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And then, there is always the possibility that these cities never actually existed in reality?
By the way, I DO like your use of 'Sodomese' that I invented. The reason being is that 'sodomite' was not an inhabitant of Sodom (even though this term is regularly, and quite naturally, used to identify them) but rather a shrine temple prostitute.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC
The fact that the word "sodomy" is in our lexicon probably lends to the fact that Sodom existed.
Better yet, the actual word "Sodom" is in the Bible ...why do you need 'sodomy' to lend to the fact that Sodom existed? This is not to mention the fact that 'sodomy' is found NOWHERE in the Bible, so I don't know which corrupt Lexicon you're using.
Howdy neighbors. *Sigh* ...I'm at a loss as to why the church leadership within mainstream Christianity still persists in preaching to its flock that Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed because of the 'grave sin' of homosexuality.
Years ago I participated in a church Bible study on the subject of S&G. We were advised by the leader of the group study to clear our minds of any preconceived notions that we might have pertaining to their destruction, i.e. the popular teaching that they were destroyed because of rampant homosexuality. And, I'm sure glad that we did go into this study with an open mind. We found nothing to indicate that the inhabitants of Sodom and Gomorrah were homosexual ...NOTHING!
But, this left us to wondering how others had somehow read and continued to read such a falsehood into the story of S&G. "Others" involves scholars of theology and includes many well-known personalities today such as Michael Brown and James White ...both of whom possess theological doctorates as well as their having several anti-gay presentations on YouTube in which, I believe, S&G are referenced.
Ezekiel gives us the actual reason/s why Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed (Ezekiel 16:49-50) and NOWHERE mentions homosexuality. Jesus (Matthew 10:14-15) equates the lack of hospitality to strangers with the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah. Again, no mention of homosexuality. And, as already mentioned, there is no mention of homosexuality anywhere in the ACTUAL account in Genesis.
So, where does this falsehood come from and why do preachers persist in preaching the glaring lie to their congregation that S&G were destroyed because of homosexuality? I'll quickly mention that the intended rape of the angels visiting Lot by the inhabitants of Sodom has nothing to do with God's plan to destroy the cities. This is not to mention, of course, that Gomorrah had nothing to do with this part of the story but was also destroyed.
Please, discuss.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesus'Truth
You go back a long way, Romulus. Congratulations for that. As for you saying Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed for not being hospitable to strangers is beyond outrageous.
How are your reading skills coming along J'T? "I" did not say that Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed because of inhospitality toward strangers ...I said that JESUS made this remark!
Got your Bible handy? Here is Jesus' remark as found in Matthew 10:14-15:
14 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.
15 Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.
Did Jesus just say something beyond outrageous? Then I suggest that you take it up with Him, not me.
This is Ezekiel's explanation for the demise of Sodom. It's found in Ezekiel 16:49-50:
Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.
50 And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good.
Do you have anything to say that may be of some relevant value to the discussion?
Better yet, the actual word "Sodom" is in the Bible ...why do you need 'sodomy' to lend to the fact that Sodom existed? This is not to mention the fact that 'sodomy' is found NOWHERE in the Bible, so I don't know which corrupt Lexicon you're using.
First of all, the Bible does not encapsulate all of human history. I assume you understand that. So just because a word does not appear in the Bible - does not imply that it doesn't exist.
Second - many common words are created from actual events that took place.
The Japanese term ‘kamikaze‘ came into popular usage after World War II when the desperate Japanese forces adopted the audacious tactic of suicide attacks on American warships.
The fact that sodomy is a word actually gives more evidence that the event in Genesis 19 actually happened because regular folk (outside of the Bible) continued to recall the devastation of what happened throughout the remainder of time and created a term for what took place.
First of all, the Bible does not encapsulate all of human history. I assume you understand that. So just because a word does not appear in the Bible - does not imply that it doesn't exist.
Second - many common words are created from actual events that took place.
The Japanese term ‘kamikaze‘ came into popular usage after World War II when the desperate Japanese forces adopted the audacious tactic of suicide attacks on American warships.
The fact that sodomy is a word actually gives more evidence that the event in Genesis 19 actually happened because regular folk (outside of the Bible) continued to recall the devastation of what happened throughout the remainder of time and created a term for what took place.
There are a lot of words that were created out of myths and stories.
The fact that we use the word "echo" doesn't mean that the Goddess "Echo" ever existed.
How are your reading skills coming along J'T? "I" did not say that Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed because of inhospitality toward strangers ...I said that JESUS made this remark!
Got your Bible handy? Here is Jesus' remark as found in Matthew 10:14-15:
14 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.
15 Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.
Did Jesus just say something beyond outrageous? Then I suggest that you take it up with Him, not me.
This is Ezekiel's explanation for the demise of Sodom. It's found in Ezekiel 16:49-50:
Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.
50 And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good.
Do you have anything to say that may be of some relevant value to the discussion?
Not sure how you ever get that you disproved what I said.
There are a lot of words that were created out of myths and stories.
