Prop 13 (megatopic) (Sonoma: kitchen cabinets, storage, agricultural)

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by Thekdog

My point on prop 13 is it is great if you bought a house a long time ago, but now cities don't want to permit housing because of it so now we have a housing shortage

Although there are lots of other factors leading to the housing shortage.

https://www.cato.org/blog/future-cal...proposition-13

[Thekdog]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

Although there are lots of other factors leading to the housing shortage.

https://www.cato.org/blog/future-cal...proposition-13

Yes that's true. Imo a lot of the policies adopted have just compounded the problem

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by Dave Coe

Prop 13 is a handout because it is subsidized and dependent upon new home owners paying a lot more in taxes. It would be fine if property taxes were low for all.

I'm surprised, with all the threads about California you've started and all the research you've apparently done, that you aren't aware of how Prop. 13 works.

[CA4Now]

Originally Posted by njbiodude

One of my relatives bought a house over twenty years ago for about 900k. It was a fixer upper and he had to do major repairs on it and pull permits unless he wanted to live in a disgusting home. He did this over the next 10 years and now the home is very nice. But his house is worth almost 2 million but he essentially gets no benefit from prop 13 because he fixed up his home. He’s retirement age now too but gets no benefit.

He gets no benefit from Prop. 13 because he fixed up his home? His house should have been re-assessed with each major remodeling job he did--with a supplemental tax bill to reflect that--and it sounds as if it was.

Originally Posted by njbiodude

Other coworker tried doing major repairs on a property in Sonoma and the county flew drones down, took photos through windows and took him to court. He had to settle for almost 50k in fines after a long protracted legal battle.

Did he do the remodeling himself without pulling permits? I can't imagine any other way this would have happened.

Originally Posted by njbiodude

Id prefer if they simply spread tax cuts to everyone. Just lower the taxed assessment rate to well under 1% for everyone and don’t have restrictions on repairs. Same property tax revenue but much better housing stock.

"Repairs" do not result in a re-assessment of residential property.

https://assessor.lacounty.gov/homeow...w-construction

[njbiodude]

Originally Posted by wac_432

I disagree. Newcomers should pay more, that's how we encourage measured gentrification in desirable areas while at the same time preventing seniors and other types of lower-income locals from being displaced so rapidly that it destabilizes the local social structure.

And ugly homes people don’t want to fix beyond basic maintenance due to reassessment worries. I haven’t seen any area of the planet with so many old rotting low quality homes valued at a million dollars + as the Bay Area. In any other area with this much money old homes would quickly be gutted and redone. Instead we still have cheap homes from the 50s and 60s everywhere because the owners want to keep paying artificially low taxes.

California passes a law to help keep people in their homes then passes another law to try to fix that and another to fix that. At the end of the day we have astronomical permit costs and incredible difficulty building new homes.

[njbiodude]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

He gets no benefit from Prop. 13 because he fixed up his home? His house should have been re-assessed with each major remodeling job he did--with a supplemental tax bill to reflect that--and it sounds as if it was.



Did he do the remodeling himself without pulling permits? I can't imagine any other way this would have happened.



"Repairs" do not result in a re-assessment of residential property.

https://assessor.lacounty.gov/homeow...w-construction

The definition of “repairs” varies by county. Mine is much more stringent than Los Angeles. I hid a kitchen remodel from neighbors (new floors, new countertops, new cabinets) recently and a lot of contractors straight up refused to do it without pulling permits which would make me pay thousands more every year in taxes. Total unnecessary PITA. Sounds like in LA that might be okay but certainly not in my area despite the fact it had 0 effect on structural integrity or plumbing.

[blameyourself]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

He gets no benefit from Prop. 13 because he fixed up his home? His house should have been re-assessed with each major remodeling job he did--with a supplemental tax bill to reflect that--and it sounds as if it was.



Did he do the remodeling himself without pulling permits? I can't imagine any other way this would have happened.



"Repairs" do not result in a re-assessment of residential property.

https://assessor.lacounty.gov/homeow...w-construction

As Roseanne Roseannadanna used to say...."it's always something"

Thanks CA4Now for saving the rest of us the trouble.

[Reziac]

Originally Posted by CA4Now

"Repairs" do not result in a re-assessment of residential property.

https://assessor.lacounty.gov/homeow...w-construction

If the law is as fuzzy as the explanation, there's a LOT of wiggle room:

New Construction
Under California property tax law, “new construction” is defined in four general categories:
"Any physical alteration of any improvement, or a portion thereof, to a “like-new” condition, or to extend its economic life"

So.,. under a hostile interpretation: The paint is peeling off my rental house. I repaint it so it won't fall apart and become unrentable, thereby extending its economic life. It is now in "like-new condition" and is reassessed as new.

I can see how this could become ridiculously restrictive in tax-greedy counties, and might tend to discourage normal maintenance.


"Property tax: a fine for improving your property."
-- R.A. Heinlein

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by Reziac

If the law is as fuzzy as the explanation, there's a LOT of wiggle room:

New Construction
Under California property tax law, “new construction” is defined in four general categories:
"Any physical alteration of any improvement, or a portion thereof, to a “like-new” condition, or to extend its economic life"

So.,. under a hostile interpretation: The paint is peeling off my rental house. I repaint it so it won't fall apart and become unrentable, thereby extending its economic life. It is now in "like-new condition" and is reassessed as new.

I can see how this could become ridiculously restrictive in tax-greedy counties, and might tend to discourage normal maintenance.


"Property tax: a fine for improving your property."
-- R.A. Heinlein

I don't know where you got that but it's incorrect.

https://www.boe.ca.gov/proptaxes/new...not-considered

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by njbiodude

The definition of “repairs” varies by county. Mine is much more stringent than Los Angeles. I hid a kitchen remodel from neighbors (new floors, new countertops, new cabinets) recently and a lot of contractors straight up refused to do it without pulling permits which would make me pay thousands more every year in taxes. Total unnecessary PITA. Sounds like in LA that might be okay but certainly not in my area despite the fact it had 0 effect on structural integrity or plumbing.

They are defined by the state, not counties. https://www.boe.ca.gov/proptaxes/new...not-considered