Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Homosexuality has been around since the Old testament time of Sodom. There were sodomites with the Israelites wandering through the desert that were kept separate from the main camp and isolated. One account reported a "pestilence" broke out in the sodomite camp. God regards homosexuality as an abomination. That word isn't used to describe even murder. God really doesn't like homosexual behavior.
Jesus confirmed in Matthew 19:4 that marriage is between a man and a woman. 'And He answered and said, ''Have you not read, that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE, 5] and said, 'FOR THIS CAUSE A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER, AND SHALL CLEAVE TO HIS WIFE; AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'? 6] Consequently they are no longer two, but one Flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.''
Homosexuallity it a sin before, during, and after the Mosaic law. As already stated, homosexuality is mentioned in the New Testament, in 1 Cor 6:9 as being a sin . 'Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10] nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God.'
1 Tim 1:9 'realizing the fact that law in not made for a righteous man, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers 10] and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound teaching, 11] according to the glorious gospel of the blessd God, with which I have been entrusted.'
Romans 1:24 'Therefore God gave them over in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, that their bodies might be dishonored among them. 25] For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. 26] For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural (lesbianism), 27] and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men commiting indecent acts (homosexuality) and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error.
Jude 1:7 Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after strange flesh, are exhibited as an example, in undergoing the punishment of eternal fire. The people of Sodom were homosexuals as seen in Genesis 19:4-9.
The New Testament Scriptures are every bit as clear as the Old Testament about what God thinks of homosexuality.
Neither the New Testament nor the Old Testament were written in English (obviously). So what you are quoting (completely out of context, I might add) are interpretions by translators. Translators have their own biases.
The word "homosexual" was used in an English translation for the first time in the 1946 Revised Standard Version in 1 Corinthians 6:9.
Prior to that time, 1 Corinthians 6:9 was used to condemn "masturbators" for centuries, not homosexuals. The Greek words "malakoi" and "arsenokoites" were never used to refer to homosexuals in contemporaneous secular Greek texts. If Paul had meant homosexuals, there were other Greek words he could have used to make it clear that's what he meant. But he didn't.
Jude 1:7. "strange flesh" (different flesh) or in the original Greek -"heterosarkos" - was referring to angels. It had nothing to do with homosexuals. You are reading that into it. There is no evidence in the Bible that the people in the story of Sodom were homosexuals. Male rape was a common method of humiliating strangers. (think prisons) Perhaps you could research Ezekiel to find out what the real sins of Sodom were. Perhaps try a Jewish website, as it was their story and culture. Look up the abrahamic law of hospitality. And for a cross reference, try reading the story of the Levite and his concubine as another exampkle of the law of hospitality. The Levite was similarly threatened by a gang of men. Only in that story, his concubine was offered up to the gang, and she got gang raped all night then torn to pieces. Hardly the actions of homosexual men.
By the way, do you think it's okay for a father to offer up his two young virgin daughters to be gang raped? Apparently God thinks so, as Lot was saved. Interesting how that point is "glossed over". Today that would be seen as an horrendous thing for a father to do.
1 Romans. Paul was writing from Corinth to Rome. Corinth had one of the largest temple to Aphrodite with more than a 1000 temple prostitutes. Rome had similar temples to the local fertility gods and goddesses. Paul was most likely referring to the practices of using sex orgies to worship the fertility gods. Again it is extremely unlikely that Paul was referring to homosexuals as there were common Greek words used in his time for homosexuals. He didn't use them.
Plus, you are also assuming that the women were having sex with other women. Anything other than submissive vaginal sex would have been considered "unnatural" for women - ie women on top, anal sex, women using leather phalluses on men. (other practices used in temples to worship the fertility gods in the 1st century.)
It helps to know something of the culture and languages in which the texts were written. All you are doing is cherry-picking a handful of obscure verses completely out of context and disregarding the fact that those cultures were very very different to 21st century western cultures. People have cherry picked and misused the Bible in the past, and claimed that they know what God wants or doesn't want, and are still doing it - to keep women submissive, or to keep slaves, or to promote polygamy, or to burn innocent women and girls as witches, or to vilify Jews, or to stop blacks from marrying whites etc. What you are doing is no different.
