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What you guys are failing to mention is that the other sizable chunk of the population in North Chicago (and Waukegan) are working-class Latinos, primarily Mexican. If you did any shopping in these areas, including the Wal-Mart in Lakehurst where I'm a regular, you'd know that Whites are clearly a minority in these towns. Now of course I'm not going to argue with you that this is the case at Northbrook Court or any of the town centers near New Trier (Winnetka, Glencoe, etc.) lol.
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Originally Posted by urza216
I know there are rougher pockets of the 847 that aren't really that rough. I said a "large swath of the 847" and that it was a "fair generalization" - not that it was set in stone and every neighborhood in every town in the region was just a bunch of rich kids. Maybe there's people with modest middle-class incomes but little to no working class incomes.
Oh, and down here, most suburbs are majority black these days. (Olympia Fields is majority black and a very nice town). A lot has changed to since the 2000 Census but nonetheless, the numbers do read that North Chicago isn't majority black. You might just think it is because you're not used to seeing very many black people at all. Although it is possible that a lot of the white people in town are scared so they don't walk around the neighborhood and show their face as much as the black people do (hence why SEEMS like blacks are the majority when in reality, they aren't).
Evanston is a cool town with its fair share of problems and I specifically excluded them from my commentary. I would never accuse a wealthier Evanstonite of being oblivious. Folks in Evanston know what's up. If it wasn't so far away from everything I'm accustomed to, I would love to live there and would gladly live in one of the rougher neighborhoods if it was all I could afford.
But here's the dirty little secret about Evanston schools: There is a HUGE achievement gap between the peformance of black and white students in this system. Evanston's schools are really doing a great job of educating white children, but a somewhat poor job of educating black children. For example, the test scores for white children at Evanston Township High School are the second best in the entire Chicago area, with 92.6% meeting or exceeding state standards. The only Chicagoland non-selective enrollment high school with higher test scores for white children is, of course, New Trier, with 92.8% meeting or exceeding standards. That 0.2% difference is not even statistically significant. Black children at ETHS have embarassingly low test scores (on average), with a dismal 37.7% meeting or exceeding standards. How can a school be so great for white students and so bad for black students? The problem is a controversial one, and the adminstration is being forced to confront it because of "No Child Left Behind". They are throwing a bunch of money at the problem, and this is a major reason for the extraordinarily high average expenditure per child at ETHS.
Exactly right, and this applies to a number of the elementary and middle schools as well. Looking at overall average test scores just doesn't tell the story. You can even leave race out - the IL report cards have a break-out section titled "economically disadvantaged." When you look at results of students not in that category, most Evanston schools are at least on par with, if not exceeding, the performance of the New Trier Township school students not in that category (which is usually not much different from their overall averages).
But here's the dirty little secret about Evanston schools: There is a HUGE achievement gap between the peformance of black and white students in this system. Evanston's schools are really doing a great job of educating white children, but a somewhat poor job of educating black children. For example, the test scores for white children at Evanston Township High School are the second best in the entire Chicago area, with 92.6% meeting or exceeding state standards. The only Chicagoland non-selective enrollment high school with higher test scores for white children is, of course, New Trier, with 92.8% meeting or exceeding standards. That 0.2% difference is not even statistically significant. Black children at ETHS have embarassingly low test scores (on average), with a dismal 37.7% meeting or exceeding standards. How can a school be so great for white students and so bad for black students? The problem is a controversial one, and the adminstration is being forced to confront it because of "No Child Left Behind". They are throwing a bunch of money at the problem, and this is a major reason for the extraordinarily high average expenditure per child at ETHS.
Exactly. I know it's considering trolling if you say this, but New Trier is by far one of the most overrated high schools in the nation. It's a great school, but not the holy grail so many claim it to be.
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Originally Posted by Lookout Kid
The area immediately northeast of ETHS is a bit rough, but it's not like you're sending kids through Englewood. I'm not sure I would be too worried about it. I had gangs in my high school in the early 90's, and they did not affect my life. More than 3,000 kids go to ETHS every day, and incidents are rare.
I think Evanston's enrollment dropped below 3000...it hangs somewhere around 2900 now. Not that it matters.
Exactly right, and this applies to a number of the elementary and middle schools as well. Looking at overall average test scores just doesn't tell the story. You can even leave race out - the IL report cards have a break-out section titled "economically disadvantaged." When you look at results of students not in that category, most Evanston schools are at least on par with, if not exceeding, the performance of the New Trier Township school students not in that category (which is usually not much different from their overall averages).
ETHS is one of the most tracted schools in the nation. That upper tract works very well and is pure North Shore. Is this the route the high school should be going? Of course it would it should be raising the tide for all students.
But reality states that you can't keep a base of well of folks with the income to make things work without providing top notch education at the accelerated level.
Evanston has to do this within its only high school. But look at how a big city with massive numbers of high schools handles the issue:
for Chicago that would be highly selective high schools with top notch faculties and top notch facilities. The result? Northside and Payton outperforming New Trier, Stevenson, GBS, GBN, HP,, and Dfd.
