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if i do what god approves of, and stay in his will above my own, forsaking my sinful nature, then i will receive all eternal inheritances that god has promised me...i know i am loved by him as long as i love him with all of my heart...mind...and soul, and live for him and him alone by keeping his commandments. He said, "if you love me, keep my commandments." and i do...and i do.
his love is conditional little bird...the covenant that is between him and those who are his people, has two sides...his and ours. One person can break this covenant by going against the promises made between the two parties...and i can assure you it will not ever be god.
if you have any encouragement from being united with christ, if any comfort from his love, if any fellowship with the spirit, if any tenderness and compassion,then make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being one in spirit and purpose. (philippians 2:1-2).
in his love,
verna.
a person is said to be justified when he is approved of god as free from the guilt of sin and its deserved punishment; and as having that righteousness belonging to him that entitles to the reward of life" (jonathan edwards, 1750).
1 Corinthians 11:19 states: "No doubt there have to be differences among you to show which of you have God's approval."
So I thank God for all of you false teacher's of the gospel...because I know this is to be, in order that God can use you to show who is genuine, approved and accepted by our Father in heaven...and so that we can be recognized by those who are watching, learning and listening...who are seeking God's own heart. It is a test of our love for Him in whom we will listen to...He's watching and listening to every single word...and from who's lips these false words come. Without them (the false teachers), we who teach the truth according to His Word would not be recognized. So carry on false teachers, with the mission set before you, God will have His way...but I truly do pity you come Judgement Day...Matthew 18:7 states: "Woe to the world because of the things that cause people to sin! Such things must come, but woe to the man through whom they come!" I wouldn't want to be you. [And teaching them that they do not have to keep the Ten Commandments is teaching them to sin...for sin is the transgression of the law of God, and the law of God is the Ten Commandments]
2 Peter 2:1 states: "But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them--bringing swift destruction on themselves."
The ONLY! way God knows if you love Him or not is if you live in His will and obey His Commandments. He said, "If you love Me, keep My Commandments."...and He also said, "If you will enter into life, keep My Commandments." This is how you love Him with all of your heart, mind, and soul.
Deuteronomy 13:3 states: "...you must not listen to the words of that prophet or dreamer. The LORD your God is testing you to find out whether you love him with all your heart and with all your soul."
Anyone who teaches other's to sin (to transgress any of His TEN Commandments, INCLUDING! the FOURTH ONE! to keep the Sabbath Holy unto God and do no work) ) is a man of lawlessness and teaches a false word that is contrary to God's Holy Word...you are doomed...
2 Thessalonians 2:3 states: "Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for [that day will not come] until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction." For all the scoffers and mockers [those who deride, reproach, and ridicule] around here...your purpose is for God's glory and good as well. 2 Peter 3:3: "First of all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires [lusts].
1 Timothy 4:1 states: "The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.
James 3:15 states: Such "wisdom" does not come down from heaven but is earthly, unspiritual, of the devil.
This is a shame...and you who teach another gospel should be ashamed and repent of your sins before it is too late for you...and until you do, please, just don't teach...anything.
In Him,
Verna.
To ME, Christ IS my sabbath.
That doesn't mean that I am "teaching others" to do as I do. Each of us will bear his own burden. If I'm wrong, the Lord will show me this. I trust He will, because I know He loves me, just as much as He loves you.
And I, too, love you Verna! (even if you throw stones a bit much lately..!)
To ME, Christ IS my sabbath.
That doesn't mean that I am "teaching others" to do as I do. Each of us will bear his own burden. If I'm wrong, the Lord will show me this. I trust He will, because I know He loves me, just as much as He loves you.
And I, too, love you Verna! (even if you throw stones a bit much lately..!)
Verna, dear, you and I appear to have something in common. We perhaps have a tendency to take ourselves too seriously. I have a pretty good idea of where that tendency comes from in myself. I spent a good chunk of my life trying to make sure that I WAS approved of and accepted, with no real results. My upbringing, the religious indoctrination I received, and perhaps just my very nature, assured that I was in a constant state of fear that I was really nothing of worth, so if ever I have any sense at all that someone may not be taking me seriously, it stings.
I've come a long way in the last few years, but that tendency is still there and it's one that I have to stay on top of, so I tend to recognize it when it is present in others. Wrongly or rightly, Verna, I discern that same fear in you, that same over-sensitvity. I wish for you that you could take sparrow's post to heart. I know that hearing from me that you are valuable will have no impact on you, but sparrow is a Christian, so perhaps you can hear it from her.
