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Heb 8:8, For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
Heb 8:9, Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
Heb 8:10, For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
Predestination is preached in the Gospel of God's Grace !
Next, Paul sets forth Predestination as a blessing of God's Grace, Eph 1:4-5
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
According to the Good pleasure of HIS WILL ! The false teachers of our day, speak that God does these things according to mans freewill. Lets look at this phrase however "according to His will" or similar statements in this book !
Eph 1:9
Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:
Now, In Eternal Love for His Chosen, The Father predestinated all of them to the open adoption and glorious liberty of the Children of God.
Rom 8:21-23
21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
This of course leads us into Paul's third blessing of Grace Adoption. The word is made up of Two greek words:
huios which means Son and the word tithemi which means to set or to place hence to place or set as a Son.
Now this initially occurred with Election in the Son before the world began Eph 1:4 and it is made manifest in time by the providence of predestination, its manifested by their Faith in time and will be manifested by their glorification, which includes the redemption of their bodies as per Rom 8:23.
These truths are proclaimed in the Gospel of God's Grace. Paul said the Colossians heard of these things by the Gospel preached unto them Col 1:4-5
4 Since we heard of your faith in Christ Jesus, and of the love which ye have to all the saints,
5 For the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, whereof ye heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel;
This lets us know, that the Gospel Paul Preached was detailed and extensive, and spoke of Glorious Truths and Eternal Hope and an Inheritance in Heaven 1 Pet 1:3-4
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
This is part of the Gospel Message, though its not mentioned in portions like 1 Cor 15:1-4, yet thats because those portions are not exhaustive of all what entails the Gospel of God's Grace.8
I don't think that you have taken the time to meditate on such verses as John 1:12, Joshua 24:15, and/or Revelation 22:17.
These passages speak unequivocally of man's free will in the matter of salvation.
I would suggest that you memorize them; and then we will see if you can keep your Calvinistic doctrine in light of these verses coming to dwell within your heart.
Psa 119:11, Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.
I don't think that you have taken the time to meditate on such verses as John 1:12, Joshua 24:15, and/or Revelation 22:17.
These passages speak unequivocally of man's free will in the matter of salvation.
I would suggest that you memorize them; and then we will see if you can keep your Calvinistic doctrine in light of these verses coming to dwell within your heart.
Psa 119:11, Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.
Not to speak for BF52, however, none of the texts you've cited support your free will doctrine. They "unequivocally" disprove it.
Joh 1:12: The next verse in Joh 1:13 says: "nor of the will of the flesh", which is all you have prior to regeneration.
Jos 24:15: Two options are given, both options are between pagan gods. No free will spoken except between wrong choices. There is no freedom of the will in that.
Rev 22:17: You have to be able to "hear" and "thirst" in order to come and take the water of life. No free will involved unless you first meet the prerequisites of hearing and thirsting.
All these things should be obvious to anyone that can read the text. Out of curiosity, are you actually being paid to minister here on City-Data? I'm just wondering who would support/pay you when you say the things you do.
I don't think that you have taken the time to meditate on such verses as John 1:12, Joshua 24:15, and/or Revelation 22:17.
These passages speak unequivocally of man's free will in the matter of salvation.
I would suggest that you memorize them; and then we will see if you can keep your Calvinistic doctrine in light of these verses coming to dwell within your heart.
Psa 119:11, Thy word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.
Not to speak for BF52, however, none of the texts you've cited support your free will doctrine. They "unequivocally" disprove it.
Joh 1:12: The next verse in Joh 1:13 says: "nor of the will of the flesh", which is all you have prior to regeneration.
Jos 24:15: Two options are given, both options are between pagan gods. No free will spoken except between wrong choices. There is no freedom of the will in that.
Rev 22:17: You have to be able to "hear" and "thirst" in order to come and take the water of life. No free will involved unless you first meet the prerequisites of hearing and thirsting.
All these things should be obvious to anyone that can read the text. Out of curiosity, are you actually being paid to minister here on City-Data? I'm just wondering who would support/pay you when you say the things you do.
I actually concur with your statements on those verses. Jn 1:12 is clarified by Vs 13, the ones believing/receiving Christ during that time, had been born of God. John in essence writes the same thing here 1 Jn 5:1
5 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
Is born of God here is in the perfect tense, meaning they had been born of God in the past, and believing is an present result or evidence.
However this thread is dedicated to what is the Gospel, what is to be believed !
I actually concur with your statements on those verses. Jn 1:12 is clarified by Vs 13, the ones believing/receiving Christ during that time, had been born of God. John in essence writes the same thing here 1 Jn 5:1
5 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.
Is born of God here is in the perfect tense, meaning they had been born of God in the past, and believing is an present result or evidence.
However this thread is dedicated to what is the Gospel, what is to be believed !
The perfect/indicative is somewhat different from the aorist/indicative and/or present/indicative tense.
What 1Jo 5:1 actually describes is an event ("born of God") that began in the past and has transitioned into the present.
There is no real English equivalent to capture the idea being expressed. The act of believing is a present participle that follows along with the main/primary verb "γεγεννηται", translated as "born". That's actually what it's saying. Some translations will render it "is born of God" (ie: KJV) while others will render it "has been born of God".
What 1Jo 5:1 actually describes is an event ("born of God") that began in the past and has transitioned into the present.
Same thing. The point is the being born of God was before the present believing and the believing is the fruit or evidence of having been born of God, otherwise men cant and wont believe.
Same thing. The point is the being born of God was before the present believing and the believing is the fruit or evidence of having been born of God, otherwise men cant and wont believe.
No, it's not really the same thing. The act of "believing" occurs as a present participle. The participle acts relative to the primary/indicative verb.
The timing of the participle is not taken in an absolute sense, but rather is understood relative to the timing of the main verb event. And the main verbs timing is in the perfect tense.
What that tells us is that "believing" occurred contemporaneously with the completed act of being "born of God" (it was "present" relative to the main verb).
I understand what it is your trying to extract from the text. However, I don't believe this is the text to extract it from. A better text would probably be Joh 5:24.
Not to speak for BF52, however, none of the texts you've cited support your free will doctrine. They "unequivocally" disprove it.
Joh 1:12: The next verse in Joh 1:13 says: "nor of the will of the flesh", which is all you have prior to regeneration.
Forget about the next verse. In verse 12, those who receive Christ are given the right to become the sons of God; and receiving Christ is an act of the will (of the spirit).
Quote:
Jos 24:15: Two options are given, both options are between pagan gods. No free will spoken except between wrong choices. There is no freedom of the will in that.
One of the options is the Lord; who is not a pagan god.
There is free will here to choose between the Lord and pagan gods.
Quote:
Rev 22:17: You have to be able to "hear" and "thirst" in order to come and take the water of life. No free will involved unless you first meet the prerequisites of hearing and thirsting.
But there is free will involved by your own admission here.
I say this to you, @jjGuru:
Quote:
All these things should be obvious to anyone that can read the text. Out of curiosity, are you actually being paid to minister here on City-Data? I'm just wondering who would support/pay you when you say the things you do.
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