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Everytime you read Revelation, you are reading of Rosh Hashanah.
Matthew 24 IS ROSH HASHANAH.
At the same end of the wheat harvest when one completes both the barley and the wheat harvest, HE IS DIVIDED AND THE TARE TAKEN.
THE HOUSE HAS TO BE MADE EMPTY BEFORE YOU CSN OBTAIN A NEW SPIRIT.
You have to race to the day of division.
Hanni you come at things from the ot and i come at them from the nt yet we end up with a lot in common. What you said here matches up with when i talk about the old man nature which is the vessel fitted to destruction.
For out of the same lump a vessel of honor and a vessel of dishonor
Hanni you come at things from the ot and i come at them from the nt yet we end up with a lot in common. What you said here matches up with when i talk about the old man nature which is the vessel fitted to destruction.
For out of the same lump a vessel of honor and a vessel of dishonor
That's the thing, I am coming from the New Testament showing what Jesus said and did at those feasts and how all the parables are built upon temple language that only would be known through the study of all those appointed days that we all should walk in by merely studying what is said and done.
To try and figure out what is in the mind of a Jew hurying as he did to fulfil scripture, all of that scripture he had to follow was in the traditions and what is said and done in temple language and completely Jewish concepts.
So much of the New Testament concerns known legends that not only ever Jew would have known but even the Koran speaks of them.
The Koran says that Issachar is a man with a million books he never read, and this would have been in the mind of every Jew, certainly every Christian.
When Revelation was written a good part of it was written of Zubulun and Issachar because they are the merchant sailors in a boat upon the seas.
Ancient tradition so well known that when the story of Jesus was told about Peter jumping from the Boat to meat Christ upon the shore, EVERY Jew would have understood that Peter jumping from the boat was as Judah jumping from the boat when Issachar and Zebulun had finished their stage of being two merchant poin a boat upon the sea seilling their ways.
Anyone knowing this ancient Jewish concept would known that Peter had just graduated from the camp of Judah and was now about to begin in Dan, Gad and Asher.
Peter's life can be seen as a man progressing from camp to camp.
If Jesus tells you to cast on the other side of the boat, he is telling you to cast on the side of Zebulun or Issachar.
So what is he telling you?
He is telling you that you are as two brothers being saved from the waters and your ministry crosses walls like crossing an ocean, and while you take a job, you take a job that allows you to study day and night.
So you live making money, but it's only to support you becoming a priest, so you are as two brothers in a boat, and one side of the boat is for studying to be a priest, but on Zebulun's side is reality and for making good that his brother becomes a priest to then abandon the boat.
My point is the fact that we are all studying Jews and what ever Jew knew on God's religion and his feasts and traditions and rituals that all teach of Messiah as a man who walked a progressive path through ex h one of these feasts as ALL MEN SHOULD DO..
We are all discussing ver specific appointed days that are appointed to hapoen.
The coming of the Lord Was unleavened bread, it was Passover, it was firstfruit, and it was the rain of Pentecost.
Now we push on to the high prize of also pushing on to our own second season that comes through study.
Jesus came as the spring rain, but the holy days of the spring are nothing.
Now we sit and talk of the appointed days that Jesus must fulfill inside people.
The rain of Pentecost was trivial compared to the rain of Shemini Atzeret, it is a circumcising rain twice as powerful.
This is what Christian's speak of every day, but they dont know the fall hoky days.
Who among you is left, who saw this house [the First Temple] in its former glory? As you see it now, is it not as nothing in your eyes? Now, be strong, Zerubavel, says the L‑rd; and be strong, Joshua the son of Jehozadak the High Priest; and be strong, all the people of the land….I will fill this House with glory, said the L‑rd of Hosts…The glory of this last House shall be greater than the first one, said the L‑rd of Hosts; and in this place I will grant peace (Haggai 2: 3–
Monday is Hashanah Rabbah, you know what happens on Hashanah Rabbah before Shemini Atzeret and Simchat Torah while everyone is laughing?
The New Testament is about these things, but nobody wants to know them.
I think it is more about what has been given and not given
There is a lot of extra things that need effort and training to acquire but if you do not have the natural abilities in those areas you just will not be able to understand them
All humanity has natural limitations, and that applies with the religious things as well
Your regular Christian will believe but not be interested in how/why/when anything has happened or will happen- they are content that they are Christian and will go to heaven
This is what I don't get. My huge extended family is all devoted conservative-type Christians and they seem to feel threatened or offended when I ask questions. There is no one to discuss this stuff with. Including all the missionaries.
Why don't most Christians want to "discuss"? One missionary nephew told me "I don't want to be an apologist"! Well, WTH are you doing then, as a missionary??
My parents were working-class and never went to church or even mentioned religion so I suppose they were neutral about it (a sort of cross between christian and atheist) like many working-class people were.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoorOldSpike
Mate, if there are going to be nonchristians in heaven I swear to God I don't want to go.."..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meerkat2
So being sort of neutral they will be half in heaven and half in hell ... lol
Let's put it this way- they led decent lives so they've got more chance of making it to the pearlies than those who don't, or those of nonchristian religions who've rejected Jesus outright..
This is what I don't get. My huge extended family is all devoted conservative-type Christians and they seem to feel threatened or offended when I ask questions. There is no one to discuss this stuff with. Including all the missionaries.
Why don't most Christians want to "discuss"? One missionary nephew told me "I don't want to be an apologist"! Well, WTH are you doing then, as a missionary??
