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most christians don't even know what homosexuality IS> homosexuality is NOT a lifestyle it is NOT a choice because it's not an action. homosexuality is an unchosen sexual orientation. The question is aking to asking if black people can be Christians. For some reasons many Christians perceive homosexuality to be a sinful life choice. If you actually TALK to gay people you will discover that those are untrue lies. Gay people know the MOST in this world on what homosexuality MEANS. When somoene says they are gay they are revealing their sexual orientation. They not telling you that they've even ever had sex. When someone tells me that they're straight there is no 'morality' being inferred. They're also not even inferring that they even have ever had sex, they're revealing their sexual orientation. They're revealing an UNCHOSEN sexual orientation... a part of their born core idenity. if you think a sexual orientation is a sin it's akin to thinking a skin color is a sin. Both were equally NOT chosen. Again, this is coming from the first hand source of a gay person
Dark skin is not chosen, preferences are.
Nature obviously shows us that a penis fits into a vagina & only there. It is not meant to go into an anus... & medical dr.s even advise against this because of health risks. We are the product of sperm from a man & an egg from a woman. Nature shows us that men are meant to be with women. Rarely, there are exceptions in nature... Yet, it's been scientifically studied & found that most (95 percent) of genes are "born" healthy & in line with what nature intended. What happens between birth & the developoment of a variance has been linked with environmental influences... especially in the form of stress, resulting form thought/emotion.
This may bother some... but it's anatomical, medical & scientific fact.
Standing on the truth of God's revealed word is not condemning the person. It is condemning the act. In this case, the sin of homosexuality. The Bible is clear that homosexuality is a sin. It is an abnormal and unnatural lust. (Romans 1:24-32).
Those who give approval to the sin of homosexuality are themselves decadent and contribute to the moral decline of a nation which invites divine Justice on that nation.
You obviously need to learn the Bible. Romans is not talking about gays. Paul's audience was Greek and Roman heterosexuals who were obsessed with pederasty and prostitution. Get a clue.
Fiyero,
Anal sex is medically advised against for any couple.
A penis was not designed to fit into an anus... anybody who as ever gone to the bathroom can tell you that the anus is built for external, not internal movement... Still, let's let a Dr. explain...
Quote:
You ask about anal sex. We (Dr. David Delvin, GP & other Doctors) don't really recommend this...
passing on of infection (if one of you has one).
damage to the woman's anus (especially if you're rough).
spread of germs from anus to vagina (if you have vaginal sex immediately afterwards).
possible urinary infection in the man (very uncommon).
"A rare, but serious, complication after anal sex is a hole (perforation) in the colon. This dangerous problem requires hospitalization, surgery to repair the hole, and antibiotics to prevent infection."
True that those preferences, which are instinctive for our survival are ingrained. But those preferences unrelated to survival or even counter to it, are learned.
Homosexual behaviors are learned & have been shown to be unhealthy...
Quote:
THE HEALTH RISKS OF GAY SEX by Dr. JOHN R. DIGGS, JR., M.D.
Sexual relationships between members of the same sex expose gays, lesbians and bisexuals to extreme risks of Sexually Transmitted Diseases (STDs), physical injuries, mental disorders and even a shortened life span. There are five major distinctions between gay and heterosexual relationships, with specific medical consequences. They are: Moderator cut: edited to comply with copyrighrt rules http://www.corporateresourcecouncil.org/white_papers/Health_Risks.pdf
"Homosexuality is death, and I choose life." - Ex-Homosexual and ex-"gay rights" leader Michael Glatze
Yeah, animals may show homosexual behaviors, like a horny dog will hump anything.
Animals won't keep harming themselves - they may intentionally hurt others, but not themselves.
Don't we have more self-control, health awareness & choice than animals?
Last edited by Miss Blue; 05-09-2011 at 10:16 AM..
Fiyero,
Anal sex is medically advised against for any couple.
A penis was not designed to fit into an anus... anybody who as ever gone to the bathroom can tell you that the anus is built for external, not internal movement... Still, let's let a Dr. explain...
True that those preferences, which are instinctive for our survival are ingrained. But those preferences unrelated to survival or even counter to it, are learned.
Homosexual behaviors are learned & have been shown to be unhealthy... "Homosexuality is death, and I choose life." - Ex-Homosexual and ex-"gay rights" leader Michael Glatze
Yeah, animals may show homosexual behaviors, like a horny dog will hump anything.
Animals won't keep harming themselves - they may intentionally hurt others, but not themselves.
Don't we have more self-control, health awareness & choice than animals?
lol! Sorry you fall for these "statistics" that are used by anti-gay bigots to support their hatred. A thousand sex partners? That's funny... who has that kind of time on their hands? And if you think a penis doesn't fit into an anus, there's plenty of "documentation" that it does lol! Not to mention the scientific fact that the male body has sexual nerves in the prostrate. Why would we be created that way if there was not supposed to be homosexuality?
I suppose the fact that I've been monogamous for over 15 years and never had a disease, STD, or any health issue do to being gay makes me one in a billion, huh?
Denverian,
Apparently 28% had the time - over their entire life-span.
I'm happy for you that you & probably your partner have been monogomous & have not acquired STDs nor health problems. Still, you are the exception, statistically.
I have no problem with homosexuals, having friends & family who I love & respect, with those tendencies. I do have a problem with teaching homosexuality to be natural & healthy when it so often isn't. Children are especially vulnerable to this... In a study, many 12-year-olds were confused about gender identity. Psychotherapy for the "Gay" Teenager
Councilors sent them to gay community centers or gay clubs - who welcomed them & likely leaned them toward gay tendencies, when they were simply exploring identity, as most kids that age are.