Exactly. I know it's considering trolling if you say this, but New Trier is by far one of the most overrated high schools in the nation. It's a great school, but not the holy grail so many claim it to be.
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One can't deny the obvious: New Trier is an outstanding high school located in a dump. An old, falling apart structure, virtually handicap inaccessible is trying to provide a 21st century education in an early 20th century facility.
Science anyone? Try enrolling in a high school with the space for real labs. Maybe New Trier officials might want to make a trip to the next high school district directly north of it and see how another ancient high school, HPHS, can address science education in a throughly up to date 21st century structure.
Did New Trier overreach in last year's failed bond issue? Probably. But there is little question that the economy killed the plans every bit as much as bells and whistles did. Which begs the question: Why didn't New Trier to something about its space issues years back. How does the district go through the expense and renovation of reopening New Trier West as New Trier Northfield campus for freshmen without putting an equal amount of money into New Trier Winnetka campus where sophmores, juniors, and seniors get their education.
[quote=edsg25;14677192: for Chicago that would be highly selective high schools with top notch faculties and top notch facilities. The result? Northside and Payton outperforming New Trier, Stevenson, GBS, GBN, HP,, and Dfd.[/quote]
Not sure if your logic is right. A high school with a 6% acceptance rate will of course beat a high school that has to take everyone. It's not the facilities that make them better.
My husband and I are starting the process of looking into buying in Chicago (Lincoln Park/Lakeview) or the North Shore with a budget of $750k. I like the look of many of the homes in Evanston (vintage/Victorian architecture), the idea of a shorter commute (we both work in the Loop), and a more walkable city. But Evanston seems to higher property taxes and the schools aren't nearly as good as Wilmette/Winnetka/etc.
I'm curious what motivates families with children with our budget to live in Evanston rather than further up the North Shore in the New Trier School District. It doesn't seem like the homes in Evanston are actually cheaper. It looks like we could afford at least a modest house near the train in Winnetka within our budget.
Is comparable housing in Evanston really substantially less expensive? Is $750k not a reasonable budget other areas in the North Shore? Why do families who could afford Wilmette/Winnekta buy in Evanston instead? Just the shorter commute? Working in Evanston proper? The urban feel? Other cultural intangibles?
I lived in Northeast Evanston. We were 5 blocks from the beach. We were able to jog, bike on Northwestern's campus. We could walk to our small downtown area (I am a walker, so could walk to all the downtown areas, though it was a bit longer than most people like). We had a wonderful walking club that walked every Sunday from Dempster and the Lake up to the Bahai Temple then went back to Downtown and had coffee or dinner.
We were within easy walking distance of the *el* and could be in downtown Chicago in about 25 minutes. We lived in a vibrant neighborhood that had block parties every summer with activities for the kids and sharing of food for the adults.
There was a diversity of people in Evanston that was not true of Wilmette. A lot of the kids my children met were from other countries because their parents were grad students at Northwestern. Many of them did not speak English so the kids got along using signs and taught each other.
For my kids, there were a million activities from summer art camps to sports camps. My dd was artistic and learned so much at those camps and they were not very expensive. There was ice skating at Crown Center on the other side of town (We did go to Wilmette for that for a while for my dd because she liked to figure skate. For Hockey, Crown was fabulous) We also had a myriad of dance classes which dd loved including many through the parks department that were inexpensive. In fact, my ds went to preschool at the parks department right across the street from my house.
I am not saying Wilmette might not be your cup of tea. It just was not mine. I found Wilmette and Winnetka boring unless you went out of the town.
I know that the parks and rec in Wilmette does have classes too, but I loved being close to Northwestern for adult classes and events. The band concerts in the summer were great. Shakespeare in the park in Evanston was cool too and we took the kids even when they were just preschoolers because they could run around and still get something out of the plays.
Now, when we bought out house in Evanston, it was significantly cheaper than houses in Wilmette and Winnetka. We figured that if we lived further north we would need a second car. In Evanston, I did not need that though it would have been nice to have. When I went back to work in the city, the shorter commute time was nice especially when I worked where I could take the train instead of the car.
Really, you have to decide what vibe you like. I love Evanston.
Not sure if your logic is right. A high school with a 6% acceptance rate will of course beat a high school that has to take everyone. It's not the facilities that make them better.
I never questioned the qualification aspect, kindra, nor did I consider it illogical.
Harvard's acceptance rate and quality of student will, of course, beat that of Southwest North Dakota State Teachers & Agricultural College at Prairiedog (SWNDSTACP, for those who love acronyms) any day of the week.
Then again, New Trier will, of course, run rings around Marshall as a quality high school before a student at either even enters the door and goes to the classroom. Interestingly enough, New Trier would still exceed Marshall by a tough inner city mile if the kids entered the building and were given comic books to read all day.
Not sure if my logic is right, kindra? Guess what: there are no fair playing fields out there.....be they New Trier compared to selective Northside and certainly New Trier compared to tragically neighborhood assigned (there-by-the-grace-of-god-go-i) Marshall.
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