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There are a lot of people who mistakenly believe the United States was founded in order to practice religious freedom. But history tells a different story. It appears to have been founded so that religious sects could practice intolerance toward other religious sects---and it happened frequently. Protestants against Catholics, Catholics and Protestants against Jews, Puritans against the Quakers--and on and on.
In certain parts of early America the only ones allowed to vote were Puritans. That doesn't appear to be religious freedom. In fact, Puritans routinely rounded up Quakers for rigged trials and even executed a few.
The fact is when President Obama extolled the virtue of religious freedom by defending an Islamic center near Ground Zero in New York four years ago, he was inadvertently paying homage to a vision touted by politicians and preachers for more than two centuries--that America has always been the home of religious tolerance.
The earliest record of religious intolerance occurred even before the Mayflower arrived with their own brand of intolerance. The French Huguenots (Protestant) came to America in search of religious freedom and founded a colony in 1564 at Fort Caroline (near Jacksonville, Florida). The Spanish had other ideas. In 1565, they established a forward operating base at St. Augustine and proceeded to wipe out the Fort Caroline colony. The Spanish commander, Pedro Menendez de Aviles, wrote to Spanish King Philip II that he had "hanged all those we had found in [Fort Caroline] because---they were scattering the odious Lutheran doctrine to these provinces." When hundreds of survivors of a shipwrecked French fleet washed up on the beaches of Florida, they were put to the sword beside a river the Spanish called Matanzas ("slaughters"). In other words, the first encounter between European Christians in America ended in a blood bath. http://www.smithsonianmag.com/histor...ance-61312684/ (October, 2010)
The arrival of Pilgrim Puritans in New England in the early 1600's was indeed a response to persecution these dissenters had experienced in England. But the Puritans themselves did not tolerate opposing religious views. They established a theocracy that accepted no dissent either religious or political.
From its earliest days Puritan Boston banned "Papists," (Catholics) along with others who desired religious freedom. Indeed, four Quakers were hanged in Boston between 1659 and 1661 for persistently returning to the city.
When George Washington sent Benedict Arnold on a mission to court French Canadian support for the American Revolution in 1775, he cautioned Arnold not to let their religion get in the way. "Prudence, policy and a true Christian Spirit will lead us to look with compassion upon their errors, without insulting them," he told Arnold. After Arnold betrayed the American cause, he publicly cited American's alliance with Catholic France as one of his reasons for doing so.
There are many other interesting examples of religious intolerance including riots, murders, executions, banishment, that simply plague our early history.
The problem is not resolved even today as fundamentalists are attempting to return to a theocracy that tells us what religious viewpoints to teach in schools, how civil authorities should view marriage, why the "religious" freedom to be intolerant toward groups they do not like is perfectly acceptable (and even "godly") and that intolerance of their freedom to be intolerant is itself a "crime."
Opinion: This kind of religious fanaticism remains probably the greatest internal threat to freedom in the United States today.
What other kinds of historical records can we show about religious intolerance in America and how it lessened us as a people? Are there any forms of religious intolerance that have a positive influence? (and please show documentation, preferably in the form of data)
Last edited by Wardendresden; 02-13-2015 at 06:10 PM..
There are a lot of people who mistakenly believe the United States was founded in order to practice religious freedom. But history tells a different story. It appears to have been founded so that religious sects could practice intolerance toward other religious sects---and it happened frequently. Protestants against Catholics, Catholics and Protestants against Jews, Puritans against the Quakers--and on and on.
In certain parts of early America the only ones allowed to vote were Puritans. That doesn't appear to be religious freedom. In fact, Puritans routinely rounded up Quakers for rigged trials and even executed a few.
The fact is when President Obama extolled the virtue of religious freedom by defending an Islamic center near Ground Zero in New York four years ago, he was inadvertently paying homage to a vision touted by politicians and preachers for more than two centuries--that America has always been the home of religious tolerance.
The earliest record of religious intolerance occurred even before the Mayflower arrived with their own brand of intolerance. The French Huguenots (Protestant) came to America in search of religious freedom and founded a colony in 1564 at Fort Caroline (near Jacksonville, Florida). The Spanish had other ideas. In 1565, they established a forward operating base at St. Augustine and proceeded to wipe out the Fort Caroline colony. The Spanish commander, Pedro Menendez de Aviles, wrote to Spanish King Philip II that he had "hanged all those we had found in [Fort Caroline] because---they were scattering the odious Lutheran doctrine to these provinces." When hundreds of survivors of a shipwrecked French fleet washed up on the beaches of Florida, they were put to the sword beside a river the Spanish called Matanzas ("slaughters"). In other words, the first encounter between European Christians in America ended in a blood bath. History, Travel, Arts, Science, People, Places | Smithsonian (October, 2010)
The arrival of Pilgrim Puritans in New England in the early 1600's was indeed a response to persecution these dissenters had experienced in England. But the Puritans themselves did not tolerate opposing religious views. They established a theocracy that accepted no dissent either religious or political.
From its earliest days Puritan Boston banned "Papists," (Catholics) along with others who desired religious freedom. Indeed, four Quakers were hanged in Boston between 1659 and 1661 for persistently returning to the city.