The fact that we use the word "echo" doesn't mean that the Goddess "Echo" ever existed.
So... you are basically saying the Sodom account is a myth, and in effect calling the Lord a liar.
Nice work there, Mr. Christian. Next you will be saying that the Lord Jesus Christ is a myth also.
Jeremiah 49:18 - Like the overthrow of Sodom and Gomorrah with its neighbors,” says the LORD, “no one will live there, nor will a son of man reside in it.
Jeremiah 50:40 - “As when God overthrew Sodom And Gomorrah with its neighbors,” declares the LORD, “No man will live there, Nor will any son of man reside in it.
Amos 4:11 - “I overthrew you, as God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah, And you were like a firebrand snatched from a blaze; Yet you have not returned to Me,” declares the LORD.
Luke 17:22-30 - And He said to the disciples, “The days will come when you will long to see one of the days of the Son of Man, and you will not see it. 23 They will say to you, ‘Look there! Look here!’ Do not go away, and do not run after them. 24 For just like the lightning, when it flashes out of one part of the sky, shines to the other part of the sky, so will the Son of Man be in His day. 25 But first He must suffer many things and be rejected by this generation. 26 And just as it happened in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of Man: 27 they were eating, they were drinking, they were marrying, they were being given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all. 28 It was the same as happened in the days of Lot: they were eating, they were drinking, they were buying, they were selling, they were planting, they were building; 29 but on the day that Lot went out from Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all. 30 It will be just the same on the day that the Son of Man is revealed.
Who are 'the wicked'? Are those whose country of birth has basically exempted them from hearing about Jesus included among 'the wicked'? I could go on and on regarding the term 'wicked' and to whom this term applies.
I hope we can agree that sinner Satan is wicked so the term 'wicked' applies to him.
We find at Jesus' soon coming Glory Time of separation on Earth as found at Matthew 25:31-34 who are included as wicked.
Nothing to do with country of birth.
Every day new people are born. Jesus said the good news of God's kingdom (Daniel 2:44-45) would be proclaimed to the world on a grand or international scale just as it is now being done today - Matthew 24:14
Jesus reads hearts so he will know who is a humble 'sheep' or a haughty 'goat'.
Since Pentecost the Christian congregation No matter where located on Earth is a 'spiritual nation' - 1 Peter 2:9,5.
The majority of mankind has lived and died without hearing about Jesus - John 3:13
In the Resurrection (John 6:40; Acts 24:15) those people (the majority) will have the opportunity to hear and learn about Jesus.
This includes the dead people who are named in chapter 11 of Hebrews.
So... you are basically saying the Sodom account is a myth, and in effect calling the Lord a liar.
Nice work there, Mr. Christian. Next you will be saying that the Lord Jesus Christ is a myth also. .................. Luke 17:22-30 - And He said to the disciples, “The days will come when you will long to see one of the days of the Son of Man, and you will not see it. 23 They will say to you, ‘Look there! Look here!’ Do not go away, and do not run after them. 24 For just like the lightning, when it flashes out of one part of the sky, shines to the other part of the sky, so will the Son of Man be in His day. 25 But first He must suffer many things and be rejected by this generation. 26 And just as it happened in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of Man: 27 they were eating, they were drinking, they were marrying, they were being given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all. 28 It was the same as happened in the days of Lot: they were eating, they were drinking, they were buying, they were selling, they were planting, they were building; 29 but on the day that Lot went out from Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all. 30 It will be just the same on the day that the Son of Man is revealed.
And I find just as the end came hard and swift for Sodom and Gomorrah, and the end came hard and swift in Noah's Day, and the end came hard and swift when un-faithful Jerusalem was destroyed by the Roman armies in the year 70, so the end will also come hard and swift once the great tribulation breaks out ending in the last war Armageddon - Psalms 46:9; Rev. 19:14-15
Not fire and brimstone to destroy the wicked but rather the 'sword-like executional words from Jesus' mouth ' will rid the Earth of the wicked - Isaiah 11:3-4.
Then, Jesus as King of God's Kingdom (Dan.2:44-45) will usher in global Peace on Earth among persons of goodwill.
Chances are, the 2 angels who visited Lot, 'took on' human bodies.
They either 'temporarily possessed' 2 human men (harmlessly I might add) and then released them when they were done...
Or the angels were able to materialize a human looking 'shell', they could use to go undetected...............!)
Just as resurrected Jesus used materialized human bodies to appear to his followers so they would recognize him (Luke 24:13-43) the fallen angels also used materialized human bodies.
In the Flood the demonic angels could No longer materialize, their hybrid bully offspring just drowned.
Those disobedient angels were no longer able to materialize in human bodies.
P.S. ALL angels are considered as male. There are No female angels. People do Not become angels.
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Better yet, the actual word "Sodom" is in the Bible ...why do you need 'sodomy' to lend to the fact that Sodom existed? This is not to mention the fact that 'sodomy' is found NOWHERE in the Bible, so I don't know which corrupt Lexicon you're using. 