When I was growing up in the AOG church my mother was in I had that same problem, I have always naturally enjoyed reading and also I think about what I read, I had questions which were fobbed off with you need to believe without question, if you question you will be led astray and go to hell with the other “unbelievers” it didn’t sit right with me so I retained a belief in God, but left organised religion
I think it is fear which keeps some trapped, and others will not have that enquiring “mind” but why you can not speak to them about it is because their part is their denomination and they are under that “head”
I think it has to do with being in a different part by design, as Paul tells us, and we are not to challenge or provoke too far beyond our own border, boundary, calling - each has done and will understand, interpret, translate things differently based on regionality and time
1Co 1:10**Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.
1Co 1:11**For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, that there are contentions among you.
1Co 1:12**Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ.
1Co 1:13**Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?
1Co 1:14**I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
1Co 1:15**Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
1Co 1:16**And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
1Co 1:17**For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
This is what I don't get. My huge extended family is all devoted conservative-type Christians and they seem to feel threatened or offended when I ask questions. There is no one to discuss this stuff with. Including all the missionaries.
Why don't most Christians want to "discuss"? One missionary nephew told me "I don't want to be an apologist"! Well, WTH are you doing then, as a missionary??
I know right, join the club
Most religious people just arent curious, they just dont want to get involved. My whole family is in ministry, and I would find out the most awesome of secrets like holy day traditions that taught of messoah every year for thousands of years and I would get so excited of learning something few preachers would have known.
Truth is, not even the preachers give a damn about learning anything at all and people are even worse, they arent interested in learning secrets of Torah, secrets of Jesus.
No, the three synoptic gospels do not state plainly or otherwise that the rapture is after the Tribulation.
Sure they do.
Matt. 29
Immediately after the tribulation of those days .... then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn and they will see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory and He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
That's the thing, I am coming from the New Testament showing what Jesus said and did at those feasts and how all the parables are built upon temple language that only would be known through the study of all those appointed days that we all should walk in by merely studying what is said and done.
To try and figure out what is in the mind of a Jew hurying as he did to fulfil scripture, all of that scripture he had to follow was in the traditions and what is said and done in temple language and completely Jewish concepts.
So much of the New Testament concerns known legends that not only ever Jew would have known but even the Koran speaks of them.
The Koran says that Issachar is a man with a million books he never read, and this would have been in the mind of every Jew, certainly every Christian.
When Revelation was written a good part of it was written of Zubulun and Issachar because they are the merchant sailors in a boat upon the seas.
Ancient tradition so well known that when the story of Jesus was told about Peter jumping from the Boat to meat Christ upon the shore, EVERY Jew would have understood that Peter jumping from the boat was as Judah jumping from the boat when Issachar and Zebulun had finished their stage of being two merchant poin a boat upon the sea seilling their ways.
Anyone knowing this ancient Jewish concept would known that Peter had just graduated from the camp of Judah and was now about to begin in Dan, Gad and Asher.
Peter's life can be seen as a man progressing from camp to camp.
If Jesus tells you to cast on the other side of the boat, he is telling you to cast on the side of Zebulun or Issachar.
So what is he telling you?
He is telling you that you are as two brothers being saved from the waters and your ministry crosses walls like crossing an ocean, and while you take a job, you take a job that allows you to study day and night.
So you live making money, but it's only to support you becoming a priest, so you are as two brothers in a boat, and one side of the boat is for studying to be a priest, but on Zebulun's side is reality and for making good that his brother becomes a priest to then abandon the boat.
My point is the fact that we are all studying Jews and what ever Jew knew on God's religion and his feasts and traditions and rituals that all teach of Messiah as a man who walked a progressive path through ex h one of these feasts as ALL MEN SHOULD DO..
We are all discussing ver specific appointed days that are appointed to hapoen.
The coming of the Lord Was unleavened bread, it was Passover, it was firstfruit, and it was the rain of Pentecost.
Now we push on to the high prize of also pushing on to our own second season that comes through study.
Jesus came as the spring rain, but the holy days of the spring are nothing.
Now we sit and talk of the appointed days that Jesus must fulfill inside people.
The rain of Pentecost was trivial compared to the rain of Shemini Atzeret, it is a circumcising rain twice as powerful.
This is what Christian's speak of every day, but they dont know the fall hoky days.
Who among you is left, who saw this house [the First Temple] in its former glory? As you see it now, is it not as nothing in your eyes? Now, be strong, Zerubavel, says the L‑rd; and be strong, Joshua the son of Jehozadak the High Priest; and be strong, all the people of the land….I will fill this House with glory, said the L‑rd of Hosts…The glory of this last House shall be greater than the first one, said the L‑rd of Hosts; and in this place I will grant peace (Haggai 2: 3–
Monday is Hashanah Rabbah, you know what happens on Hashanah Rabbah before Shemini Atzeret and Simchat Torah while everyone is laughing?
The New Testament is about these things, but nobody wants to know them.
Its Judausm, but learning Jesus is taboo.
what I meant hanni is you use the OT to explain the NT where I use the NT to explain the OT which is all in shadow and can only be understood via Christ. Now I am not saying we should not study that which is in shadow for we should for it is our school teacher that leads us to Christ. Thus when I read the torah if I do not see Christ and all that He is and has done in it I am not understanding it properly.
No, the three synoptic gospels do not state plainly or otherwise that the rapture is after the Tribulation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Evmur
Sure they do.
Matt. 29
Immediately after the tribulation of those days .... then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn and they will see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory and He will send out His angels with a loud trumpet call and they will gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
So say the other two synoptic gospels
That's not the rapture. Matthew 24:31 refers to those who have become believers during the Tribulation. They will be gathered from all parts of the earth to go into the kingdom.
The rapture is an entirely different event which will have taken place before the Tribulation begins. In post 42 I posted a link which gives the reasons why the rapture is pre-tribulational and cannot be post-tribulational. I'll post it again here.
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