Mike555 - Please forgive the sinful nature and complete ignorance of most of the posters on this thread, and on CD in general. They all seem to forget that you and you alone are perfect in works and worthy of judging others.
I'm just curious. Do you believe in the existence of babies being born with intersex complications, or are they a made by man myth as well. My mother does not. She calls it man made rubbish. She's a lot like you.
And if this condition does truly exist (which, through the existence of many real life cases, the majority of the educated world accepts that it does), is it right for the parents to be allowed to "play god" and determine which sex their child should go with? What if they choose wrong, and he/she drifts the other way in their tendencies?
I'm not gay, nor was I born with intersex complications. But, what I was born with was a brain. And I use it, as God intended, to reach common sense solutions and answers to daily problems. It takes a big man to sit at a keyboard and cut 'n paste scripture all day while trying to tear down peoples lives and self esteem in the process. You have mastered your art skillfully.
Last edited by ditchlights; 10-03-2010 at 07:57 AM..
There's so many things wrong with the Fundamentalists' interpretations of the Bible that you could wreck your life trying to understand it all. Don't worry about others' ignorance. God will straighten them out, eventually.
Meanwhile, I am more concerned that you start giving yourself the love that God has for you JUST as you are. Be happy in knowing that you were created perfectly, just as God intended. Your job is to be the best you you can become. Other people are their jobs, not yours.
Neither the New Testament nor the Old Testament were written in English (obviously). So what you are quoting (completely out of context, I might add) are interpretions by translators. Translators have their own biases.
The word "homosexual" was used in an English translation for the first time in the 1946 Revised Standard Version in 1 Corinthians 6:9.
Prior to that time, 1 Corinthians 6:9 was used to condemn "masturbators" for centuries, not homosexuals. The Greek words "malakoi" and "arsenokoites" were never used to refer to homosexuals in contemporaneous secular Greek texts. If Paul had meant homosexuals, there were other Greek words he could have used to make it clear that's what he meant. But he didn't.
Jude 1:7. "strange flesh" (different flesh) or in the original Greek -"heterosarkos" - was referring to angels. It had nothing to do with homosexuals. You are reading that into it. There is no evidence in the Bible that the people in the story of Sodom were homosexuals. Male rape was a common method of humiliating strangers. (think prisons) Perhaps you could research Ezekiel to find out what the real sins of Sodom were. Perhaps try a Jewish website, as it was their story and culture. Look up the abrahamic law of hospitality. And for a cross reference, try reading the story of the Levite and his concubine as another exampkle of the law of hospitality. The Levite was similarly threatened by a gang of men. Only in that story, his concubine was offered up to the gang, and she got gang raped all night then torn to pieces. Hardly the actions of homosexual men.
By the way, do you think it's okay for a father to offer up his two young virgin daughters to be gang raped? Apparently God thinks so, as Lot was saved. Interesting how that point is "glossed over". Today that would be seen as an horrendous thing for a father to do.
1 Romans. Paul was writing from Corinth to Rome. Corinth had one of the largest temple to Aphrodite with more than a 1000 temple prostitutes. Rome had similar temples to the local fertility gods and goddesses. Paul was most likely referring to the practices of using sex orgies to worship the fertility gods. Again it is extremely unlikely that Paul was referring to homosexuals as there were common Greek words used in his time for homosexuals. He didn't use them.
Plus, you are also assuming that the women were having sex with other women. Anything other than submissive vaginal sex would have been considered "unnatural" for women - ie women on top, anal sex, women using leather phalluses on men. (other practices used in temples to worship the fertility gods in the 1st century.)
It helps to know something of the culture and languages in which the texts were written. All you are doing is cherry-picking a handful of obscure verses completely out of context and disregarding the fact that those cultures were very very different to 21st century western cultures. People have cherry picked and misused the Bible in the past, and claimed that they know what God wants or doesn't want, and are still doing it - to keep women submissive, or to keep slaves, or to promote polygamy, or to burn innocent women and girls as witches, or to vilify Jews, or to stop blacks from marrying whites etc. What you are doing is no different.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ditchlights
Mike555 - Please forgive the sinful nature and complete ignorance of most of the posters on this thread, and on CD in general. They all seem to forget that you and you alone are perfect in works and worthy of judging others.