In the meantime, let me assure you, in case it matters to you, that I take you seriously. But I don't take everything you say to heart, because it has the appearance of coming from a place of fear and it certainly attempts to invoke fear in others, a prison I have been in and that I don't choose to go back to.
Okay, you can ignore all the preceding if you wish. This is what I'd like you to hear, if you're willing: My response to your o.p. was a tongue-in-cheek way of pointing out that your fear for your own acceptance is at war with the desire you have to show love for others. Those two things warring within you are always going to create conflicting ideas within your posts, such as the one I pointed out in your o.p.
So God's hearts desire, that His creation accept Him, and His Words of warning to teach His desire is not His "show" of love? Do you think because He wills that we accept His Word, while at the same time warning us of what NOT to do means that He is at war within Himself...? I think not...no...I KNOW not.
That's the problem Pleroo...the fear of God is gone. The only fear I have is the fear of God...this righteous fear keeps me..."God, who is enthroned forever, will hear them and afflict them--Selah men who never change their ways and have no fear of God." (Romans 3:18.)
In Him,
Verna.
Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole [duty] of man. (Ecclestiastes 12:13).
So God's hearts desire, that His creation accept Him, and His Words of warning to teach His desire is not His "show" of love? Do you think because He wills that we accept His Word, while at the same time warning us of what NOT to do means that He is at war within Himself...? I think not...no...I KNOW not.
That's the problem Pleroo...the fear of God is gone. The only fear I have is the fear of God...this righteous fear keeps me..."God, who is enthroned forever, will hear them and afflict them--Selah men who never change their ways and have no fear of God." (Romans 3:18.)
In Him,
Verna.
Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole [duty] of man. (Ecclestiastes 12:13).
Verna, thanks for responding. You know, of course, that I do not believe in God and since we do not share that faith, that can make a discussion like this more difficult for us. I understand that, and appreciate your willingness to pursue the conversation a bit further, at least.
But, I was a sincere Christian for most of my life (and I ain't no spring chicken ) and that has obviously had a huge impact on me. I beleive that I have been able to allow the best of my previously held beliefs inform the beliefs I hold now, while discarding the irrational fear that religion imposed on me.
I always figure I can find common ground with Christians because the Bible says, and you confess, that God is love. When I hear the word "God" my mind processes it as Love, and specifically with the definition of love which is put forward in 1 Cor 13. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, in that description which could engender a fear of God/Love in me. How about you?
Do I believe that Love/God, to the extent that we are able to let It flow in and through us, will produce that which is True and Good? You betcha! It could do nothing else, by it's very nature! But I'm also fully cognizant of the fact that there is much in each of us that blocks that flow. Our own weaknesses, the things that have happened to us, the wrong thinking that has developed in us, etc.
So, while you say that "fear keeps you", I have to disagree. It is God/Love that keeps you. KEEPS you. Not threatens to discard you if you don't live up to a certain standard. Love KEEPS you. Love IN you KEEPS you. Love (patience, kindness .... bearing all things ... enduring all things) is in you, and it is a part of you. That's what brings you to the forum with the desire to warn others of a danger that you perceive to be there.
But fear that Love will discard us blocks that Love from flowing through us, from making us to be like Itself, and finally to be Love to others.
Fear warps the message of what Love really is. Fear keeps us guessing about whether or not Love is really going to KEEP us and when we speak/act out of that fear, there is a conflict. Love and fear just simply cannot co-exist in harmony. When we are speaking from both, there will be a conflict in our message, as I believe there is in yours.
Verna, thanks for responding. You know, of course, that I do not believe in God and since we do not share that faith, that can make a discussion like this more difficult for us. I understand that, and appreciate your willingness to pursue the conversation a bit further, at least.
But, I was a sincere Christian for most of my life (and I ain't no spring chicken ) and that has obviously had a huge impact on me. I beleive that I have been able to allow the best of my previously held beliefs inform the beliefs I hold now, while discarding the irrational fear that religion imposed on me.
I always figure I can find common ground with Christians because the Bible says, and you confess, that God is love. When I hear the word "God" my mind processes it as Love, and specifically with the definition of love which is put forward in 1 Cor 13. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, in that description which could engender a fear of God/Love in me. How about you?
Do I believe that Love/God, to the extent that we are able to let It flow in and through us, will produce that which is True and Good? You betcha! It could do nothing else, by it's very nature! But I'm also fully cognizant of the fact that there is much in each of us that blocks that flow. Our own weaknesses, the things that have happened to us, the wrong thinking that has developed in us, etc.
