Converting 2/3-flat into Single Family Home? (Chicago, Addison: for sale, rental, condos)

[Spandau]

Hi all,

I'm moving back to Chicago after a 5 year absence. I'm a Chicago native, my SO isn't. We lived here for a year, 6 years ago, and have visited pretty frequently. My SO is all set on living in Lakeview, and while there are neighborhoods I'd prefer, I'm happy enough to live there.

We need a 4 bedroom house, and one of the options we're considering is converting a 2 or 3-flat into a single family home. I remember a couple of years ago when SFH conversions in the Southport corridor were all the rage. Did they hold their value?

I'm having a suprisingly hard time finding information about converting multi-units into SFHs on the internet. Can anyone point me to some websites? We're trying to figure out costs and projected time frames before we commit to buying a property. It seems weird to me to start working with an architect and a contractor before we've even decided if we want to do this, but how else are we supposed to find out how much it will cost and what it entails?

Also, what are the zoning issues? Is that easy enough to sort out with the city?

We aren't completely sold on the multi-unit into SFH conversion just yet, and I would be interested in anything anyone had to say on the topic. However, getting a 4 bedroom house and moving to Lakeview is not up for debate. We can afford it, and we need the space, and I know that there are other neighborhoods in the city that offer more bang for buck etc.

Thanks for any input.

[surlycue]

Why go through all that work when there are SFHs already there for the buying? I know a couple people that have converted two flats and they did so because the rental money from the upstairs unit allowed them to pay down their mortgage enough to convert. If you can afford a SFH off the bat then why go through the misery of DIY?

[Spandau]

We've already rennovated a vintage house and are wary of going through the process again. But there just aren't very many SFHs up for sale in the area we'd like to buy in (east of Clark, between Addison and Belmont). My SO doesn't drive & being able to easily walk to the elementary school, grocery store, gym, dog groomers, etc. is a BIG plus for us. There's a graystone SFH at Roscoe and Broadway for $999,000 - with 3 small bedrooms, an unfinished basement, and no parking. There's also a greystone 2 flat a block away with 7 bedrooms and a garage for $988,000. We may end up looking elsewhere, I was just curious if anyone knew anything about the conversion process.

[Venom]

I dnt know anything about that, but flats and the greystones are my favorite type of buildings.
My friend lives in one and its modified as a family home.

So awesome.

[JoeyPants]

It's easier to do with older homes that were originally SFH converted to 2 flats. Many turn of the century 2 flats, like Graystones were originally SFH's. It is a project and some people don't like to deal with rehabbing, I personally don't mind as it gives me complete license to design it to my liking.

[Drover]

What are the tax implications for a building that's zoned as a 2- or 3-flat? Are you going to pay higher taxes on it because it's zoned multiple units even if it's actually a SFH?

[chet everett]

The Cook CO Assesor is actually pretty helpful in "re-classifying" properties BUT there is no need to do so as your tax is still in the same category, as far as assessment class -- of course the permits MIGHT trigger a review and you should be able to demonstrate that such a "down conversion" resulted in the property being no more valuable...
http://www.cookcountyassessor.com/forms/classcode.PDF

Frankly I agree that in the area the OP is considering there is NO WAY that a 2-flat -> SFH is going to be cost effective unless the 2-flat is just so roached out that it is too gross to live in AND the slum lord is under water. Lakeview EAST of Clark and NORTH of Addision is SUPER PRICEY and the competition for housing in that area is INSANE even with the down turn. Legal 3-flats in that area are pretty much GOLDEN as the rent from two units makes living in the third pretty darned cheap and they price the buildings on the quality of the "owner's unit" so that places with big /fixed up owner's units ROUTINELY price out sky high...

I think there are LOTS & LOTS of places that are 100s of thousands less for just as nice an area, the wild card is the SCHOOLS.

It would a HUGE WASTE OF TIME / EFFORT to even call an GC or Architect until you at least narrow down your short list to 4-5 properties. The effort to given even a ballpark is just too full of variables -- for places with ancient systems it is easy to spend $100,000 just tearing out and replacing freakishly old furnances and water systems. If you like high end finishes and high Chicago rates for labor and materials prepare for a project that starts around $300K and ends deep into the seven figure territory. Drive around the area and ask how many "flippers" have ended up WAY over budget! The slow down in work has not made the money that folks invested in projects any cheaper and people do not "give away" anything -- the folks that are forced to sell when they get behind in the over fiancanced situations still try (and often get) a very competitive price... While you say you "can afford it" I can assure that MANY even roached 2-flats are listed sky high and if you have a desire to really have a nice home that does not simply remove exterior doors and turn the extra kitchen into some funky living space you could VERY EASILY spend deep into the $1M+++ terrirtory...

You could almost certainly COMBINE two adjacent condo units into an enormous home for a fraction of that...

If you find a 'rough' SFH you might be able to stay under $800K, but frankly in the area you considering there are hundreds of other folks that would beat you to the punch on most anything that comes on the market.

There is still brutal competition for what you are desire...

[Spandau]

Thanks for the reply Chet, certainly gives a us a lot to think about! The downside with combining two condos is the condo association fees - as far as I can tell they're at least $300 a month, but more usually $400-$500+. Since I can vacuum my own stairs and tend my own lawn for free, I'm a bit reluctant to pay condo fees. If we can't find what we're looking for in the neighborhood we want, we'll look further abroad, this is just a starting point for the search.

2-flats in the area we're interested in seem to go for $800,000-$1,000,000, and they all seem pretty habitable. I guessed another $200,000-$300,000 for renovation costs. When you talk about projects going into the seven-figures, are you talking about the total cost of buying the building and doing the work, or just doing the work?

I agree that there are other neighborhoods which offer better value for money, but I have a significant other who doesn't drive, isn't from Chicago (and is really moving to Chicago for me), and prefers Lakeview to all other neighborhoods of Chicago. So Lakeview is number one on the list.

[JustinHaugens]

I'm not quite sure the "who doesn't drive" part is playing such a huge role in your decision when you should keep in mind Chicago's public transportation.

[Chi-town Native]

Lots of people convert those old 2-flats to SFH buildings, that's pretty nuts-and-bolts (get a good architect for permits, etc).

Going from a SFH to a 2-flat is a whole different ball of wax...