I'm just curious. Do you believe in the existence of babies being born with intersex complications, or are they a made by man myth as well. My mother does not. She calls it man made rubbish. She's a lot like you.
And if this condition does truly exist (which, through the existence of many real life cases, the majority of the educated world accepts that it does), is it right for the parents to be allowed to "play god" and determine which sex their child should go with? What if they choose wrong, and he/she drifts the other way in their tendencies?
I'm not gay, nor was I born with intersex complications. But, what I was born with was a brain. And I use it, as God intended, to reach common sense solutions and answers to daily problems. It takes a big man to sit at a keyboard and cut 'n paste scripture all day while trying to tear down peoples lives and self esteem in the process. You have mastered your art skillfully.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LookinForMayberry
There's so many things wrong with the Fundamentalists' interpretations of the Bible that you could wreck your life trying to understand it all. Don't worry about others' ignorance. God will straighten them out, eventually.
Meanwhile, I am more concerned that you start giving yourself the love that God has for you JUST as you are. Be happy in knowing that you were created perfectly, just as God intended. Your job is to be the best you you can become. Other people are their jobs, not yours.
There are so many good posts in this thread....I quoted a few but there are many more. I would rep everybody if I could but gotta wait until this afternoon. Great job everyone and it's nice to see such supportive and loving posts. The OP has gotten some fantastic positive feedback that I hope wins out over the negative.
Jesus confirmed in Matthew 19:4 that marriage is between a man and a woman. 'And He answered and said, ''Have you not read, that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE, 5] and said, 'FOR THIS CAUSE A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER, AND SHALL CLEAVE TO HIS WIFE; AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'? 6] Consequently they are no longer two, but one Flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.''
Again, this verse is cherry-picked out of context by so many Christians yet the rest of the story seems to be conveniently ignored by so many.
ie in Matthew 19, Jesus is quoted as saying:
Do not commit adultery.
-Divorce is adultery, yet the highest divorce rates are in the Bible Belt.
Do not bear false testimomy.
-Ahem- You know, like cherry picking the Bible and using verses out of context to judge others or to conveniently ignore ones own sins?
Love your neighbour as yourself
-unless they are different to you? Or gay?
Give up all your money and possessions to the poor.
-How many Christians follow THAT one?
and what about:
"And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life."
So does that mean Jesus approved of a man leaving his wife and children to follow him?
Where does that fit into "traditional family values and marriage" I seem to be hearing so much about lately?
Interesting that many modern English translations leave out "wife" (which is in the earliest translations) Why do you suppose that is?
Neither the New Testament nor the Old Testament were written in English (obviously). So what you are quoting (completely out of context, I might add) are interpretions by translators. Translators have their own biases.
The word "homosexual" was used in an English translation for the first time in the 1946 Revised Standard Version in 1 Corinthians 6:9.
Prior to that time, 1 Corinthians 6:9 was used to condemn "masturbators" for centuries, not homosexuals. The Greek words "malakoi" and "arsenokoites" were never used to refer to homosexuals in contemporaneous secular Greek texts. If Paul had meant homosexuals, there were other Greek words he could have used to make it clear that's what he meant. But he didn't.
Jude 1:7. "strange flesh" (different flesh) or in the original Greek -"heterosarkos" - was referring to angels. It had nothing to do with homosexuals. You are reading that into it. There is no evidence in the Bible that the people in the story of Sodom were homosexuals. Male rape was a common method of humiliating strangers. (think prisons) Perhaps you could research Ezekiel to find out what the real sins of Sodom were. Perhaps try a Jewish website, as it was their story and culture. Look up the abrahamic law of hospitality. And for a cross reference, try reading the story of the Levite and his concubine as another exampkle of the law of hospitality. The Levite was similarly threatened by a gang of men. Only in that story, his concubine was offered up to the gang, and she got gang raped all night then torn to pieces. Hardly the actions of homosexual men.
By the way, do you think it's okay for a father to offer up his two young virgin daughters to be gang raped? Apparently God thinks so, as Lot was saved. Interesting how that point is "glossed over". Today that would be seen as an horrendous thing for a father to do.