So, while you say that "fear keeps you", I have to disagree. It is God/Love that keeps you. KEEPS you. Not threatens to discard you if you don't live up to a certain standard. Love KEEPS you. Love IN you KEEPS you. Love (patience, kindness .... bearing all things ... enduring all things) is in you, and it is a part of you. That's what brings you to the forum with the desire to warn others of a danger that you perceive to be there.
But fear that Love will discard us blocks that Love from flowing through us, from making us to be like Itself, and finally to be Love to others.
Fear warps the message of what Love really is. Fear keeps us guessing about whether or not Love is really going to KEEP us and when we speak/act out of that fear, there is a conflict. Love and fear just simply cannot co-exist in harmony. When we are speaking from both, there will be a conflict in our message, as I believe there is in yours.
You and I will just have to agree to disagree Pleroo. Have a wonderful day.
Reverence has been replaced with an outward form of fear:
"Turn, burn, or be annihilated."
It's annihilation that occurs to the wicked, unrepented soul.
...and it is reverential fear of which I am attesting to have for my Awesome Father in heaven. It is why I walk in obedience to His precious Word.
AWE
o: Fear mingled with reverence and wonder, a state of mind inspired by something terrible or sublime.
In the King James Version and the Revised Version (British and American) it occurs in Psalm 4:4: "Stand in awe, and sin not" (where the Revised Version, margin has, "Be ye angry," so Septuagint; compare Ephesians 4:26); Psalm 33:8; Psalm 119:161. In the following passages the Revised Version (British and American) substitutes "stand in awe" for the King James Version "fear": Psalm 22:23 phoboumenoi;
Isaiah 29:231 Samuel 18:15; Malachi 2:5; and in Hebrews 12:28 it substitutes "awe" for the King James Version "reverence" (deos here only in New Testament). In all these passages, except 1 Samuel 18:15 (eulabeito, where it describes Saul's feeling toward David), the word stands for man's attitude of reverential fear toward God. This is the characteristic attitude of the pious soul toward God in the Scriptures, especially in the Old Testament. It arises from a consciousness of the infinite power, sublimity and holiness of God, which fills the mind with the "fear of the Lord," and a dread of violating His law.
D. Miall Edwards 1. (n.) Dread; great fear mingled with respect.
2. (n.) The emotion inspired by something dreadful and sublime; an undefined sense of the dreadful and the sublime; reverential fear, or solemn wonder; profound reverence.
3. (v. t.) To strike with fear and reverence; to inspire with awe; to control by inspiring dread.Awe (32 Occurrences) Matthew 9:8 And the crowds were awe-struck when they saw it, and ascribed the glory to God who had entrusted such power to a man. Matthew 17:6 When the disciples heard it, they fell on their faces, and were very afraid. Matthew 27:54 Now the centurion, and those who were with him watching Jesus, when they saw the earthquake, and the things that were done, feared exceedingly, saying, "Truly this was the Son of God." Mark 4:41 They were greatly afraid, and said to one another, "Who then is this, that even the wind and the sea obey him?" Mark 6:20 for Herod stood in awe of John, knowing him to be an upright and holy man, and he protected him. After listening to him he was in great perplexity, and yet he found a pleasure in listening. Mark 9:6 For he knew not what to say: they were filled with such awe. Luke 1:65 And all who lived round about them were filled with awe, and throughout the hill country of Judaea reports of all these things were spread abroad. Luke 5:26 Amazement took hold on all, and they glorified God. They were filled with fear, saying, "We have seen strange things today."
...and it is very clear by the responses from a few of you, that there is none of this reverential fear or awe to be found in you...thus you do not take heed in His commands...and the Word of God does not quicken you. You rebel against it, and construct your own gospel which is not of THE God of heaven, our Creator.
You and I will just have to agree to disagree Pleroo. Have a wonderful day.
It would be nice to know what it is we're agreeing to disagree about. Do you disagree with what I said about being no spring chicken?
I know it isn't the part about God is love. That's Biblical.
It's not about the 1 Cor. 13 attributes of love, of course, applying to God.
Is it the part about God/love being IN you?
Or that God/love in you produces only good things in you?
Or that God/love keeps you?
Or that love is what brings you to the forum to warn others of what you perceive as a danger to them?
Or is only the last part that you disagree with, that fear of love "discarding" or rejecting us blocks love from working in us and warps the message of love that we wish to share with others?
I'm guessing it's just the last one, in which case, we can agree to agree about everything but that. It's a more "glass half-full" way of looking at it.
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