California's "Nicotine" Tax Going Into Effect (buying, college)

[Lovehound]

Well if they do take away Prop 13 I own a house almost as nice as mine out of state (rental) and I can easily just wait until it's vacant, then pack up my stuff and move out of state, and sell my present home for a ridiculous price. And I don't think for a minute that taking away Prop 13 will cause any significant decrease in home prices. All it will cause is a mass exodus of people who have had it with the state government bleeding us to death with taxes.

And the joke will be on the people who think repealing Prop 13 will bring down housing prices. Not only will prices hold, but then THEY will be the ones buying houses and paying those higher property taxes as they shoot through the stratosphere!

And you renters, you'll be bleeding through your noses too when your landlords' rental property taxes go up and the landlord has to raise your rent to pay the increased property taxes on the rental property.

This is a lose-lose situation for everybody but the government if Prop 13 is repealed. And for what? More taxpayer money to waste?

[JGC97]

Originally Posted by Lovehound

Well if they do take away Prop 13 I own a house almost as nice as mine out of state (rental) and I can easily just wait until it's vacant, then pack up my stuff and move out of state, and sell my present home for a ridiculous price.

Just my two cents ... you'd be better off selling the home you're in now, move into one of your rentals here and live there for two years before selling it, moving into one of your other rentals ... and so on. Liquidate your rentals by making them your primary residence for two of five years. Huge tax advantage. Or it used to be. Maybe it's changed. I dunno

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by majoun

So greatly expanding the supply of homes on the market as older homeowners flee (as people on this thread have claimed) would not mean lower prices? Since when does greater supply not mean prices drop? Lower prices would mean more accessibility for more people, as speculation would be discouraged.

Higher property taxes impacting more of the population than the nicotine tax are all the more reason why they are necessary.

Unfortunately the folks who never saw a tax they didn't like are here to stay in the state's political life,and the only thing that can be done about them is splitting up the state.

It would not greatly expand it. It might slowly expand it, but unlikely. Homes are selling quite well right now at the current prices, what makes you think they would drop? To catch up with demand a LOT of homes would need to be on the market. It would just drive more people out of the market. The rise in property tax would add... thousands to the yearly cost. A lower price might lower the mortgage, but that at best is a wash and unlikely to happen. The monthly cost would have to drop dramatically, based on actual cost and that would destroy a lot of people with minimal equity or wipe out their equity. Not a nice thing to do. Look at all the foreclosures and they do not stop the market from growing.

[Lovehound]

He is building his theory of house prices falling on account of the elimination of the Prop 13 tax limitation. However he is building his castle on a foundation of sand because if a Prop 13 repeal causes increased taxes that would stimulate people to sell and leave CA, new buyers would be paying ever increasing property taxes, they'd become the new cash cows for the CA government cash wasting machine.

Besides, and this is just my opinion--the reason for high housing prices in desirable areas is demand, not cost. People will buy no matter what it costs, and taxes be damned. CA is one of the most desirable places to live in the entire US and I mean particularly coastal CA: SD, OC, LA, SB, SF, etc. It's because we have a thriving economy (despite CA government trying to tax it out of business) and the best weather in the nation.

Repealing Prop 13 won't do anything except people will move out of state and other people will buy their houses, and probably everybody leaving will get a really great price that will allow them to buy nicer houses in other parts of the nation and probably even make additional cash.

It will just be different rich people living in the same houses, only paying higher property taxes. People who can't afford a house now will be even further away because without Prop 13 not only will we have high housing prices but we'll have high property taxes too.

It causes me to chuckle, the fanciful idea that somehow eliminating Prop 13 will let people who can now only afford to rent will somehow be able to buy the houses of those leaving rich people on the cheap. It won't happen.

[majoun]

Originally Posted by Lovehound

He is building his theory of house prices falling on account of the elimination of the Prop 13 tax limitation. However he is building his castle on a foundation of sand because if a Prop 13 repeal causes increased taxes that would stimulate people to sell and leave CA, new buyers would be paying ever increasing property taxes, they'd become the new cash cows for the CA government cash wasting machine.

Besides, and this is just my opinion--the reason for high housing prices in desirable areas is demand, not cost. People will buy no matter what it costs, and taxes be damned. CA is one of the most desirable places to live in the entire US and I mean particularly coastal CA: SD, OC, LA, SB, SF, etc. It's because we have a thriving economy (despite CA government trying to tax it out of business) and the best weather in the nation.

Repealing Prop 13 won't do anything except people will move out of state and other people will buy their houses, and probably everybody leaving will get a really great price that will allow them to buy nicer houses in other parts of the nation and probably even make additional cash.