1 Romans. Paul was writing from Corinth to Rome. Corinth had one of the largest temple to Aphrodite with more than a 1000 temple prostitutes. Rome had similar temples to the local fertility gods and goddesses. Paul was most likely referring to the practices of using sex orgies to worship the fertility gods. Again it is extremely unlikely that Paul was referring to homosexuals as there were common Greek words used in his time for homosexuals. He didn't use them.
Plus, you are also assuming that the women were having sex with other women. Anything other than submissive vaginal sex would have been considered "unnatural" for women - ie women on top, anal sex, women using leather phalluses on men. (other practices used in temples to worship the fertility gods in the 1st century.)
It helps to know something of the culture and languages in which the texts were written. All you are doing is cherry-picking a handful of obscure verses completely out of context and disregarding the fact that those cultures were very very different to 21st century western cultures. People have cherry picked and misused the Bible in the past, and claimed that they know what God wants or doesn't want, and are still doing it - to keep women submissive, or to keep slaves, or to promote polygamy, or to burn innocent women and girls as witches, or to vilify Jews, or to stop blacks from marrying whites etc. What you are doing is no different.
The Bible is talking about homosexuality.
Romans 1:26] For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural (lesbianism), 27] and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men commiting indecent acts (homosexuality) and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. Here it is plainly stated that men are having sex with other men. That is homosexuality.
Leviticus 18:22 'You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination Again, a male lying with a male is homosexuality.
Genesis 19:5 states that the men of the city wanted to have relations with the men (who were really angels) who were in Lot's house.
In 1 Corinthians 6:9 homosexuality is mentioned along with fornication and adultery, as being a sin.
There is nothing obscure about these or the other passages which declare homosexualtiy to be a sin. And nothing has been taken out of context.
People who choose to practice their lusts in defiance of the word of God, will go to any length to justify their actions.
And whether homosexual sex is one on one, or in temple sex orgies, it is still homosexuality and is forbidden by God.
Again, the passages above say that a man shall not lie with a man. That is homosexuality.
Again, this verse is cherry-picked out of context by so many Christians yet the rest of the story seems to be conveniently ignored by so many.
ie in Matthew 19, Jesus is quoted as saying:
Do not commit adultery.
-Divorce is adultery, yet the highest divorce rates are in the Bible Belt.
Do not bear false testimomy.
-Ahem- You know, like cherry picking the Bible and using verses out of context to judge others or to conveniently ignore ones own sins?
Love your neighbour as yourself
-unless they are different to you? Or gay?
Give up all your money and possessions to the poor.
-How many Christians follow THAT one?
and what about:
"And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life."
So does that mean Jesus approved of a man leaving his wife and children to follow him?
Where does that fit into "traditional family values and marriage" I seem to be hearing so much about lately?
Interesting that many modern English translations leave out "wife" (which is in the earliest translations) Why do you suppose that is?
Marriage is designed by God to be between a man and a woman.
Genesis 2:22 'And the LORD God fashioned into a woman the rib which He had taken from the man, and brought her to the man. 23] And the man said, ''This is now bone of my bones, And flesh of my flesh; She shall be called woman, Because she was taken out of Man.'' 24] For this cause a man shall leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.
Marriage and sex (within marriage) are designed by God to be between a man and a woman. PERIOD. Anything else is a sin against God.
Mike555 - Please forgive the sinful nature and complete ignorance of most of the posters on this thread, and on CD in general. They all seem to forget that you and you alone are perfect in works and worthy of judging others.
I'm just curious. Do you believe in the existence of babies being born with intersex complications, or are they a made by man myth as well. My mother does not. She calls it man made rubbish. She's a lot like you.
And if this condition does truly exist (which, through the existence of many real life cases, the majority of the educated world accepts that it does), is it right for the parents to be allowed to "play god" and determine which sex their child should go with? What if they choose wrong, and he/she drifts the other way in their tendencies?
I'm not gay, nor was I born with intersex complications. But, what I was born with was a brain. And I use it, as God intended, to reach common sense solutions and answers to daily problems. It takes a big man to sit at a keyboard and cut 'n paste scripture all day while trying to tear down peoples lives and self esteem in the process. You have mastered your art skillfully.
I didn't start the thread. I'm simply replying to it. The word of God is clear that homosexuality is a sin.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
