Texas'.
Less than 1% of all businesses that disappeared in California in 2013 were due to out-of-state relocations, ... That's in line with the average for all states
Tulemutt what do you think so cal will look like 10 years from now economically and traffic wise? I know it'll be hard to use your imagination and not refer to facts and your beloved 30 years of census business information data but try. You speak out of both sides of your mouth so I'm curious if you think it will be a positive or negative to live here
From your LA Times link
"Stan Dubyn has found success in the state. He has started two companies in California's aerospace industry over the last 25 years, and he's continuing to expand. Millennium Space Systems, the company he founded in 2001, builds satellites for customers such as the U.S. military and NASA."
Yeah it's not surprising that doing business in CA works for him. He also has an advantage from starting 25 years ago so he probably bought the real estate he operates out of much cheaper,etc and might even have it paid off.
Also this is what we have been saying that CA still has a strong tech industry, but a lot of people aren't going to be qualified for those jobs.
""We have a very high-tech workforce, people with bachelor's, master's, PhD's," Dubyn said."
On the other hand CA has masses of poverty and cities like L.A have much higher unemployment rates than Texas cities.
But the tech companies are doing GREAT! So everything is ok!
Tulemutt what do you think so cal will look like 10 years from now economically and traffic wise? I know it'll be hard to use your imagination and not refer to facts and your beloved 30 years of census business information data but try. You speak out of both sides of your mouth so I'm curious if you think it will be a positive or negative to live here
Well Finper, if I thought your question was sincere, I might explore the issue with you a bit. Hard to take you serious when you say I talk out of both sides of my mouth at once. However, I'll give you an invite to explain what you mean by the remark. Give me an example of talking out of both sides of my mouth.
I will say, in any case, that positive and negative are functions of attitude to a considerable degree - although certainly influenced by outside circumstances as well. There are those few who become wise enough in life to be happy pretty much wherever they find themselves. There are many who never crack the secret. For myself? I'm quite happy now. Probably will be in 10 years as well if past is any prologue.
Well Finper, if I thought your question was sincere, I might explore the issue with you a bit. Hard to take you serious when you say I talk out of both sides of my mouth at once. However, I'll give you an invite to explain what you mean by the remark. Give me an example of talking out of both sides of my mouth.
I will say, in any case, that positive and negative are functions of attitude to a considerable degree - although certainly influenced by outside circumstances as well. There are those few who become wise enough in life to be happy pretty much wherever they find themselves. There are many who never crack the secret. For myself? I'm quite happy now. Probably will be in 10 years as well if past is any prologue.
In other words put up with the changes and adjust your way of thinking, right? Get used to the lower standard of living. Think more kumbaya and learn to let go of material desires such as a big house and other tangible assets? Learn to love the quality of life and see yourself as spiritually more fulfilled because you're next to oceans and mountains rather than a McMansion on a flat piece of land, eh?
Yes we've heard this before many times here on CD. It's the typical justification for the choice to remain in California coupled with the morally superior attitude that choosing so called "peace of mind" next to the ocean is preferable to a life in middle America.
But what can't be numerically quantified such as tangible real assets seems to dominate the preferences of those who choose to stay or move to Cali without having the necessary skill set or income to enjoy the best the state has to offer. Things like weather, cool vibe, amenities (which can be found in many American cities), beautiful terrain (that you can't own). It's one thing to prefer these things but it's another thing entirely to mock and laugh if someone chooses the latter. The latter people look at the guy struggling in the gig economy who refuses to move as somewhat daft yet the daft person thinks so what at least I'm not in xyz city, hardy har har. The illusion they they've chosen something more beautiful and spiritually fulfilling is what keeps them going, keeps them holding on until the bitter end.
From your LA Times link
"Stan Dubyn has found success in the state. He has started two companies in California's aerospace industry over the last 25 years, and he's continuing to expand. Millennium Space Systems, the company he founded in 2001, builds satellites for customers such as the U.S. military and NASA."
Yeah it's not surprising that doing business in CA works for him. He also has an advantage from starting 25 years ago so he probably bought the real estate he operates out of much cheaper,etc and might even have it paid off.
Also this is what we have been saying that CA still has a strong tech industry, but a lot of people aren't going to be qualified for those jobs.
""We have a very high-tech workforce, people with bachelor's, master's, PhD's," Dubyn said."
On the other hand CA has masses of poverty and cities like L.A have much higher unemployment rates than Texas cities.
But the tech companies are doing GREAT! So everything is ok!
jm, you have a habit of zeroing in on individual anecdotes and then projecting them as being representative of the full picture - but you do this without any framework of proofs.
Yes, it does make sense that Stan Dubyn's businesses fit in here.
No, you don't have any information about his real estate or other expense positions to make the assertion / assumption you just did. This kind of disconnected projecting is why I have often locked horns with you.
And, jm, California is chock full of all kinds of small businesses. Including mom and pop pizza parlors and burger joints and dry cleaners just like you lamented for in the threads on minimum wage hikes.
As long as there are tech and other businesses here, there will be mom & pops as well.
The nature of existence is opportunism. Existence of any one thing breeds existence of other symbiotic and parasitic functions. And they constantly undergo change. Some things prosper and flourish. Others languish and die. When any functions disappear, others take their place.
The thing to realize is: you don't get to pick which ones thrive just by personal preference or belief.
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