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Jesus said that after he was gone he would send a Helper. The Holy Spirit.
Now that we have the Helper, why would we still need a Bible?
Is the fact that a person "needs" a Bible proof that he does not know God? Is he committing blasphemy against the Holy Spirit?
This is my interpretation after reading the entire Bible. That is one of the central messages of the Bible. This is what a person understands intuitively BEFORE hearing about "scriptures" written by man. After reading the scriptures, the only conclusion he can make is that he can go back to where was before, spiritually, when he understood intuitively that the God of the universe was able to communicate directly to people without the use of "scriptures".
Jesus said that after he was gone he would send a Helper. The Holy Spirit.
Now that we have the Helper, why would we still need a Bible?
Is the fact that a person "needs" a Bible proof that he does not know God? Is he committing blasphemy against the Holy Spirit?
This is my interpretation after reading the entire Bible. That is one of the central messages of the Bible. This is what a person understands intuitively BEFORE hearing about "scriptures" written by man. After reading the scriptures, the only conclusion he can make is that he can go back to where was before, spiritually, when he understood intuitively that the God of the universe was able to communicate directly to people without the use of "scriptures".
This is entirely bogus and unsubstantiated. It is IMPERATIVE that the ENTIRE BIBLE be read and constantly studied. Otherwise one will be led astray by the vagaries of one's own wandering imagination.
Jesus often read from Torah and Tanakh (Law & prophets) during worship services in synagogues. On at least one occasion He also read a prophecy that referred to His own appearance in the world. He also referred to the Law & Prophets during many of His sermons debates and statements. This implies a deep knowledge of scripture and its true intent. It tells us that He read it thoroughly. If its good enough for the Son of God it ought also be good for us.
Paul's letters to Timothy advocated study of scriptures rather than a simple quick read of them. If its good enough for the founding fathers of the Christian faith, then it ought to be good enough for us.
The book of Proverbs states in many places that wisdom comes from study and attention paid to advice to avoid as much as possible entanglements that result from the foolish attitude that one knows better than the Word of God. If study of scripture was good enough for Solomon, then it ought to be good enough for us.
The books of Thessalonians as well as Ecclesiastes also state that study of the Word of God is essential for knowledge and understanding of God's purposes and expectations. If it was good enough for the prophets and leaders of old, then it remains good enough for those of us who struggle with the lies and dilutions of true faith and knowledge today.
"Yet your fellow citizens say, 'The way of the Lord is not right', when it is their own way that is not right." - Ezekiel 33:17
"This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. For men shall be lovers of their own selves..." - 2 Timothy 3:1-2a
A primary attack upon true religion in these last days has been an attack upon the Word of God. Know that such attacks will not stand - either before God or in history.
that's me, hollering from the choir loft...
Last edited by Choir Loft; 02-15-2018 at 07:04 AM..
The writers of the Scriptures would disagree with the OP's claim that the Bible isn't necessary. The Scriptures were written under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. The apostle Paul states both the source and the reason for the Bible in 2 Timothy 3:15-17.
2 Tim. 3:15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16] All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, 17] so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.
The writers of the Scriptures wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. The Scriptures were given so that, according to Paul, the man of God may be complete, capable, proficient, fully equipped for every good work.
The OP asks, ''Now that we have the Helper, why would we still need a Bible?'' The question ignores the fact that the New Testament was written after the Helper, the Holy Spirit had been sent, by men who wrote under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
The New Testament letters were written by the apostles and by men closely associated with the apostles for the purpose of providing instruction to the churches. Obviously, the fact that the Church-age believer is indwelt by the Holy Spirit is in itself not the only thing the believer needs in order to grow spiritually and to execute the Christian way of life.
If the indwelling Holy Spirit was the only thing the believer needed, God would not have provided the spiritual gifts of apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, for the building up of the body of Christ until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man as stated in Ephesians 4:11-15.
Despite the fact that the church-age believer has the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, God also provided the spiritual gifts mentioned in Ephesians 4:11. He also provided the Scriptures. The spiritual gift of apostleship in the sense of the original apostles ended with the death of John who was the last of the apostles originally appointed by Jesus. But the New Testament letters contain and preserve their teachings to the church.
The writer of Hebrews, writing to his audience, tells them that while they themselves should have been teachers, they instead needed to again be taught the elementary principles of the oracles of God. Though they should have by that time been mature believers capable of teaching the word, they instead were in need of milk and not solid food, because they were infants spiritually. See Hebrews 5:12-14.
