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Old 09-10-2012, 12:37 AM
 
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Liberation Theology, a kind of socialist based approach to the Bible - is this the way forward and

what are people's views on this?

isn't this what Jesus intended, ie: to help the poor and cut down on greed and avarice?
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Old 09-10-2012, 01:35 AM
 
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No, it's not what Jesus intended at all. Liberation theology started as a Marxist, humanistic doctrine that tried to interpret the scriptures through the plight of the poor. Nowhere in the scriptures can this concept be found.

Catholic bishops started adopting this theology in South America in the 1950's. The wealthy didn't care to part with their money and the poor were encouraged to revolt. But, in the 1980's the Catholic church spoke against this theology (which has deep roots in Roman Catholicism) because of the Marxist leanings and the revolts associated with it.

Sadly, it didn't die there. It moved from the poor peasants of South America to the poor blacks of North America. It's known as the Black Liberation Theology and it's preached in black communities. It's no different. It's the same Marxist, humanistic, revolution-inciting doctrine as it was in South America. It's goal is to stir up that same encouragement to revolt. And it will suffer the same fate as it did in South America. It's a false doctrine with a fancy name dressed up in theology.
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Old 09-10-2012, 01:45 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plain and simple View Post
Catholic bishops started adopting this theology in South America in the 1950's. The wealthy didn't care to part with their money and the poor were encouraged to revolt.
but isn't this a good thing, because from what I know of history, there were a lot of unpleasant dictatorships in South America, ones which really bashed the poor;

and weren't the churches often in league with the elite in those countries?

I know the Bible tends to make out that you should be law-abiding but what if the laws are unjust?
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Old 09-10-2012, 02:33 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Kenneth-Kaunda View Post
but isn't this a good thing, because from what I know of history, there were a lot of unpleasant dictatorships in South America, ones which really bashed the poor;

and weren't the churches often in league with the elite in those countries?

I know the Bible tends to make out that you should be law-abiding but what if the laws are unjust?
If the laws are unjust, you work to change the laws.

Jesus said the poor will always be with us. Yes, we're instructed to show compassion to the poor and needy. Proverbs 14:31 says “whoever is kind to the needy honors God.” The scriptures are full of admonitions to help the poor, needy and infirm. There are blessings that follow it and judgment for those who neglect them.

But not once is the example given for using a Marxist, humanistic approach to do this. Christians are instructed to pray for the poor and to give aid to them, but as individuals and as the body of Christ to come together and reach out to them.

It is never mentioned to develop a political system that forces people to surrender their money and goods to help the poor. It's an individual choice for each person to decide what they will, or won't, do to help them. There's also no mention of working to make all the poor and needy on the same financial level as everyone else, which is what Liberation Theology is about. Some people are poor because they are lazy, refuse to work, and purposely rely on the government for aid and on the kindness of others. These people (and there are MANY) are in sin and a burden on others.

2 Thessalonians 3:7-12 says, "For you yourselves know how you ought to follow us, for we were not disorderly among you; nor did we eat anyone’s bread free of charge, but worked with labor and toil night and day, that we might not be a burden to any of you, not because we do not have authority, but to make ourselves an example of how you should follow us.

For even when we were with you, we commanded you this: If anyone will not work, neither shall he eat. For we hear that there are some who walk among you in a disorderly manner, not working at all, but are busybodies. Now those who are such we command and exhort through our Lord Jesus Christ that they work in quietness and eat their own bread.


Proverbs 10:4 says, "Lazy hands make a man poor, but diligent hands bring wealth."


Proverbs 6:9-11 says, "How long will you lie there, you sluggard? When will you get up from your sleep? A little sleep, a little slumber, a little folding of the hands to rest -- and poverty will come on you like a bandit and scarcity like an armed man."


1 Timothy 5:8 says, "But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel."


These people, the one's who are lazy and won't work... would they be included in the Liberation Theology plan?
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Old 09-10-2012, 02:43 AM
 
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ok, I can see already that it will be hard to keep religion and politics separate here.

but when we are talking about laws, it is not always so easy to change them.

How about the oft given example of Hitler - were people supposed to follow his laws simply because he was in charge?

Obviously, those that are in charge tend to make the laws - ones that will inevitably suit them.

so how can a whole system be changed if it is rotten to the core, as in many parts of South America in the recent past?

and to stay on topic, what I really mean to ask is 'how will Biblical teaching deal with this issue?'
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Old 09-10-2012, 03:00 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenneth-Kaunda View Post
ok, I can see already that it will be hard to keep religion and politics separate here.

but when we are talking about laws, it is not always so easy to change them.

How about the oft given example of Hitler - were people supposed to follow his laws simply because he was in charge?

Obviously, those that are in charge tend to make the laws - ones that will inevitably suit them.

so how can a whole system be changed if it is rotten to the core, as in many parts of South America in the recent past?

and to stay on topic, what I really mean to ask is 'how will Biblical teaching deal with this issue?'
I don't think it's possible to keep politics out of this topic. A strictly biblical answer is what I've already said -- Liberation Theology is not scriptural. It takes the scriptures regarding helping the poor and twists them in order to give "authority" to the man-made, marxist, humanistic, unbiblical concept.

Politically, even though the laws are hard to change, it's the only recourse. The Bible is clear that we must obey the laws of our governing authorities unless they are in direct conflict with God's laws.

Romans 13:1-7 -- "Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience."
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Old 09-10-2012, 04:28 AM
 
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so what do we do about people like Hitler:

were all the allies sinning when they fought against him?
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Old 09-10-2012, 04:53 AM
 
Location: Deepest Darkest NZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plain and simple View Post
No, it's not what Jesus intended at all. Liberation theology started as a Marxist, humanistic doctrine that tried to interpret the scriptures through the plight of the poor. Nowhere in the scriptures can this concept be found.

Catholic bishops started adopting this theology in South America in the 1950's. The wealthy didn't care to part with their money and the poor were encouraged to revolt. But, in the 1980's the Catholic church spoke against this theology (which has deep roots in Roman Catholicism) because of the Marxist leanings and the revolts associated with it.

Sadly, it didn't die there. It moved from the poor peasants of South America to the poor blacks of North America. It's known as the Black Liberation Theology and it's preached in black communities. It's no different. It's the same Marxist, humanistic, revolution-inciting doctrine as it was in South America. It's goal is to stir up that same encouragement to revolt. And it will suffer the same fate as it did in South America. It's a false doctrine with a fancy name dressed up in theology.
" . . .But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne.
32 "All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats;
33 and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.
34 "Then the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.
35 'For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in;
36 naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.'
37 "Then the righteous will answer Him, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink?
38 'And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You?
39 'When did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?'
40 "The King will answer and say to them, 'Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.' . . ."

Liberation theology is about the fact that God expects those of us who are well-off to look out for our neighbours who are not. Read Amos, Hosea and Joel then get back to me, also consider the witness of the early Church in Jerusalem.
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Old 09-10-2012, 07:08 AM
 
Location: Northern Wisconsin
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liberation theology. The only thing it will liberate you of is your eternal life. (Road to hell) Bible is not about reforming this world but salvation from it. Jesus never taught any rebellion against govt. Paul clearly teaches against it. Rom 13
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Old 09-10-2012, 07:30 AM
 
Location: Florida
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Heroes:
Karl Marx ???

...so you're a Socialist...and a Marxist...and whatever else... no thank you I make it a point to do all I possibly can to keep my life and beliefs far, far away from those with these characteristics .


Keep it in Asia.


America is a free people, and we plan on keeping it that way...thank God.


Good day sir.
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