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Old 12-05-2016, 07:23 PM
 
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In these verses isn't Jesus saying the kingdom of heaven is here, on earth, not somewhere in the sky?


Matthew 18:4 NRS

" Whoever becomes humble like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven."

Here He is not saying that those who become humble like a child will be greatest in the kingdom of heaven but that they ARE the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 4:17 NRS

From that time Jesus began to proclaim, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven has come near."

Here Jesus is saying the kingdom of heaven has come. In other words, He is the kingdom of heaven along with His followers.

Could it be?
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Old 12-05-2016, 07:30 PM
 
9,588 posts, read 5,056,770 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peacegiver View Post
In these verses isn't Jesus saying the kingdom of heaven is here, on earth, not somewhere in the sky?


Matthew 18:4 NRS

" Whoever becomes humble like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven."

Here He is not saying that those who become humble like a child will be greatest in the kingdom of heaven but that they ARE the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 4:17 NRS

From that time Jesus began to proclaim, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven has come near."

Here Jesus is saying the kingdom of heaven has come. In other words, He is the kingdom of heaven along with His followers.

Could it be?

Why yes, Peacegiver, I believe He IS. Peace
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Old 12-05-2016, 07:42 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Rbbi1 View Post
Why yes, Peacegiver, I believe He IS. Peace
Agreed
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Old 12-05-2016, 09:57 PM
 
Location: Arizona
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Heaven’s not a place; it’s the moment in life, when you feel alive.
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Old 12-05-2016, 10:13 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
Heaven’s not a place; it’s the moment in life, when you feel alive.
Only because you haven't seen it.

No one can SEE the kingdom of God unless they are born from above.
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Old 12-05-2016, 10:30 PM
 
63,923 posts, read 40,194,112 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peacegiver View Post
No one can SEE the kingdom of God unless they are born from above.
So, are you like the wind???
That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again ("born from above")
8The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
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Old 12-06-2016, 02:21 AM
 
Location: Olam Haba
619 posts, read 312,505 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
So, are you like the wind???
That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again ("born from above")
8The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
That's debatable but simply not debated much anymore in the mainstream. However the old debate was never settled, (rather one view has simply become predominant as in most things). Both pneuma and ruach can mean either spirit or wind. Young's shows the alternative position:

John 3:8 YLT (Young's Literal Bible Translation)
8 the Spirit where he willeth doth blow, and his voice thou dost hear, but thou hast not known whence he cometh, and whither he goeth; thus is every one who hath been born of the Spirit.'


That is not to say that one way has to be right and one way must be wrong but rather, the point is, your statement, "So, are you like the wind???", someone of the alternative reading could reply back with, "So, are you like the Spirit???", and which one sounds more correct? For so is everyone who is born of the Spirit, like the Spirit.
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Old 12-06-2016, 03:29 AM
 
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In Acts 1:7-11...............Jesus said ``It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by His own authority . but you will receive power when the Holy spirit comes on you , and you will be my witness in Jerusalem , and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth ...........After Jesus said this , He was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight .......They were looking intently up into the sky as He was going , when suddenly two men dressed in white stood beside them ``Men of Galilee`` they said ``Why do you stand here looking into the sky ? This same Jesus who has been taken from you into heaven , will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven ``..................See here is Jesus going into the presence of God into heaven , which is off the earth in the Spirit with substance ...............Still Holy Spirit abides in Gods children in the earth , as Holy spirit is of heaven, and Jesus does visit some people of His greater calling for His works but is rare ....
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Old 12-06-2016, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Southwestern, USA, now.
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I think second graders might think the Kingdom of Heaven is in the sky...
not people that are old enough to know how to type here.
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Old 12-06-2016, 10:05 AM
 
19,942 posts, read 17,219,937 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade View Post
Heaven’s not a place; it’s the moment in life, when you feel alive.
Actually...it IS a place. That is clear in Scripture.

But when Jesus uses the phrase "Kingdom of Heaven", he is not referring to a place specifically. He's referring to all that which God controls.
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