Also, children benefit from the different but complimentary parenting styles of a mother & father. They can't learn how to relate to the opposite sex well, if they never see it in their family. Besides how we all were conceived, many studies support that children need a mother & father...
To those of you uber conservative Christians who never study any side of the argument other than your own, I present the following facts and ideas just to for your understanding of this debate:
1. Homosexual behavior has been witness in over 1500+ animal species which at the very least suggests it happens in nature and may even have at least a micro evolutionary role such as the release of sexual tension without growing the population too much or something similar.
2. Their have been similiaries found in the brain symmetry of gay people and opposite sex, which suggests a developmental differences that would have had to have taken place in the womb (though not necessarily a genetic link in these cases). These findings and similar findings suggest that it may not be as much of a choice as we once thought.
3. Torah law condemns homosexuality in the section relating to rules for Priests and rules on worship and it is arguable, though not necessarily confirmable, that it was condemned mostly because these were practices done in Cultic religions of the time that are long dead.
4. Last I checked, even Robert Gagnon (great debater if you want anti-homosexual arguments) believes the story of Sodom and Gomorrah was about rape.
5. In Pauls seemingly direct new testament condemnations of homosexual behavior, his descriptions in his are strangely similar to the behaviors practiced as as apart of the worship in the cults of Cybele (very popular in Rome at the time) and Dionysus. If there were purposeful cultic connections to these actions at the time, it may be arguable that these actions today do not carry the same condemnation if they do not necessarily violate the laws of love. This is of course very debatable, but is quite a coincidence.
6.The greek words used in reference to homosexuals in the New Testament are "malakoi" which means "soft" or "effeminate" and "arsenokoitai" which literally means "man bedders" (based on the root word) which can mean a number of things. Both are good words to describe the activities of the Cults I mentioned above as well as Roman Pedophilia practices which was more often the rape of a minor or a slave, so there still may be some question on why Paul was truly condemning these behaviors. Here we are getting into potential cultural relativity issues in the bible as well so how you view these verses may also depend on how you believe culturally based commands in the bible translate into modern day commands.
Anyways, I don't have a set position on this and probably a few similar arguments have been posted on this thread before, but I figured I'd mention some of the more interesting things I've discovered in the homosexuality debate on the other side. I use be all about finding ways to condemn homosexual behavior biblically until I realized just how dishonoring it is to not fully give the otherside a fair viewing or even try to understand their dilemma. They, who make up 2% to 10% of the population depending on what statistic you read, are essentially being asked to be celibate their entire lives for something that is not necessariy their fault. Are we suppose to tell them "sucks you to be you" even when this issue may not be as well scripturally or scientifically understood as was once thought? I think we need to keep more of an open mind on this topic and truly try love these people, even if in the end that means not agreeing with aspects of their lifestyle completely.
Last edited by Jrhockney; 05-09-2011 at 12:54 PM..
Reason: clarification
People are allowed to have emotions for whomever they wish. But choosing to have sex with someone is a choice everyone makes. Guys make it. Girls make it. People have free will and are free to make the choice to sleep with whoever they want. But that decision doesn't absolve them of the consequences of their actions based on a standard God creates. Which is found in the Bible.
People are allowed to have emotions for whomever they wish. But choosing to have sex with someone is a choice everyone makes. Guys make it. Girls make it. People have free will and are free to make the choice to sleep with whoever they want. But that decision doesn't absolve them of the consequences of their actions based on a standard God creates. Which is found in the Bible.
That is true, promiscuous heterosexuals, promiscuous homosexuals are on the same level.
Two homosexuals committed only to each other with love and the hopes for a life long companionship are on the same level as heterosexuals doing the same.
... I use be all about finding ways to condemn homosexual behavior biblically until I realized just how dishonoring it is to not fully give the otherside a fair viewing or even try to understand their dilemma. They, who make up 2% to 10% of the population depending on what statistic you read, are essentially being asked to be celibate their entire lives for something that is not necessariy their fault. Are we suppose to tell them "sucks you to be you" even when this issue may not be as well scripturally or scientifically understood as was once thought? I think we need to keep more of an open mind on this topic and truly try love these people, even if in the end that means not agreeing with aspects of their lifestyle completely.
I respect your respect for seeing both sides.
I believe everyone needs to feel validated - it's healing & helpful in moving on.
It seems there are 4 perspectives in this type of discussion/debate:
1. Homosexuals - either confused or feeling threatened
2. Homosexual supporters - who want to be seen as peaceful & loving, at all costs
3. Homosexual condemners - who justify condemning homosexuals for their imperfect illusions, while they have imperfect illusions too.
4. Homosexuality demythifiers - who present facts of health, psychological & sociological problems associated with homosexuality.
I consider myself #4. I respect peoples for who they are, but I won't pretend that some illusional fad has not proved to be harmful, when it has.
I see homosexuality like anorexia. Anorexics have an aversion to food, homosexuals have an aversion to heterosexual sex. Our bodies were clearly designed to eat & digest food. Our bodies were clearly designed for heterosexual sex. When we go too long, trying to avoid what is good for us, our bodies start to change... (Even studies show that those who play the part of the opposite sex start to develop similar hormones etc.) Then, we require artificial substitutes - the anorexic gets fed intraveiniously & the homosexual finds substitutes for herosexual affection. Pretending that an anorexic is fat or that they are just fine, not eating, is not helping them - it's hurting them. Similarly, pretending homosexuality is natural & healthy is not helping - it's hurting. That's not to say we ridicule them... No! We need to show more love & understanding... but not by endulging their illusions.
Last edited by SuperSoul; 05-09-2011 at 01:02 PM..
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