Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Hi Electron,
I am curious why you believe that since Satan has to be locked up during the millennial reign of Christ and righteousness is to cover the earth and the twelve apostles are to reign over the 12 tribes of Israel during that time AND during that time the believers of the nations are not even on the earth but are with Christ among the celestials.
How can Christ be on the earth and among the celestials at the same time? It has to do with flesh and spirit.
In flesh Christ will be on the earth while at the same time we will be with Him in spirit among the celestials.
I don't believe in second chances or even first chances. God doesn't save by chance but by choice, His choice of us before the disruption.
One last point, prior to His return--besides all the horrendous events which must take place as revealed in Matthew 24--there must also be a word-wide catastrophic earthquake in which the cities of the nations fall (see Rev.16:18,19) which has never happened.
Revelation 20
I believe that the binding of Satan happened at the cross. He is bound from deceiving the nations only, not carrying on with other wickedness. I believe the millennial reign of Christ to be a symbolic thousand years, not a literal period with a parade and inauguration He's only coming back one more time, and that is to bring in the new heaven and new earth. There is no rapture. If you die before he comes back, you go to heaven and return with Him. If you are alive when He comes back, you are changed, from corruptible to incorruptible. Then there is judgment.
The twelve tribes is symbolic of all believers. 144,000= 12 x 12 x 1,000.......a great multitude.
There are four primary eschatological views, mine is Amillenialism, already, not yet.
I really don't concern myself with who resides in Israel today for that is of no consequence to the present dispensation of Grace nor of my salvation which I believe you mentioned.
I replied to this quote of yours: "The point is, we are not being blessed and brought to God through them today as was the case in the previous dispensation, and will be again in the next dispensation."
The post I made was in response to that.
Are you now disowning that statement or would you like to expound on it ?
I replied to this quote of yours: "The point is, we are not being blessed and brought to God through them today as was the case in the previous dispensation, and will be again in the next dispensation."
The post I made was in response to that.
Are you now disowning that statement or would you like to expound on it ?
Why disown it? They are not a player in the process. My statements are in line with each other. Not sure what you think I mean but I simply mean Israel is not part of the process today and whom ever is in the land today is of no consequence to us. Even what you said would be in line with what I said if true. What else could I expound upon? I mean, a non issue is a non issue!
The whole idea of Dispensationalism justifies many traditional Christian teachings, such as belief in the Trinity. He didn't "dispense" of knowledge of the Trinity until a certain time in history.
The fact that Christians (or anyone) didn't believe in something in the past, doesn't matter. Because God chose not to reveal it to us until later! Isn't that wonderful! Praise Jesus!
So you see, whatever most Christians believe in at this moment is exactly what the truth must be. So they can contradict themselves because of Dispensationalism.
For some reason people want to look at scripture which was given over several thousand years as if it all applies at the same time. However if one reads the bible they should be able to see that God changed things more than once. Before God called Abram there were no Hebrews. Before God gave the Law and commandments there were no Law and commandments. Before God sent the Christ there was no perfect sacrifice. Before God revealed the mystery through Paul it was not known. And we know there will be future changes.
Really? As if he reports to you? Or me? So when Jesus said in Mark 1, "Repent and believe the Gospel, for the Kingdom of God is at hand" are you saying he should have followed up on that? Maybe with a "C'mon guys, I'm supposed to be the king!" Remember that his is not a failed earthly kingdom. we are only passing through here. Just because things aren't perfect in your little sphere doesn't mean that Christ is not ruling. Why do you hold Him to a higher standard than you hold yourself? He rules and reigns to glorify the creator, not the creature.
If satan is bound as you stated in another post, and Jesus is currently reining, I am really disappointed in Him. If this is the best Jesus can do without competition from satan he is wasting his time it seems. I just don't see how that can be the case.
If satan is bound as you stated in another post, and Jesus is currently reining, I am really disappointed in Him. If this is the best Jesus can do without competition from satan he is wasting his time it seems. I just don't see how that can be the case.
I understand, but I disagree. Jesus himself said we would face trials and persecution. The typical question goes something like this: "If God is so good and so powerful, then why does bad stuff happen to good people?" Fair enough, but I think it's the wrong question. I think the right question goes more like this: "How could a holy and righteous God know my every thought, word, and deed.... and still let me live through the night?" The short answer is because of God's mercy. He is patient, as in 2 Peter 3:9 that states: "The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance."
And remember, Satan is bound only from deceiving the nations. The Gospel has reached almost every corner of the planet.
That's what I never, ever understood. If John is our brother and companion in tribulation, and if the Almighty would allow his own son to be tortured and killed, then who are we to get an early dismissal pass and escape tribulation by means of some sort of rapture?
The Tribulation is seen as God pouring his wrath out on the world. Romans 8:1 states that there is no condemnation for those in Chrsit -- so if we are in Christ, we are not children of wrath...so the idea is that we are removed from the Earth prior to it.
Notice...nowhere does it say that we won't face hardships, or even outright persecution, but the Tribulation is different -- it isn't just men persecuting Christians...it's God punishing the world. Christians don't need to face that.
Why disown it? They are not a player in the process. My statements are in line with each other. Not sure what you think I mean but I simply mean Israel is not part of the process today and whom ever is in the land today is of no consequence to us. Even what you said would be in line with what I said if true. What else could I expound upon? I mean, a non issue is a non issue!
Since you're denying that my replies addressed this sentence of yours, obviously
I misunderstood the sentence ? So can you explain it to me ?
Sentence:
The point is, we are not being blessed and brought to God through them (the Jews)
today as was the case in the previous dispensation, and will be again in the next dispensation. //www.city-data.com/forum/42948067-post6.html
Specifically how was "the previous dispensation" a Jewish one, and how again will
the next "dispensation" be Jewish ?
The Tribulation is seen as God pouring his wrath out on the world. Romans 8:1 states that there is no condemnation for those in Chrsit -- so if we are in Christ, we are not children of wrath...so the idea is that we are removed from the Earth prior to it.
Notice...nowhere does it say that we won't face hardships, or even outright persecution, but the Tribulation is different -- it isn't just men persecuting Christians...it's God punishing the world. Christians don't need to face that.
I'm tracking. I get what you're saying, just can't accept it. No condemnation in Romans 8:1 I believe refers to eternal condemnation in hell. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't remember seeing it mentioned anywhere other than Revelation 1 the specific phrase 'the tribulation'...and it's not capitalized. Maybe splitting hairs....I will look at my notes and stuff tonight and get back with on the subject.
But this I am sure we agree on: Jesus is coming back
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
He's only coming back one more time, and that is to bring in the new heaven and new earth. There is no rapture. If you die before he comes back, you go to heaven and return with Him. If you are alive when He comes back, you are changed, from corruptible to incorruptible. Then there is judgment.