Spirituality in the church-age is designed to incorporate the indwelling Holy Spirit, the various spiritual gifts, and the Scriptures as a complete package for the growth of the Church. The Scriptures contain information that we simply would not have if they didn't exist including a record of Jesus' teachings.
One final note is that despite the fact that God has provided the Holy Spirit, the various spiritual gifts, and the scriptures, the church is still wildly divided on certain issues and beliefs. And it will continue to be.
When the NT was being written it was not even considered "scripture". Yet it's message was that Jesus was greater than the angels ("scripture" writers) and the Law was practically condemned. It was not right to have the NT considered "scripture".
When the NT was being written it was not even considered "scripture". Yet it's message was that Jesus was greater than the angels ("scripture" writers) and the Law was practically condemned. It was not right to have the NT considered "scripture".
How much clearer can what I said be? And in 2 Peter 3:16, Paul's letters were compared with the rest of the scriptures indicating that his own letters were regarded as scripture.
And the book of Revelation. John said that the Revelation was given to him by Jesus. Surely Scripture!
How much clearer can what I said be? And in 2 Peter 3:16, Paul's letters were compared with the rest of the scriptures indicating that his own letters were regarded as scripture.
And the book of Revelation. John said that the Revelation was given to him by Jesus. Surely Scripture!
2nd Peter has been completely discounted by Biblical scholars as fraudulent. I don't even regard it on the level with 1st Peter. It's probably the most fraudulent book in the New Testament.
2nd Peter has been completely discounted by Biblical scholars as fraudulent. I don't even regard it on the level with 1st Peter. It's probably the most fraudulent book in the New Testament.
No, it has not been completely discounted by Biblical scholars. While it is true that it is the most disputed of the New Testament books, it is disingenuous to say or imply that all scholars completely discount it as fraudulent.
New Testament scholar Daniel Wallace in his introduction to 2 Peter gives both sides of the argument concerning the authorship of second Peter and gives his conclusion:
3. CONCLUSION ON AUTHORSHIP
Although a very strong case has been made against Petrine authorship of 2 Peter, we believe it is deficient. Not only is there very good evidence that this epistle was utilized in the late first and early second century by a variety of writers (as Picirilli has recently pointed out), but the occasion for the letter fits the lifetime of Peter better than later. Further, once some kind of amanuensis hypothesis is seriously taken into consideration (in our view, an amanuensis was used for 1 Peter but probably not for 2 Peter63), then many of the objections against Petrine authorship are found wanting. Taken together, these external and internal arguments strongly suggest the traditional view, viz., that Peter was indeed the author of the second epistle which bears his name.
For the actual arguments you can click on the link and read them.
Additionally, the early church simply did not allow books they knew to be fraudulent into the canon. In view of the fact that 2 Peter was finally admitted into the canon when there were so many Petrine forgeries in existence speaks strongly for the authenticity of 2 Peter. Known Petrine forgeries included the Apocalypse of Peter, the Gospel of Peter, and the Acts of Peter. These were rejected by the church. But 2 Peter was finally recognized as canonical.
And Paul himself stated that what the apostles taught was the word of God. Not the word of man. And this would refer both to what they taught orally as well as what they wrote in their letters.
1 Thessalonians 2:13 For this reason we also constantly thank God that when you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men, but for what it really is, the word of God, which also performs its work in you who believe.
2 Corinthians 10:9 for I do not wish to seem as if I would terrify you by my letters. 10] For they say, "His letters are weighty and strong, but his personal presence is unimpressive and his speech contemptible." 11] Let such a person consider this, that what we are in word by letters when absent, such persons we are also in deed when present.
You not only avoided addressing the fact that I pointed out that John said that the Revelation was given to him by Jesus which makes the book of Revelation scripture. but you also ignored everything I said in post #4.
In Isaiah 55:11 ..God says ......``So will my Word be that goes forth out of my mouth, it will not return to me void , but will accomplish that which I please , and it will prosper in the things where I sent it ``....... See people pray from the Word of God will get God attention , so if people pray without the mind of God Words and use the mind of demon of the earth , then God cannot respond ........Where then if people do not have or know the Words of God in the spirit then Holy spirit cannot help them
The problem is and always has been conflating the Word and the Bible. It is NOT "the Word." It may be a useful tool FOR the"authority" promised by Jesus ads ;long as it is understood that it IS flawed and not to be taken AS authority in its own right.
This has been addressed before.
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