When George Washington sent Benedict Arnold on a mission to court French Canadian support for the American Revolution in 1775, he cautioned Arnold not to let their religion get in the way. "Prudence, policy and a true Christian Spirit will lead us to look with compassion upon their errors, without insulting them," he told Arnold. After Arnold betrayed the American cause, he publicly cited American's alliance with Catholic France as one of his reasons for doing so.
There are many other interesting examples of religious intolerance including riots, murders, executions, banishment, that simply plague our early history.
The problem is not resolved even today as fundamentalists are attempting to return to a theocracy that tells us what religious viewpoints to teach in schools, how civil authorities should view marriage, why the "religious" freedom to be intolerant toward groups they do not like is perfectly acceptable (and even "godly") and that intolerance of their freedom to be intolerant is itself a "crime."
Opinion: This kind of religious fanaticism remains probably the greatest threat internal threat to freedom in the United States today.
What other kinds of historical records can we show about religious intolerance in America and how it lessened us as a people? Are there any forms of religious intolerance that have a positive influence? (and please show documentation, preferably in the form of data)
You are mixing early colonial history with American history after the revolution.
The Nation included the guarantee of religious freedom. Prior to that we saw a lot of prejudice from the Salem Witch trials and so forth.
Laws may have changed but people haven't. The same types of Bigots exist in Churches today, the laws just limit their actions to vocal activities.
What other kinds of historical records can we show about religious intolerance in America and how it lessened us as a people? Are there any forms of religious intolerance that have a positive influence? (and please show documentation, preferably in the form of data)
One glaring one is the intolerance toward native American faith exemplified in the San Carlos School and in the California Missions. Sorry, I'm about to climb into the bathtub, but there are a lot of people who can supply particulars.
One glaring one is the intolerance toward native American faith exemplified in the San Carlos School and in the California Missions. Sorry, I'm about to climb into the bathtub, but there are a lot of people who can supply particulars.
But that was prior to the joining of CA to the USA I do believe.
America was founded by Norse and Hebrew Humanist aristocrats, who were ABOVE religion. They HATED religion, and saw it as the wellspring of evil in the world.
I wish the founding fathers had phrased it as "freedom FROM the imposition of religion".
You are mixing early colonial history with American history after the revolution.
The Nation included the guarantee of religious freedom. Prior to that we saw a lot of prejudice from the Salem Witch trials and so forth.
Laws may have changed but people haven't. The same types of Bigots exist in Churches today, the laws just limit their actions to vocal activities.
Actually religious intolerance extended well beyond the colonial period of America.
In the early 1800's a man named Joseph Smith founded a new religion that we call Mormonism or Latter Day Saints. It infuriated Protestants. In 1832, a mob tarred and feathered him, marking the beginning of a long battle between Christian America and Smith’s Mormonism. In October 1838, after a series of conflicts over land and religious tension, Missouri Governor Lilburn Boggs ordered that all Mormons be expelled from his state. Three days later, rogue militiamen massacred 17 church members, including children, at the Mormon settlement of Haun’s Mill. In 1844, a mob murdered Joseph Smith and his brother Hyrum while they were jailed in Carthage, Illinois. No one was ever convicted of the crime.
The belief widely held and preached by some of the most prominent ministers in America was that Catholics would, if permitted, turn America over to the pope. Anti-Catholic venom was part of the typical American school day, along with Bible readings. In Massachusetts, a convent—coincidentally near the site of the Bunker Hill Monument—was burned to the ground in 1834 by an anti-Catholic mob incited by reports that young women were being abused in the convent school. In Philadelphia, the City of Brotherly Love, anti-Catholic sentiment, combined with the country’s anti-immigrant mood, fueled the Bible Riots of 1844, in which houses were torched, two Catholic churches were destroyed and at least 20 people were killed.
Even as late as 1960, Catholic presidential candidate John F. Kennedy felt compelled to make a major speech declaring that his loyalty was to America, not the pope. (And as recently as the 2008 Republican primary campaign, Mormon candidate Mitt Romney felt compelled to address the suspicions still directed toward the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.) Of course, America’s anti-Semitism was practiced institutionally as well as socially for decades.
We're all evil... the cause of all that's wrong in America. Got it.
Does this mean you are equating us with ISIS... or are they are lower tier threat?
The difference between ISIS fundamentalists and American Christian fundamentalists is that the ISIS group is in the Mideast with an occasional foray into Europe.
American fundamentalists are all around us, so, yes, I see more danger to freedom, if not life, from American fundamentalists.
The difference between ISIS fundamentalists and American Christian fundamentalists is that the ISIS group is in the Mideast with an occasional foray into Europe.
American fundamentalists are all around us, so, yes, I see more danger to freedom, if not life, from American fundamentalists.
I know.
It's amazing you admit this plainly.
So what's the threat from us? What's our gameplan to destroy America?
Since absolutely none of these were the motivation and founding principles of the creation of the United States and its constitution, I dont see how those motivations and beliefs can be considered the origins of the United States or it's present theocratic composition.
People have always been a mix of various theologies and anti-theologists with a multitude of goals and ambitions. We have never been a unified mindset at any point in our history.
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