It will just be different rich people living in the same houses, only paying higher property taxes. People who can't afford a house now will be even further away because without Prop 13 not only will we have high housing prices but we'll have high property taxes too.

It causes me to chuckle, the fanciful idea that somehow eliminating Prop 13 will let people who can now only afford to rent will somehow be able to buy the houses of those leaving rich people on the cheap. It won't happen.

California certainly is one of the more desirable places and has better weather than most states. But Oregon also has good weather IMO. And, for those who like more heat, Nevada and Arizona have just as much to offer as inland SoCal. For those who like heat and beaches, there is Hawaii and Florida. Etc. etc. etc.

Needless to say even nice weather can't make up for economic and political decay in other respects. If it could, than Portugal would be Europe's most prosperous country. If demand decreases and supply increases, prices will definitely go down. Do basic economic facts not apply just because it's California? Typical LAUSD product.

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by Lovehound

It causes me to chuckle, the fanciful idea that somehow eliminating Prop 13 will let people who can now only afford to rent will somehow be able to buy the houses of those leaving rich people on the cheap. It won't happen.

This lack of understanding is why they do not have the money to buy. Not smart enough to find a way to make more money.

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by majoun

So greatly expanding the supply of homes on the market as older homeowners flee (as people on this thread have claimed) would not mean lower prices? Since when does greater supply not mean prices drop? Lower prices would mean more accessibility for more people, as speculation would be discouraged.

Higher property taxes impacting more of the population than the nicotine tax are all the more reason why they are necessary.

Unfortunately the folks who never saw a tax they didn't like are here to stay in the state's political life,and the only thing that can be done about them is splitting up the state.

Then you would have 2 States with the same mindset.

[Lovehound]

Originally Posted by expatCA

This lack of understanding is why they do not have the money to buy. Not smart enough to find a way to make more money.

At least we know that lack of understanding will never be in short supply. That is why lack of understanding is so inexpensive.

I think there are too many people complaining about their lack of living the life they want to lead, and too few people who spend their time learning a career or trade or other means of making the money necessary to afford the houses.

It's almost, "I'm poor and I can't have a nice house, so let's kick out all those rich people and give us their rich houses."

Is that communism or socialism? I forget.

[majoun]

Originally Posted by Lovehound

At least we know that lack of understanding will never be in short supply. That is why lack of understanding is so inexpensive.

I think there are too many people complaining about their lack of living the life they want to lead, and too few people who spend their time learning a career or trade or other means of making the money necessary to afford the houses.

It's almost, "I'm poor and I can't have a nice house, so let's kick out all those rich people and give us their rich houses."

Is that communism or socialism? I forget.

So wanting to end government interference in the economy to subsidize large property owners and prop up an industry via limiting supplies is just fine, while restoring market mechanisms and cutting overall taxation levels is "socialism"?

Moderator cut: see note

[expatCA]

Originally Posted by Lovehound

He is building his theory of house prices falling on account of the elimination of the Prop 13 tax limitation. However he is building his castle on a foundation of sand because if a Prop 13 repeal causes increased taxes that would stimulate people to sell and leave CA, new buyers would be paying ever increasing property taxes, they'd become the new cash cows for the CA government cash wasting machine.

Besides, and this is just my opinion--the reason for high housing prices in desirable areas is demand, not cost. People will buy no matter what it costs, and taxes be damned. CA is one of the most desirable places to live in the entire US and I mean particularly coastal CA: SD, OC, LA, SB, SF, etc. It's because we have a thriving economy (despite CA government trying to tax it out of business) and the best weather in the nation.

Repealing Prop 13 won't do anything except people will move out of state and other people will buy their houses, and probably everybody leaving will get a really great price that will allow them to buy nicer houses in other parts of the nation and probably even make additional cash.

It will just be different rich people living in the same houses, only paying higher property taxes. People who can't afford a house now will be even further away because without Prop 13 not only will we have high housing prices but we'll have high property taxes too.

It causes me to chuckle, the fanciful idea that somehow eliminating Prop 13 will let people who can now only afford to rent will somehow be able to buy the houses of those leaving rich people on the cheap. It won't happen.

This is true.

One thing people keep talking about is being "fair" Life is NOT fair, it is what we make it while dealing with reality.

I was raised poor, slept on the couch in the living room all through High School in a 1 bdrm apt living with my mother. Never went to college yet today my worth (reasonable valuation of the technology I have created) is in the 8 figure range. This was simply because I ... worked hard and learned what I needed to without college, which I could not afford as I had to help support my mother when I got out of High School. I could not buy a house in CA until I was in my 50's and then only because of saving and selling a home I bought in TX before moving back to CA. Now I will either be moving to SoCal or FL and will pay cash for a home. It is in our hands what we become and what we do.